SAME Air Cooled Engines

Cowabunga

Member
Location
Ceredigion,Wales
I was thinking of unit injector pumps situated on the side of the block so need phasing/timing individually but I don't know(y)

Unlike the later 1000 series engines, these Pantherised engines have one or two banks of two, three or four units pumps with the governor at the timing gear end at the front. Six cylinder ones have two units of three pumps each bolted down to the block above the camshaft. Not sure whether shims under these alter the timing as much as the stroke of the pistons inside. Dial gauges are involved [shudder :nailbiting:]
There's a long rack from the governor at the front to the stop lever at the back of the block if I remember correctly.

The 1000 series have the governor at the back of the engine, whether the mechanical type or electronically controlled [on Antares (apart from A100 which was really an intercooler Explorer), Silver, Titan and those ones with the Deutz cab whose name I forget.]

The principle of what I say above is correct but excuse me if some details are inaccurate. Its been a very long time since I even thought about these models. I mean decades of time has passed.
 
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Cowabunga

Member
Location
Ceredigion,Wales
That is a 1000 series water-cooled variant used by Hurlimann, Lambo and Titan 190 plus tier two smaller Titans and on down the range as emission regulations tightened and the Silver tractors of course. The 1000 series were made both ways apart from the 190hp which was only water cooled, because otherwise I think it would melt. The air cooled engines are far more economical and reliable but they can run very hot under load. My Titan combustion gets obviously much hotter than a water cooled engine when run at full power, full speed on a hot day for hours on end. They eventually had to end air cooled engine production in more powerful variants due to them being unable to meet emission regulations. They emit about 15gms/kW/h NOx or more when at full load compared to the next stage for new engines today, tier 4 final or stage 4, of 0.4gms/kW/h. That's nearly 40 times the NOx emissions compared to today's engines. In other words 40 160hp tractors new today emit only as much NOx as one Titan 160.

Of note on the 1000 series seen above is that individual pumps are equally spaced along the camshaft with identical short high pressure pipes from them almost straight up to the injectors with the minimum of complication.
 
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Cowabunga

Member
Location
Ceredigion,Wales
Would you leave it idling for the cool down, so you keep the air flowing, or shut it off?
Yes, it is very important to let the air cooled engines cool a while before shutting down after running at full load a while. Its good practice with any turbo engine and I'm sure we all do it anyway, but an air cooled engine has nothing to take the heat away once the engine has stopped. A fluid cooled engine has coolant in the head around the injector and valves which can turn into superheated steam under extreme conditions after shut-down. This is extremely efficient at cooling localised areas and prevents engine damage through metal distortion and metallurgical changes/cracking.
So, do your air cooled engine a favour and cool it down before shut-down. I often didn't shut the engine of the 160 down for lunch or pee breaks for this reason and to allow it to go straight back to work at full load afterwards. Let it idle at around 1000 rpm for up to 45minutes or if I was with the tractor I'd shut down after five minutes and restart a minute before commencing work again.

It has been off the forager now since 2004, so its not such an issue since. It did 11 years of running flat out on the forager for weeks on end and still works moderately hard periodically these days, but nothing like those days.
 
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Unlike the later 1000 series engines, these Pantherised engines have one or two banks of two, three or four units pumps with the governor at the timing gear end at the front. Six cylinder ones have two units of three pumps each bolted down to the block above the camshaft. Not sure whether shims under these alter the timing as much as the stroke of the pistons inside. Dial gauges are involved [shudder :nailbiting:]
There's a long rack from the governor at the front to the stop lever at the back of the block if I remember correctly.

The 1000 series have the governor at the back of the engine, whether the mechanical type or electronically controlled [on Antares (apart from A100 which was really an intercooler Explorer), Silver, Titan and those ones with the Deutz cab whose name I forget.]

The principle of what I say above is correct but excuse me if some details are inaccurate. Its been a very long time since I even thought about these models. I mean decades of time has passed.
Yes the shims alter the timing, more shims retards and less advance, it will affect the stroke but it's not important as it's the effective pumping stroke that determines fuel quantities injected. It was usually the much bigger diesels that used this system mainly due to the size of pumping elements so interesting to see it on a tractor.
 

joe soapy

Member
Location
devon
the deutz and same were legendary tractors in their day. Same was the first with proper front axel braking , with the right support they would have given JD a good run for their monet
 

Mur Huwcun

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
North West Wales
N
could you explain the timing in the first paragraph. Just trying to get it straight

Never really did one myself but IIRC the camshaft and crank don’t have matching timing marks. The cam needs to be set using a DTI gauge to get no1 lobe in correct position relative to crank position etc then pop the idler gear in. Timing of the cam is imperative to the setup of the injection pumps. I also seem to remember that front axle and sump has to come off to access oil pump!!!
 

Mukada

Member
Arable Farmer
The early SAME Tiger /Panther/Centurion etc are quiet a decent tractor but can have gearbox trouble mainly on the HI /lo spliter.The Buffalo seemed the worse of the bunch .I recall the fuel side was a camshaft driven system with each injector having its own little pump but dont quote me on that :)Never had any bother with fuel system where i worked .You had to blow the cylinder heads off with air line regular but not much mither otherwise :)
My same explorer 80 special is producing a lot of smoke through the breather after changing the piston rings what could be the reason
 

Cowabunga

Member
Location
Ceredigion,Wales
My same explorer 80 special is producing a lot of smoke through the breather after changing the piston rings what could be the reason
Were the piston rings fitted correctly with the gaps in the correct places? Were the bores and pistons measured and within tolerance? Were the bores honed? Is the injector timing correct? Have the new rings been run-in adequately?
 

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As reported in Independent


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