Remapping and Diagnostics

Blue.

Member
Livestock Farmer
Hmmm I wonder how many £10's there are between the price of a new 720 and a 724?
£5700 difference,not as bad as you think really and the reason you don't see any 722s kicking about.

Only difference besides stickers is heavy duty bearings in the transmission,won't be £500s worth.

Years ago I did my research on the difference in a 6330 and 6430 deere,besides stickers the only difference was rear hub flange 275mm pcd on a 6430.

One thing I'd agree on is never map the top tractor in the range they're usually top of the tree anyway.
 

Chae1

Member
Location
Aberdeenshire
£5700 difference,not as bad as you think really and the reason you don't see any 722s kicking about.

Only difference besides stickers is heavy duty bearings in the transmission,won't be £500s worth.

Years ago I did my research on the difference in a 6330 and 6430 deere,besides stickers the only difference was rear hub flange 275mm pcd on a 6430.

One thing I'd agree on is never map the top tractor in the range they're usually top of the tree anyway.

Makes me wonder why anybody buys a 720. If you get 20% more power for £5700!
 

Bloders

Member
Location
Ruabon
718,720,722 all identical just different engine software
As said by @eulb just some heavier duty bearings an different fro t axle oil

So which is it. Are they identical apat from engine software, or do they have diffenent bearings and axle components?
,
Sorry, but you cant really post two contradictory posts right next to each other and not expect someone to ask the question?
 

Serup

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Denmark
So which is it. Are they identical apat from engine software, or do they have diffenent bearings and axle components?
,
Sorry, but you cant really post two contradictory posts right next to each other and not expect someone to ask the question?

As i understood that, it was the difference between 720 and 724. So maybe 724 has bigger bearings than the smaller ones.
 

dazza b

Member
Location
Lancaster
So which is it. Are they identical apat from engine software, or do they have diffenent bearings and axle components?
,
Sorry, but you cant really post two contradictory posts right next to each other and not expect someone to ask the question?

Sorry the 718,720,722 are identical it's just the 724 that has differences sorry
 

john432

Member
Location
Carmarthenshire
All I’m saying is don’t be taken in by the seemingly black art of plugging a laptop into a ecu and changing a few settings then being relived of a few hundred £. It’s nothing like as complex as some like to lake out, most of you could probably make the same adjustments given the equipment, software and basic training

Those settings have been determined as optimum by some of the best engine designers in the word with huge budgets and testing behind them - many engines run to destruction getting it right

any amateur who thinks they can do better while maintaining reliability and emissions levels really should sell their secret to the manufacturers - do you honestly think they set out to make their product less efficient than it could be when they compete against other manufacturers ? ......... no chance !


I was tempted,after talking to Alternativedairy to get my tractor remapped... but the other day called in with Gary Rees in Llanybydder, Gary is a well known independent lorry mechanic, 40 plus years experience, carrying on with his dad's buisness. I asked his opinion on these people doing remaps? His reply was it is a very specialist subject done properly by a few tuning companies. Mainly for racing. He has seen so many problems and damaged engines as a result of so called experts, his advice is dont do it. They buy the remapping kits (even off ebay) set themselves up, all talk, plug in and change the settings ,to what a programmer who has probably never set eyes on that model of tractor ,fuel it up ,charge a fee .done!

Being me, I did some quick searching online into remapping tractors. Basically, buy a tablet kind of box and cables.. plug into the tractor... download the ECU info.. then go online to the company in Germany.. they would then download the power upgrade info, connect again to the tractor and download the new map.
Besides overloading the drive train... more fuel and power leads to a hell of a lot more heat in an engine... even melted pistons?

So @Alternativedairy , please tell us of your engineering experience... have you done many years mechanic ing with main dealers etc... or in motorsport?
 
I was tempted,after talking to Alternativedairy to get my tractor remapped... but the other day called in with Gary Rees in Llanybydder, Gary is a well known independent lorry mechanic, 40 plus years experience, carrying on with his dad's buisness. I asked his opinion on these people doing remaps? His reply was it is a very specialist subject done properly by a few tuning companies. Mainly for racing. He has seen so many problems and damaged engines as a result of so called experts, his advice is dont do it. They buy the remapping kits (even off ebay) set themselves up, all talk, plug in and change the settings ,to what a programmer who has probably never set eyes on that model of tractor ,fuel it up ,charge a fee .done!

Being me, I did some quick searching online into remapping tractors. Basically, buy a tablet kind of box and cables.. plug into the tractor... download the ECU info.. then go online to the company in Germany.. they would then download the power upgrade info, connect again to the tractor and download the new map.
Besides overloading the drive train... more fuel and power leads to a hell of a lot more heat in an engine... even melted pistons?

So @Alternativedairy , please tell us of your engineering experience... have you done many years mechanic ing with main dealers etc... or in motorsport?
So take his advice and don't have your tractor done! but to imply that @Alternativedairy doesn't know what he's doing because hasn't work for a main dealer or in motorsport seams strange, have you a axe to grind?
 
Well, in general, you seemed to be quite happy with the facts provided. But, I can elaborate should you wish [emoji4]

When it comes to this sortt of thing there will always be naysayers and people who view it with speculation, and disdain.

The "touch type pad" you refer to is a dimsport new genius, which I have. In total, with all the kit, training and extra software protocols, I've parted with close to £20,000 of my own money.

