Poorly fabricated machine broken,where do I stand?

[Ley253]

I have seen a lot of '40KPH syndrome'. Haybobs seem to bear the brunt of it, as well as tedders, rakes and slurry stirrers.

Perhaps it should be called "Mig weld syndrome"! The process is known for poor side penetration, and the tests used to, and may still, concentrate on this area, there being two side bends where as stick has one each , root and cap.
With Mig, its easy to produce a perfect looking weld, which can be made to fall off with one tap with a light hammer, and unless the steel is clean, the problem multiplies.

 

[smcapstick]

Perhaps it should be called "Mig weld syndrome"! The process is known for poor side penetration, and the tests used to, and may still, concentrate on this area, there being two side bends where as stick has one each , root and cap.
With Mig, its easy to produce a perfect looking weld, which can be made to fall off with one tap with a light hammer, and unless the steel is clean, the problem multiplies.

If the metal has torn, the weld was probably OK.

 

[Ley253]

If the metal has torn, the weld was probably OK.

But, in this case only half of it has. The vertical is a cold shoulder, just the problem mig is known for, or was, when I did my course.Another problem. A single run is quite brittle, more so with mig, as it is cooled quickly by the gas shield. The correct weld for a stressed area is a three run, the two extra runs heat treat the first( now root) run, as well as adding strength in their own right

 

[Cowcalf]

But, in this case only half of it has. The vertical is a cold shoulder, just the problem mig is known for, or was, when I did my course.Another problem. A single run is quite brittle, more so with mig, as it is cooled quickly by the gas shield. The correct weld for a stressed area is a three run, the two extra runs heat treat the first( now root) run, as well as adding strength in their own right

nothing to do with the mig machine, fault lies with the guy using it , not up to standard. also thickness of metal used looks low although hard to be sure from photo, and lack of bracing

 

[thesilentone]

nothing to do with the mig machine, fault lies with the guy using it , not up to standard. also thickness of metal used looks low although hard to be sure from photo, and lack of bracing

Many years ago they used to be called ' Bonus Welds ' As you rightly say, nothing wrong with the equipment.....

 

[Ley253]

nothing to do with the mig machine, fault lies with the guy using it , not up to standard. also thickness of metal used looks low although hard to be sure from photo, and lack of bracing

mig weld is harder and more brittle than stick, or at best gas.If you dont believe this, weld a bit of clean sheet with all three, and then try to work the welds, as you would on a car body, for example. The mig will crack and probably dent your hammer!. You wouldnt subject a weld to a jet of cold water, and expect it to be of good quality, the shielding gas does just this .
Regarding side wall penetration, an acid etch test reveals that even on welds which have passed their tests, the side wall of the prep is still almost unmarked, and shows as a straight line. With stick, the weld pool has melted the sidewall, and amalgamated with it.

 

[Tim Howard]

I have seen a lot of '40KPH syndrome'. Haybobs seem to bear the brunt of it, as well as tedders, rakes and slurry stirrers.

So manufacturers need to up there game. 40K is not new.
Dealers don't often tell manufacturers when things go wrong so it's down to you.

 

[thesilentone]

So manufacturers need to up there game. 40K is not new.
Dealers don't often tell manufacturers when things go wrong so it's down to you.

You make a good point. One question, is it safe to travel at 40k with a mounted machine ?

 

[GTB]

40k ??? Try 50k!!!

 

[smcapstick]

So manufacturers need to up there game. 40K is not new.
Dealers don't often tell manufacturers when things go wrong so it's down to you.

What if the machine has a 25KPH MAX sticker on it? Who's fault is it, then?

 

[roscoe erf]

What if the machine has a 25KPH MAX sticker on it? Who's fault is it, then?

Yours the sticker wasn't big enough or in the right place

 

[GTB]

You can stick your sticker where the sun don't shine!

 

[smcapstick]

You can stick your sticker where the sun don't shine!

Wales?

 

[Cowcalf]

mig weld is harder and more brittle than stick, or at best gas.If you dont believe this, weld a bit of clean sheet with all three, and then try to work the welds, as you would on a car body, for example. The mig will crack and probably dent your hammer!. You wouldnt subject a weld to a jet of cold water, and expect it to be of good quality, the shielding gas does just this .
Regarding side wall penetration, an acid etch test reveals that even on welds which have passed their tests, the side wall of the prep is still almost unmarked, and shows as a straight line. With stick, the weld pool has melted the sidewall, and amalgamated with it.

how the hell can you compare water and gas put your hand under the cold tap and then at the end of the mig torch, one cools the other has no effect
Spend very day welding metal from 1mm to 80mm plus with stick tig and mig all coded work.

 

[GTB]

Wales?

Yeah no one will read it there either!

 

[buffalo_soldier]

Know nowt about this welding malarkey,

I do know that if you get a decent chap in to fix things it means then that something else on the machine will break.
By the time you have the welder chap in to fix it 6 or 7 times you have paid twice for it, but you have a better machine than you can buy. Ying/yang.

Me...for field work I just get a contractor in, saves sooo much hassle.

 

[thesilentone]

I remember borrowing a gas torch at a local blacksmith to heat tractor axle that had been bent when the trunion pin fell out.

I set the flame as I was taught, and was heating away, when the Blacksmith came over and said ' what you doing lad' or words to that affect

He then set the torch the way HE used it, and passed it to me.........It was like holding a 30 litre/minute pressure washer, the axle was heated in seconds.

You can't beat a man who knows his job................

 

[multi power]

Wales?

Sunny here today !

 

[Yale]

If the metal has torn, the weld was probably OK.

Further inspecting the vertical welds and comment on here has shown how once they pulled away due to no penetration all that was holding it was the hinge effect of the transverse mounting remaining.

This simply waggled until the box fractured due to no support.

 

[smcapstick]

Further inspecting the vertical welds and comment on here has shown how once they pulled away due to no penetration all that was holding it was the hinge effect of the transverse mounting remaining.

This simply waggled until the box fractured due to no support.
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Sorry, I wasn't referring to your machine. It was a follow-up to the 40KPH comment.