Power Harrow Combis, Are they really any good?

[Clive]

Whats the right question then? what should I have done since 2019 harvest... nothing has been in the field.

already answered thiis

What rotation do i need to make no-till work ?

Whet split of spring / winter cropping should i have ?

Is my soil nutrition right for no-till to work ? do i know how to modify my crop nutrition to suit no till crops

is my ph correct ?

is my drainage correct ?

what cover crop opportunity do i have ?

what species should i include in my cover crops?

should i chop my straw ?

Can i get conpost or other Om ?

is my fixed cost structure correct ?

is my agronomist on board / understand notill ?

can i reduced labour ?

can i reduce hp / number of tractors ?

do i grow crops (roots / veg) whete no till is not really possible?

does growing crops unsuitable for notill return more profit than my potential savings from notill ?



after the above had been answered and if no-till looks like it can fit financially you might finally want to start thinking about which drill !

 

[Chae1]

How would you incorporate muck without cultivation?

What makes you think it needs incorporated?

We put tons of muck on grassland. Get great response leaving it on surface.

 

[Hjwise]

actually inverting soil 100% - if you can do this it has a place if you have bad grass weed or fertility issue etc you want to get on top of

other than that can someone explain to me what exactly you think ploughing or mintil cultivation are actually doing ? what do they change about the soil that means it’s suddenly possible for a seed to grow that otherwise would not happen ?

My concern is that on a medium/heavy silty clay loam (that doesn’t readily self structure) after a wet harvest followed by a baler and bale cart, then a muck spreader I don’t fancy the chances of that poor little wheat seed on a significant proportion of the field. However, I do want to give it a try...

 

[Farma Parma]

Cover crops not the answer up here i can assure you that.
Not much window for putting them in & why bother if its going to be a spring crop anyways, either leave the land as stubble or rip it up or winter plough it
as i have done with some & some are left as stubble until mid Feb. HLS rules.
We started harvest here around 20th of July & never stopped until early Oct when the last of my sowing was finished.
working with the weather of course which as usual means we play catch up all the days we loose when its quite wet.
Cut very little wheat under 18% & more nearer 20%
Did cut Oats at 14.5/15% which is very rare.
all laying about 10" off the ground with that 112mm of rain we had in august.
V little rain in Sept meant we got harvest finished & bashed on with sowing.
be it Mintill or Plough its how its done.
all neighbours doing much the same ways.
I had OSR in the ground on the 6th of August & some a week later all v lush now.
No issues with Beetles whatsoever.
followed more in early sept after S Barley its there but much thinner, it will make a crop tho.
Yes deffo less is ploughed every year, even ive started doing that but its more to save time coz of Oct rain looming & some Diesel/Metal etc
Time is such a thing we dont have up here iam afraid.
Local estate running 6m drilling combi even had a couple of days help with contractor to finish there drilling by end of Sept
They knew that 55/60mm of Rain was coming so pulled all the stops out.

 

[bobk]

We plough because most years the top 2 inches are mud

 

[Farma Parma]

another neighbour sowing with 6m vaddy did a 43hr shift over 2 days too beat that same rain....
6m ph was working infront on the ploughed land & 5m rexius press on the cultivated land. its all rowing up quite nicely now & there graft paying off.

 

[FarmyStu]

What makes you think it needs incorporated?

We put tons of muck on grassland. Get great response leaving it on surface.

Lots of people do. But have a read of this lot https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...tural-practice-for-reducing-ammonia-emissions

This is why I referred to the EMLS scheme in a previous post. I can't imagine they'll financially reward people who surface spread and leave it?

 

[bobk]

Lots of people do. But have a read of this lot https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...tural-practice-for-reducing-ammonia-emissions

This is why I referred to the EMLS scheme in a previous post. I can't imagine they'll financially reward people who surface spread and leave it?

You have to incorporate , otherwise the townies are on the case

 

[Lincsman]

already answered thiis

What rotation do i need to make no-till work ?

Whet split of spring / winter cropping should i have ?

