'Public Money for Public Goods'

[Greythundercloudys]

The Scottish government will need to come up with a safety net sub or bring back headage payments because very few upland hill place could survive without it, what can a 400 acre hilly farm, with mostly rough ground do for the environment different than it is today, hardly any fertilzer, spray etc. Maybe with all this tree planting crazy numbers they will give you 1000an acre to plant the farms in the hills, if no sub then lmb prices will need to rise to make up the difference or farming really is finished in those areas in 10 years if it takes that long.

 

[bluebell]

Dont you think that other countries, austria for example help their farmers in certain areas to farm the land in a traditional way but with the latest machinery and tech, because they value the countryside and without the farmers farming it market forces would soon change that? Why cant we look at that and other countries to get ideas ?

 

[ajcc]

Allotments, uninhibited canine exercise, right to roam, right to camp/holiday where public chooses, sports events, mountain biking, scrambling, 4x4vehicle fun, public hunting access, barbecues whenever, wherever are all possible public goods demands for subsidised farmland.(removal of all fencing?)

 

[Clive]

Dont you think that other countries, austria for example help their farmers in certain areas to farm the land in a traditional way but with the latest machinery and tech, because they value the countryside and without the farmers farming it market forces would soon change that? Why cant we look at that and other countries to get ideas ?

As far as I can tell most other countries and governments make just a big a balls of it all as we do


Grass is always greener though .........................

 

[ollie989898]

Dont you think that other countries, austria for example help their farmers in certain areas to farm the land in a traditional way but with the latest machinery and tech, because they value the countryside and without the farmers farming it market forces would soon change that? Why cant we look at that and other countries to get ideas ?

Sounds like being paid to keep a museum farm going!

 

[Johnnyboxer]

Public money public goods?
So if items bought with aid ,public can access these items ? Angles?

The publics..........Right to Roam?

 

[Still Farming]

The publics..........Right to Roam?

Yes that's their views possibly this way its going.
If Farmers except public money then Public want say or access or benefit from it possibly ?

 

[super4]

A lot of the options mentioned still favour the owners of land.

 

[ollie989898]

It's private property. It does not belong to the public or state. You get involved with public access and take these scheme monies and you won't be able to back out.

As Clive stated, there is an argument for providing what the public want. That being the case, build a car park and charge people money to walk their dogs and bombard an area with muck or get a mini digger and build a mountain bike route. Might as well try you luck with this sort of thing. If it fails or you change your mind you haven't lost anything. It's time the government and all quangos stopped trying to involve themselves in private business.

 

[Johnnyboxer]

It's private property. It does not belong to the public or state. You get involved with public access and take these scheme monies and you won't be able to back out.

As Clive stated, there is an argument for providing what the public want. That being the case, build a car park and charge people money to walk their dogs and bombard an area with muck or get a mini digger and build a mountain bike route. Might as well try you luck with this sort of thing. If it fails or you change your mind you haven't lost anything. It's time the government and all quangos stopped trying to involve themselves in private business.

You don't have to accept the public money from HM Govt, though

The choice is to plough your own furrow, which is what a lot of farmers will now do in 2021 onwards

 

[andybk]

Thinking about this today , i recon there will be tax on chem fertilisers , to discourage usage , may even see something along the lines of going back to haymaking ie allowing grass to seed , rather than the 3 / 4 cuts happening now , saw a piece on tv about how you dont see the moths and grasshoppers you used to in summer prob down to clean grass crops that dont seed anymore . This in their eyes would encourage us back to more pasture based production , (will need a higher feed input of prot in winter though )

 

[primmiemoo]

Thinking about this today , i recon there will be tax on chem fertilisers , to discourage usage , may even see something along the lines of going back to haymaking ie allowing grass to seed , rather than the 3 / 4 cuts happening now , saw a piece on tv about how you dont see the moths and grasshoppers you used to in summer prob down to clean grass crops that dont seed anymore . This in their eyes would encourage us back to more pasture based production , (will need a higher feed input of prot in winter though )

It's not only the "they" who are uneasy about regular cutting, though. It's a heart sink to see sward with the base gone because grazing has gone from the system. There's another parcel of ground under that management near here, and it's slurry and cut x as many as possible - which is taking the heart out of the soil, and contributing to reduced biodiversity. I know there are advisors only doing their jobs, and that a proportion of the generation coming along can only farm by numbers (like painting by numbers, but with less intuition and initiative), but the outcomes will need to be addressed.

Restriction to haymaking only would be too drastic, but a reduction in cuts, with mixed swards (including modern, high yielding varieties) permitted to flower and seed would soon restore benefits to biodiversity.

 

[Bill the Bass]

Don’t kid yourself that you have been paid for the noble profession of growing food for the masses. The cap is a weird payment for owning land. From what I can gather many of the hill farmers could stay in bed all day and not bother with the sheep!

It may seem so from Suffolk, but most hill farms are tenanted and there is usually a requirement to maintain a landlords flock on most farms, if you don’t you will pay delapadations at the end of the tenancy. Add to that most agri-Environment schemes (without which most hill farms wouldn’t survive) have a minimum stocking rate.

How’s the shooting season going or are you in hotter climes in true arable farming tradition?

 

[Hindsight]

It may seem so from Suffolk, but most hill farms are tenanted and there is usually a requirement to maintain a landlords flock on most farms, if you don’t you will pay delapadations at the end of the tenancy. Add to that most agri-Environment schemes (without which most hill farms wouldn’t survive) have a minimum stocking rate.

How’s the shooting season going or are you in hotter climes in true arable farming tradition?

Shooting, skiing, snorkeling. Is I think the image you are looking for! How' the weather in Cumbria!!

 

[lloyd]

It may seem so from Suffolk, but most hill farms are tenanted and there is usually a requirement to maintain a landlords flock on most farms, if you don’t you will pay delapadations at the end of the tenancy. Add to that most agri-Environment schemes (without which most hill farms wouldn’t survive) have a minimum stocking rate.

How’s the shooting season going or are you in hotter climes in true arable farming tradition?

I'm hoping he's putting up external fences so I can
send him some sheep

 

[ajd132]

It may seem so from Suffolk, but most hill farms are tenanted and there is usually a requirement to maintain a landlords flock on most farms, if you don’t you will pay delapadations at the end of the tenancy. Add to that most agri-Environment schemes (without which most hill farms wouldn’t survive) have a minimum stocking rate.

How’s the shooting season going or are you in hotter climes in true arable farming tradition?

I’ve had a baby recently so very little shooting and no holiday!

 

[Still Farming]

Thinking about this today , i recon there will be tax on chem fertilisers , to discourage usage , may even see something along the lines of going back to haymaking ie allowing grass to seed , rather than the 3 / 4 cuts happening now , saw a piece on tv about how you dont see the moths and grasshoppers you used to in summer prob down to clean grass crops that dont seed anymore . This in their eyes would encourage us back to more pasture based production , (will need a higher feed input of prot in winter though )

Lots do already???

 

[andybk]

Lots do already???

yea i know me included , but majority is factory farmed grass , with minimal biodiversity . not that thats wrong , but its what cap has forced us into, cheap highly efficient production with associated loss . be a seismic change to go backwards

 

[Still Farming]

yea i know me included , but majority is factory farmed grass , with minimal biodiversity . not that thats wrong , but its what cap has forced us into, cheap highly efficient production with associated loss . be a size mic change to go backwards

They will have a shock to get into other system when lots are already in it too.

 

[roscoe erf]

its simple really just tell them to stick there money up their arse