Sheep dog training enterprise?

[taff]

I run about 450ewes and am increasing numbers probably to around 550 along with working on the small family beef farm I have two dogs at the moment one 8year old and one that's 4 iam told they are good dogs by another trainer and I am fairly confident I can train a good flock dog. The same trainer that said they are good dogs says iam nuts not to buy young untrained dogs and sell them on for around £1500 as a way of keeping myself in dogs and make some extra cash i might be able to do 2 or three a year. I don't like the idea of selling dogs at sales as basically iam to soft and would like to be able to vet people a bit. So the main questions are: Do people really buy flock dogs for £1500 ? If anyone else is doing this are you confident you are selling to good homes if so how? Is this a nuts idea am I better just training dogs for myself ?? Ideas please

 

[sherg]

I run about 450ewes and am increasing numbers probably to around 550 along with working on the small family beef farm I have two dogs at the moment one 8year old and one that's 4 iam told they are good dogs by another trainer and I am fairly confident I can train a good flock dog. The same trainer that said they are good dogs says iam nuts not to buy young untrained dogs and sell them on for around £1500 as a way of keeping myself in dogs and make some extra cash i might be able to do 2 or three a year. I don't like the idea of selling dogs at sales as basically iam to soft and would like to be able to vet people a bit. So the main questions are: Do people really buy flock dogs for £1500 ? If anyone else is doing this are you confident you are selling to good homes if so how? Is this a nuts idea am I better just training dogs for myself ?? Ideas please

People buy flock dogs for more than £1500, the best thing you can do is go to the sales and have a look at what good stuff makes and what you reckon you could buy dogs with a bit of potential for, you cant really vet people in an auction but if you were to pay 1500+ on a dog would you mistreat it? you don't have to sell through the sales though plenty are sold privately you could even put them on the classifieds on here with a youtube clip plenty do it before the sales

 

[taff]

I bought my last dog at a sale for £200 and although I rushed his training because I was down a dog I wouldn't take £1800 for him now and he's pritty plain. I am going to a sale on Wednesday where there are alot if young dogs so will see need one myself anyway even though I have just ordered a kelpi puppy but i think that might be a different beast! Iam alarmed at how fast my old dog is ageing and think if I could keep buying the odd one or two and training them on then I might save myself from being without a decent pack! What kind of people are buying these dogs and what kind of things are people looking for iam sure ill learn more on Wednesday but the opinions and experience's of the tff collective are always valued!

 

[Downton_shep]

You might be surprised at the price of a good young dog! Untrained dogs can sell for over a grand!
I would personally buy private if you can and not from a dealer. If a dealer is selling it it's probably no good. I was given a big ugly dog at Christmas that was to much as a pet for someone at 12 months old. Was gonna put sides on him and sell him but If he carries on like he's going he'll be my main dog by the end of the year.
I try and train 1 or 2 a year keeping the best for myself if there good enough then sell the older dogs on. Once they get past to five there value soon drops. It's ok as long as you don't get to attached them!

 

[sherg]

Is there a catalogue online for it taff?

 

[sean m]

Is there a catalogue online for it taff?

yep clee tomkins etc,saw it myself anybody know why that one lady has so many young dogs about,although fair play they all looked well bred

 

[Tim W]

I run about 450ewes and am increasing numbers probably to around 550 along with working on the small family beef farm I have two dogs at the moment one 8year old and one that's 4 iam told they are good dogs by another trainer and I am fairly confident I can train a good flock dog. The same trainer that said they are good dogs says iam nuts not to buy young untrained dogs and sell them on for around £1500 as a way of keeping myself in dogs and make some extra cash i might be able to do 2 or three a year. I don't like the idea of selling dogs at sales as basically iam to soft and would like to be able to vet people a bit. So the main questions are: Do people really buy flock dogs for £1500 ? If anyone else is doing this are you confident you are selling to good homes if so how? Is this a nuts idea am I better just training dogs for myself ?? Ideas please

There are plenty of folk about who will pay for a trained/part trained dog. They are usually busy , have a decent sized flock & know that they are useless at dog training (I know this because I am one of these people)
Dogs seem to come in 2 types ---
1) £400 (roughly) for a dog that has been started & will go round a mob of sheep, move them and has some recall
2) £1200+ for a dog that knows his directions and has a bit more finesse