(aka, no cheap ebay crud)

As for my overall background, I did an engineering degree in college, a 3 year proper engineering apprenticeship with Norton motorcycles, as well as working for agricultural mechanics, and doing my welding training to be a coded welder.

Then onto the farming in general. Split my first tractor at age 10, (albeit a ford's on major) with zero assistance other than a hand to pry the knackered clutch out [emoji23]

Rebuilt my first car from a box of bits at 16, (Ford escort Mark 2 with a pinto engine) which then went on to have xr4x4 running gear.

So I suppose, in general I ha e fulfilled your criteria having experience within motorsports (Norton motorcycles) engineering (apprenticeship and hnc&hnd in agricultural engineering) coded welder, and then spent 6 months of applied remap training via multiple crossovers to better understand what I was aiming to do now.

However, by no means am I perfect at it. Some solutions have taken me 3/4 attempts to get right, and I'm not opposed to asking for help from a more experienced hand when I'm stumped.

When it comes to any form of remapping, it's slowly slowly, catchy monkey. I map. Test. Map. Test. When in the workshop, the tractor never leaves the dyno. When out and about, I never push hard. Always small increments until it physically runs spot on, all exhaust temps, ooil temps and running temps and pressures never exceeding a given tolerance.

But, there is always room required to learn more. Whether I get there or not is another matter entirely [emoji23][emoji23] but every day I spend researching, pushing as hard as possible to be the best I can at what I do. Spending more money on correct tooling, training, software to be able to provide a good service.

Am I perfect? No. Far from it. But I damn well try [emoji12]
 

Serup

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Denmark
I had a tractor remapped by a large (multi national) company. The goal was to get rid of egr problems and improve fuel economy. Specifically lower my total running costs. A promise of no effect on maintenance costs overall, no problems with sot (tier 3 engine) and improved fuel economy got me to try it.
The tractor got a healthy dose of power, which wasn’t the goal. Since then (it was done about a year ago) i have had a list of error codes when the engine was fully loaded, had to switch a railsensor (500£) a turbo and vgt unit (1750£), exhaust manifold and gasket (1000£) and some other bits (500£) and i had to rebuild the front hubs because the sprocket couldn’t take the power (2000£). I have an identical tractor without this mod and it use about 20% less diesel if they both do the same trailerwork.
I know you can’t have it all and that the factory setting is a compromise. Leaving the emission out, it should be possible to do the other things better, but my (little) experience, is that it’s not that easy and it is expensive if it is done wrong. There was no one to help paying for all this, and i paid about 1400£ for the remap. So i will think twice before i consider this again.
Now the tractor is back to stock, things take a little longer, but there is no error codes and no breakdowns.
 

Boomerang

Member
Well, in general, you seemed to be quite happy with the facts provided. But, I can elaborate should you wish [emoji4]

When it comes to this sortt of thing there will always be naysayers and people who view it with speculation, and disdain.

The "touch type pad" you refer to is a dimsport new genius, which I have. In total, with all the kit, training and extra software protocols, I've parted with close to £20,000 of my own money.

(aka, no cheap ebay crud)

As for my overall background, I did an engineering degree in college, a 3 year proper engineering apprenticeship with Norton motorcycles, as well as working for agricultural mechanics, and doing my welding training to be a coded welder.

Then onto the farming in general. Split my first tractor at age 10, (albeit a ford's on major) with zero assistance other than a hand to pry the knackered clutch out [emoji23]

Rebuilt my first car from a box of bits at 16, (Ford escort Mark 2 with a pinto engine) which then went on to have xr4x4 running gear.

So I suppose, in general I ha e fulfilled your criteria having experience within motorsports (Norton motorcycles) engineering (apprenticeship and hnc&hnd in agricultural engineering) coded welder, and then spent 6 months of applied remap training via multiple crossovers to better understand what I was aiming to do now.

However, by no means am I perfect at it. Some solutions have taken me 3/4 attempts to get right, and I'm not opposed to asking for help from a more experienced hand when I'm stumped.

When it comes to any form of remapping, it's slowly slowly, catchy monkey. I map. Test. Map. Test. When in the workshop, the tractor never leaves the dyno. When out and about, I never push hard. Always small increments until it physically runs spot on, all exhaust temps, ooil temps and running temps and pressures never exceeding a given tolerance.

But, there is always room required to learn more. Whether I get there or not is another matter entirely [emoji23][emoji23] but every day I spend researching, pushing as hard as possible to be the best I can at what I do. Spending more money on correct tooling, training, software to be able to provide a good service.

Am I perfect? No. Far from it. But I damn well try [emoji12]
You dont have to explain yourself to anyone, crack on , ignore all the negative bulls**t.
You're to be admired not criticised.
 

SFI - What % were you taking out of production?

  • 0 %

    Votes: 80 42.3%
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    Votes: 66 34.9%
  • 25-50%

    Votes: 30 15.9%
  • 50-75%

    Votes: 3 1.6%
  • 75-100%

    Votes: 3 1.6%
  • 100% I’ve had enough of farming!

    Votes: 7 3.7%

Red Tractor drops launch of green farming scheme amid anger from farmers

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  • 1
As reported in Independent


quote: “Red Tractor has confirmed it is dropping plans to launch its green farming assurance standard in April“

read the TFF thread here: https://thefarmingforum.co.uk/index.php?threads/gfc-was-to-go-ahead-now-not-going-ahead.405234/
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