Roundup Ready Ryegrass

[wanton dwarf]

I would sooner as a farmer thanks , if he thinks ploughing will rot seed he's an idiot

Tell you what

If you grow wheat or barley why don't you try storing your harvested crops underground rather than in the shed - let's a have a good laugh on this one.

Put your money where your mouth is.

 

[neilo]

Do some farmer's actually routinely use it pre-harvest? Unless it is needed due to excessive green weed growth, which would require at least 14 days post spraying before harvest, surely most farmers would not spend the time and money to do so.

Yes. I routinely spray Spring Barley pre-harvest here.
If I didn’t it would still be green in November with damp Autumn nights, late drilling after roots and heavy ground.

 

[Cowmansam]

Australia are just 20 years ahead of us down the direct drilling route that way lots are going over here with glyphosate and direct drilling be the same here

 

[DevonianRedneck]

No. Totally incorrect.

Explanation as I don't think I am
I have sprayed grass seed 4 days after sowing so I know from experience that roundup won't effect seed, and I know from my own experiences that seed ploughed under can survive for at least 50 years

as far as i was aware and have been taught, glyphosate is a systemic weedkiller, so is only effective whilst the plant is activilly growing, so would have no effect on seed as Derrick says. as it travels though the internal system of the plant.

However I stand to be corrected

 

[wanton dwarf]

as far as i was aware and have been taught, glyphosate is a systemic weedkiller, so is only effective whilst the plant is activilly growing, so would have no effect on seed as Derrick says, as the it travels though the internal system of the plant, i was told it actually forces the plant to "grow" faster than it its capable of, so it uses up all its energy and burns itself out so to speak.

However I stand to be corrected

If the seed is green it's killed by roundup.

 

[DevonianRedneck]

If the seed is green it's killed by roundup.

that would make sense, not heard that before, but i guess if its green....it "growing" so to speak.

 

[wanton dwarf]

that would make sense, not heard that before, but i guess if its green....it "growing" so to speak.

I think the outer protective seed coating has to dry before roundup has no effect. - there's also a specific system inside the plant which cuts off supply of sap to the seed at some point.

But having said all that, if roundup exists within vegetation on the surface then that WILL affect and crop growing through that vegetation. Had it myself this year when we sprayed some Oilseed Rape off but didn't cultivate enough.

 

[DevonianRedneck]

I think the outer protective seed coating has to dry before roundup has no effect. - there's also a specific system inside the plant which cuts off supply of sap to the seed at some point.

But having said all that, if roundup exists within vegetation on the surface then that WILL affect and crop growing through that vegetation. Had it myself this year when we sprayed some Oilseed Rape off but didn't cultivate enough.

learn something new everyday......ive not come across that before, though use of glyphosate on our holding is really limited to spot spraying docks.

Thanks for explaining

 

[Derrick Hughes]

I admit I am no expert on Blackgrass , but if I spray grass seed with roundup before it's starts growing within in a week of sowing and a lot of that seed would be on or near the surface, as I sow very shallow there would be no difference to the unsprayed lots , I also know that problem weeds on our farm, Fat Hen Charlock Red Leg,Docks , are still there in many numbers in fields last ploughed in the 80ts with little sign of rotting .

 

[wanton dwarf]

I admit I am no expert on Blackgrass , but if I spray grass seed with roundup before it's starts growing within in a week of sowing and a lot of that seed would be on or near the surface, as I sow very shallow there would be no difference to the unsprayed lots , I also know that problem weeds on our farm, Fat Hen Charlock Red Leg,Docks , are still there in many numbers in fields last ploughed in the 80ts with little sign of rotting .

So even if we were able to kill all weeds there will still be a seed bank - not a very big one but it would be there.

I GUESS in part this is due to birds and animals pooing everywhere. I see in my garden foxes and badgers depositing cherry seeds. I see in the spinny we created 35 years ago from arable land Yew trees. We never planted yew trees. Same with wild flowers, they there but we never planted any.

We of course transmit seeds mechnically with contractors or not as the case may be.

We have a black grass problem brought by a bailer. Was a small strip where the bailer started. It's now over 5 acres but not progressing uphill much.

BTW we used to mintill and only ploughed twice in 30+ years.

We are going to try ploughing every 2 years or so - the 3rd year without, this year, has been not very good for us. Still we live and learn.

 

[Derrick Hughes]

So even if we were able to kill all weeds there will still be a seed bank - not a very big one but it would be there.