Both are worth every penny in my humble opinion

 

[Six Dogs]

The sale on Wednesday on previous experience will be a good one to buy at a lot of inexperienced dogs well looked after but if I had 100 dogs think several would be inexperienced
I have been down Taff proposal a couple of points nobody sells a good young dog,there will be issues some minor some major at least be honest with yourself and can you a spot the issue and b correct it.
I would suggest the other issue is not everyone can handle a dog they may think they can or may think it is nothing a piece of pipe won't cure but having run dog training classes the problem most of the time was the handler not the dog
If I was going back down this route I would only do it with my pups from the start,I must get 20 phone calls a year wanting a flock dog yes now most of them will pay good money too but where we are now I can't keep loads more dogs than I have now plus 1600 ewes keeps me busy,so not saying don't do it but be aware

 

[taff]

Is there a catalogue online for it taff?

as Sean m said. She has a sale every other year not all the dogs are hers but she still has more than most people have in there lifetime for sale suppose if you like trailing and have the set up to keep alot of dogs maybe keeping all ur puppies and having a big sale of 30 plus of different levels every other year is one way of picking the best from alot of dog for yourself! Not my cup of tea get to attached not sure I can sell one dog yet. I haven't nor plan on doing much trailing would this be a problem to people looking to buy my dogs??

 

[Six Dogs]

There are plenty of folk about who will pay for a trained/part trained dog. They are usually busy , have a decent sized flock & know that they are useless at dog training (I know this because I am one of these people)
Dogs seem to come in 2 types ---
1) £400 (roughly) for a dog that has been started & will go round a mob of sheep, move them and has some recall
2) £1200+ for a dog that knows his directions and has a bit more finesse

Both are worth every penny in my humble opinion

I am sheepdog genetics vendor far too cheap for such genetics mate[emoji6]

 

[sherg]

Anyone got a link to the catalogue I cant find it

 

[Downton_shep]

http://www.ctf-uk.com/content/Sennybridge/DOGCAT Bromsberrow Heath 2015.pdf

 

[CopperBeech]

http://www.ctf-uk.com/content/Sennybridge/DOGCAT Bromsberrow Heath 2015.pdf

Was at the last one. Some of Angies dogs were embarrassing!

 

[Downton_shep]

http://www.ctf-uk.com/content/Sennybridge/DOGCAT Bromsberrow Heath 2015.pdf

Was at the last one. Some of Angies dogs were embarrassing!

Did they sell?

 

[taff]

The one I bought was actually attached to the sheep when the hammer went down but don't mind that least he had it in him have to agree with copperbeech tho there were some that wouldn't even look at the sheep odd to put them in a sale along with some very good dogs! I wouldn't sell my worst lambs on the same day my best in front of a crowd of my peers

 

[Castle Farm]

Chap l know gets dogs from Border Collie rescue, shouts at them a lot and sells them for silly money.

 

[sherg]

Cheers all for the link

 

[RedMerle]

I've sat all day and watched the sheepdog sales, sure there have been some exceptional dogs sold. But there were a lot of dogs unsold.

I'm not sure how many people are really making their millions at it. And I have to query how much profit you are really making on a 400 quid dog?!

 

[Six Dogs]

Unfortunately I can't make Wednesday but be good to hear about prices

 

[Dry Rot]

Not sheep dogs but gundogs. I agree with the poster who said it would be finding good owners that's the problem. Kindness is not the same thing as being a good handler. Run training classes too? Also the comment that no one will sell a good young dog. The young dogs going through sales may have issues and a few duds will soon dent the profit margin. I found it was cheaper and better to breed my own, but then there are problems of socialisation. A clever man (gundogs again) used to sell pups to pet homes but with the offer to buy them back at the same price if it didn't work out. Invariably he'd get back a pup ready to train that was nicely socialised and had been reared at someone else's expense because what he bred were super hyper -- but he had a rather ruthless selection system that wouldn't be accepted today. So, if the OP has kids who are responsible and do what they are told, probably better to breed and train your own. That way you know what you are dealing with. A dog that has been properly brought up can be trained very quickly. It is sorting out the problems that never should have arisen in the first place that takes the time.