Is my soil nutrition right for no-till to work ? do i know how to modify my crop nutrition to suit no till crops

is my ph correct ?

is my drainage correct ?

what cover crop opportunity do i have ?

what species should i include in my cover crops?

should i chop my straw ?

Can i get conpost or other Om ?

is my fixed cost structure correct ?

is my agronomist on board / understand notill ?

can i reduced labour ?

can i reduce hp / number of tractors ?

do i grow crops (roots / veg) whete no till is not really possible?

does growing crops unsuitable for notill return more profit than my potential savings from notill ?



after the above had been answered and if no-till looks like it can fit financially you might finally want to start thinking about which drill !

Or I could just use the equipment I have and guarantee over 4T/ac of wheat in 9 out of 10 years for the sake of a bit of diesel, especially as the blackgrass issue has subsided with later sowing.

Neighbor has had a new plough delivered this week, switching to spring sowing I gather

 

[Two Tone]

I'm assuming that the zero till guys are using nothing but artificial fertilisers? Will the new ELMS scheme perhaps reward people using "natural" sources of N/P/K? Which will them demand a return to cultivations?

No, we (I actually do both zero till and still some plough+ Combi) can still apply FYM to zero till land without any problems whatsoever. What makes you think we can’t?

I haven’t applied any artificial P&K for 20 years!

 

[Two Tone]

You have to incorporate , otherwise the townies are on the case

So what happens on all grassland farms?

 

[bobk]

So what happens on all grassland farms?

Inject it round here or apply just before rainfall .

 

[Two Tone]

Inject it round here or apply just before rainfall .

Not here they don’t. They spread it on the grass and before long it’s all gone.
Just like on our arable No till land.
You cannot inject straw.

 

[ollie989898]

There is no need to 'incorporate' muck- deliberately seeking to bury the stuff does not help anything because it will do it's best work where there is a lot of oxygen to get to it, that will logically be on the soil surface. Used to spread a lot of pig solids on OSR that had just been direct drilled, all had to be done in the dry, however.

 

[FarmyStu]

Inject it round here or apply just before rainfall .

Just before rainfall eh? You might want to read NVZ regs, COGP etc etc. I'm not defending it. Just pointing out what you SHOULD be doing.

 

[FarmyStu]

There is no need to 'incorporate' muck- deliberately seeking to bury the stuff does not help anything because it will do it's best work where there is a lot of oxygen to get to it, that will logically be on the soil surface. Used to spread a lot of pig solids on OSR that had just been direct drilled, all had to be done in the dry, however.

Surface application and leaving is a big no no going in to the future.

Code of Good Agricultural Practice for reducing ammonia emissions

This Code of Good Agricultural Practice (COGAP) provides best practice guidance for reducing ammonia emissions from farms in England.

www.gov.uk

Read this. Don't expect to say "but it works" and expect ELMS money or even the EA to ignore it.

 

[glasshouse]

Surface application and leaving is a big no no going in to the future.

Code of Good Agricultural Practice for reducing ammonia emissions

This Code of Good Agricultural Practice (COGAP) provides best practice guidance for reducing ammonia emissions from farms in England.

www.gov.uk

Read this. Don't expect to say "but it works" and expect ELMS money or even the EA to ignore it.

So you cant put dung on grass?

 

[ollie989898]

Surface application and leaving is a big no no going in to the future.

Code of Good Agricultural Practice for reducing ammonia emissions

This Code of Good Agricultural Practice (COGAP) provides best practice guidance for reducing ammonia emissions from farms in England.

www.gov.uk

Read this. Don't expect to say "but it works" and expect ELMS money or even the EA to ignore it.

Compost the material first.

 

[Renaultman]

Compost the material first.

This is going to be the next big thing, as the value of muck becomes more widely recognised.

 

[Two Tone]

This field was mucked mid August and has been Direct drilled its a Weaving GD, therefore no incorporatio.
The muck was well composted over the summer and spread using a Rolland spreader with broadcasting discs at 8m widths.
You have to look very hard to see any of it now