Sheep dairy

[andybk]

You can’t use a lot of them on lactating ewes or for their lifetime from what I remember, hence why most are indoor only systems. Plus most dairy breeds are known for very poor feet, not going to make that any better with Dorset and Dorpers

I heard Dorpers had worse feet than Dorsets , main reason they didnt really take off here , great in arid climates , Friend of mine imported some good footed ones from SA at great expense , the UK society refused to let them be registered , now sold the lot , said if society were that backward thinking best out of it

 

[M-J-G]

I used to look after a flock where we used to lamb Dorset and Dorset × ewes 3 times in 2 years and it was tough going for the ewes, granted they were weaning around 180% or so.

I'd be interested to hear how mating ewes 2 months after lambing worked out.
Plenty of the Dorset ewes cycled whilst rearing lambs, but we never mated any then. I don't recall seeing any Dorset x EF or Dorset × Lacaune ewes cycling at 2 months, so I'm not sure how ¾ non seasonal ewe would perform.

 

[unlacedgecko]

You can’t use a lot of them on lactating ewes or for their lifetime from what I remember, hence why most are indoor only systems. Plus most dairy breeds are known for very poor feet, not going to make that any better with Dorset and Dorpers

I'm not going to be milking these sheep. They'll only be lactating for 16-22 weeks a year.

 

[unlacedgecko]

I heard Dorpers had worse feet than Dorsets , main reason they didnt really take off here , great in arid climates , Friend of mine imported some good footed ones from SA at great expense , the UK society refused to let them be registered , now sold the lot , said if society were that backward thinking best out of it

I'd have kept the sheep and f**ked off the society. These breed societies and clubs only seem to exist as an ego massage for the top echelon.

 

[unlacedgecko]

I used to look after a flock where we used to lamb Dorset and Dorset × ewes 3 times in 2 years and it was tough going for the ewes, granted they were weaning around 180% or so.

I'd be interested to hear how mating ewes 2 months after lambing worked out.
Plenty of the Dorset ewes cycled whilst rearing lambs, but we never mated any then. I don't recall seeing ant Dorset x EF or Dorset × Lacaune ewes cycling at 2 months, so I'm not sure how ¾ non seasonal ewe would perform.

Dorper are aseasonal, like Dorsets. Most breeds of milk sheep are as well.

I'm only using the milk sheep x as a low capital entry into aseasonal genetics.

 

[M-J-G]

I heard Dorpers had worse feet than Dorsets , main reason they didnt really take off here , great in arid climates , Friend of mine imported some good footed ones from SA at great expense , the UK society refused to let them be registered , now sold the lot , said if society were that backward thinking best out of it

Imported from SA, how did they go about that?
Embryos and semen via Australia?

 

[andybk]

Imported from SA, how did they go about that?
Embryos and semen via Australia?

something like that he was an acclaimed vet , did a lot with horses (posh horses ) .

 

[andybk]

I'd have kept the sheep and f**ked off the society. These breed societies and clubs only seem to exist as an ego massage for the top echelon.

He loved the showing part , its all about prestige , few sheep , top dollar

 

[M-J-G]

something like that he was an acclaimed vet , did a lot with horses (posh horses ) .

Pretty sure with countries where FMD is endemic you have to export stock to somewhere like Oz where they are prepared to keep them in quarantine and collect semen and embryos that are then exported to the UK.
It's quite a longwinded method

I don't know about equine

 

[Al R]

I'm not going to be milking these sheep. They'll only be lactating for 16-22 weeks a year.

To rear lambs then for meat? Is that the objective but you want a seasonal with plenty of size and shape to them then?

 

[Al R]

Yes October lambs on cover crops.

For accelerated lambing a weaning percentage of 130% per lambing is more realistic. This would give an annualised weaning percentage of 260%.

With my once a year Shetland based composite flock I'm not looking for each ewe to rear triplets, only that those that do have triples can rear them off grazed forage alone.

Massive difference in size between a Shitland and a Dorper mind.
Dorper 3x the weight?

 

[ImLost]

Yes October lambs on cover crops.