I GUESS in part this is due to birds and animals pooing everywhere. I see in my garden foxes and badgers depositing cherry seeds. I see in the spinny we created 35 years ago from arable land Yew trees. We never planted yew trees. Same with wild flowers, they there but we never planted any.

We of course transmit seeds mechnically with contractors or not as the case may be.

We have a black grass problem brought by a bailer. Was a small strip where the bailer started. It's now over 5 acres but not progressing uphill much.

BTW we used to mintill and only ploughed twice in 30+ years.

We are going to try ploughing every 2 years or so - the 3rd year without, this year, has been not very good for us. Still we live and learn.

We grassland farmers are so lucky In this respect , we moan about a few Docks mainly because they look untidy , that's about it , don't have a clue really do we

 

[Bury the Trash]

Australia are just 20 years ahead of us down the direct drilling route that way lots are going over here with glyphosate and direct drilling be the same here

no,30yrs or more actually.
but i think youre right basically, they, like America are further down that DD or very minimal tillage road so its most likely on the cards for here .

 

[Bury the Trash]

Yes. I routinely spray Spring Barley pre-harvest here.
If I didn’t it would still be green in November with damp Autumn nights, late drilling after roots and heavy ground.

If that's the case , seems like spring barley is too late for your area.

 

[Derrick Hughes]

If that's the case , seems like spring barley is too late for your area.

I grew 300 acres of corn including spring barley after roots , 1000 ft LFA

 

[Bury the Trash]

I grew 300 acres of corn including spring barley after roots , 1000 ft LFA

Fair enough, but the point is did you use roundup pre harvest?

 

[wanton dwarf]

We grassland farmers are so lucky In this respect , we moan about a few Docks mainly because they look untidy , that's about it , don't have a clue really do we

If I had a clue I wouldn't have blackgrass.

In reality we have it because we are small farmers and cannot justify buying a bailer.

 

[neilo]

If that's the case , seems like spring barley is too late for your area.

Lol, yes Mr Tropics.

I could, of course, combine it green, go buy a drier, then go buy a few thousand gallons of diesel to dry it. Whilst I was drying, I suppose I could look on forlornly while the green straw got rained on repeatedly before it was fit to bale.

Or, perfectly within label reccs, I could use a low rate of liquid sunshine to help it on it’s way and save all those costs…… and carbon emissions.

As you think it’s obviously too late to grow Spring Barley here, what would be your recommendation for a Spring crop to follow grazed root crops?
Bare in mind I have very limited grain storage, requiring capital investment of I wish to store anything other than feed barley in a heap, and have no use for extra silage?

 

[Bury the Trash]

Lol, yes Mr Tropics.

I could, of course, combine it green, go buy a drier, then go buy a few thousand gallons of diesel to dry it. Whilst I was drying, I suppose I could look on forlornly while the green straw got rained on repeatedly before it was fit to bale.

Or, perfectly within label reccs, I could use a low rate of liquid sunshine to help it on it’s way and save all those costs…… and carbon emissions.

As you think it’s obviously too late to grow Spring Barley here, what would be your recommendation for a Spring crop to follow grazed root crops?
Bare in mind I have very limited grain storage, requiring capital investment of I wish to store anything other than feed barley in a heap, and have no use for extra silage?

ask the Scandinavians ,they were the pioneers of moist grain preservatives. They grow corn on the lower ground but their season isn't relatively long.

as for your spring crop conumdrum , how bout westerwolds or ir and cut a couple of times,or wean onto, thats what our weaners are on atm ,IR and bit of chicory

 

[Derrick Hughes]

Crimping saved me ,would be a none starter without

 

[neilo]

ask the Scandinavians ,they were the pioneers of moist grain preservatives. They grow corn on the lower ground but their season isn't relatively long.

as for your spring crop conumdrum , how bout westerwolds or ir and cut a couple of times,or wean onto, thats what our weaners are on atm ,IR and bit of chicory

90% of my grain is sold. Is there much of a market for grain preserved in this way? Is it there every year, or just when folk are short of grub?

As above, I have little use for silage on my system, so what would I do with those extra costly bales from the Westerwolds? The spring sown Westerwolds I have in a mix with various clovers have shot to head twice so far this summer, so hardly going to be a quality cut in a dry summer.

My stock predominantly graze their feed in the winter, with no more machinery involved than a quad. In doing so they spread their own muck too, ready for the next year’s Spring crops, and increasing soil OM levels as they do so. Feeding bales would require more mechanisation and, if done in the field, more mechanisation to alleviate the soil compaction caused.

Or…. I could just spray 2L/ha of glyphosate pre-harvest and be done with it, all perfectly with label reccs…..