For accelerated lambing a weaning percentage of 130% per lambing is more realistic. This would give an annualised weaning percentage of 260%.

With my once a year Shetland based composite flock I'm not looking for each ewe to rear triplets, only that those that do have triples can rear them off grazed forage alone.

Hmm.... The maths doesn't sit right with me if I was putting that effort into 2x yearly lambing. Assuming outdoor lambing? Maybe 230% is realistic if it's all outdoor lambing and you have a harsh winter.
I would have thought it would be better to aim for higher weaning % off of once a year lambing, so breeding for more ewes that can and will lamb/rear 3 lambs (so aiming for 300% once a year)
And then I guess you could run a ram with the ewes that can do the above, for a really short burst for autumn lambing, and any that do manage it would be serious keepers. The obvious thing is condition, which if you can breed a ewe that does all of the above and keeps a reasonable BCS, you then have a nucleus flock from which to breed seriously high performing sheep to put back over cheaper ewes and half decent replacements you might keep, aiming for continuous improvement year on year within the nucleus flock, which should then filter back down into the main flock if you are keeping replacements.

No idea if any of that makes sense at all.. I belive it's called thinking out loud

Would be interested to hear your thoughts behind lambing % and 2x yearly lambing though.

 

[Boso]

Have tried 2x a year and 3x in two years. At that time I did not have acces to proper winter feed (turnips or something else) just crappy old pp which has had no fert or muck in years.
With charmoise it works, however they are not fertile enough to make it worthwile. Lambing them twice a year gets you two lambs. You would need to add fec b or fdg19 or whatever special fertility gene to them and keep the year round breeding to make it feasable.

Have tried it as well with dairy genes (lacaune and barbados blackbelly). Fertility is great however bcs on forage available to me at that time was crap. They needed aditional feeding.

Ram would go in after lambing. Getting them pregnant again was not the problem, getting them fit and up to a proper bcs to lamb and provide sufficient milk was.

My thoughts after trying for a few years are that in my context at the time the dairy route was no good. In my context I would need a ewe that can and will get fatter more easily to keep a good bcs.
A dorper x charmoise ( with maybe fec b texel) might be something I'd try.

 

[Mc115reed]

Hmm.... The maths doesn't sit right with me if I was putting that effort into 2x yearly lambing. Assuming outdoor lambing? Maybe 230% is realistic if it's all outdoor lambing and you have a harsh winter.
I would have thought it would be better to aim for higher weaning % off of once a year lambing, so breeding for more ewes that can and will lamb/rear 3 lambs (so aiming for 300% once a year)
And then I guess you could run a ram with the ewes that can do the above, for a really short burst for autumn lambing, and any that do manage it would be serious keepers. The obvious thing is condition, which if you can breed a ewe that does all of the above and keeps a reasonable BCS, you then have a nucleus flock from which to breed seriously high performing sheep to put back over cheaper ewes and half decent replacements you might keep, aiming for continuous improvement year on year within the nucleus flock, which should then filter back down into the main flock if you are keeping replacements.

No idea if any of that makes sense at all.. I belive it's called thinking out loud

Would be interested to hear your thoughts behind lambing % and 2x yearly lambing though.

Imlost

 

[ImLost]

Imlost

In the words of many a teacher from my (few) days at school, "now, which bit is it that you don't understand?" (followed by reading the question V E E E E R Y slowly, as if I was going to understand it any better that way)

 

[Mc115reed]

In the words of many a teacher from my (few) days at school, "now, which bit is it that you don't understand?" (followed by reading the question V E E E E R Y slowly, as if I was going to understand it any better that way)

You lost me at with charamoise it works… but it doesn’t work

 

[ImLost]

You lost me at with charamoise it works… but it doesn’t work

Charamoise what?! You getting muddled up with Boso's post??

 

[Al R]

Charamoise what?! You getting muddled up with Boso's post??

Looks like @Mc115reed is really lost now

 

[Boso]

You lost me at with charamoise it works… but it doesn’t work

Btw, what's a charamoise?

 

[Al R]

Btw, what's a charamoise?

Cross of a Charalaise and a charmoise