Small lambs explain why this is happening

[Crashem8340]

we are nearly at the end of lambing 600 lowland ewes and this year we have had quite a few tiny little lambs born usually alive but only the size of kittens some big fit ewes just have 1 lamb other ewes may have 1 normal sized lamb and 1 tiny lamb just wondering if anyone out there could offer some advice on what may be causing this and what we could do to rectify this in the future

 

[GTB]

1 Lack of nutrition?
2 some sort of abortion like to toxo?

 

[Nithsdale]

I was saying in another thread, that I had quite a few thin ewes having very big singles..

Someone (can't remember who now) said a thin ewe will have larger intake requirements in late pregnancy meaning a larger appetite making the unborn lamb bigger whilst the ewe doesn't put on much condition...

If that's true, then the opposite must can happen with a very fit ewe resulting in smaller lambs?

Only possible answer I can give.

 

[Gulli]

I was saying in another thread, that I had quite a few thin ewes having very big singles..

Someone (can't remember who now) said a thin ewe will have larger intake requirements in late pregnancy meaning a larger appetite making the unborn lamb bigger whilst the ewe doesn't put on much condition...

If that's true, then the opposite must can happen with a very fit ewe resulting in smaller lambs?

Only possible answer I can give.

I'm sure I read somewhere that lamb size is determined in mid pregnancy. Nutrition at the end is what makes ewes lay down fat causing lambing problems.

Having just typed that out it seems a bit counter intuitive so I'll have to look it up

 

[Northeastfarmer]

As @GTB says I’d say either nutrition is not right or toxo

 

[Woolless]

I'm sure I read somewhere that lamb size is determined in mid pregnancy. Nutrition at the end is what makes ewes lay down fat causing lambing problems.

Having just typed that out it seems a bit counter intuitive so I'll have to look it up

I think NZ research has suggested that lamb size is decided very early in pregnancy but I would agree what I have experienced is that frequency of lambing difficulties can be influenced very late on. Not exactly the same thing, of course.

@Nithsdale Farmer, I will take the credit for enlightening you with that pearl of wisdom about lean ewes (which I in turn got from AHDB's 'Feeding the Ewe').

 

[Gulli]

I think NZ research has suggested that lamb size is decided very early in pregnancy but I would agree what I have experienced is that frequency of lambing difficulties can be influenced very late on. Not exactly the same thing, of course.

@Nithsdale Farmer, I will take the credit for enlightening you with that pearl of wisdom about lean ewes (which I in turn got from AHDB's 'Feeding the Ewe').

Glad to hear that sleep deprivation isn't actually driving me mad

 

[romneymarsh]

we are nearly at the end of lambing 600 lowland ewes and this year we have had quite a few tiny little lambs born usually alive but only the size of kittens some big fit ewes just have 1 lamb other ewes may have 1 normal sized lamb and 1 tiny lamb just wondering if anyone out there could offer some advice on what may be causing this and what we could do to rectify this in the future

Are these lambs from Ewes new to your farm ? Ticks ?

 

[Frank-the-Wool]

Are these lambs from Ewes new to your farm ? Ticks ?

Highly likely @romneymarsh is correct.
We had this problem last year with one batch of bought in sheep. This year we have treated all our sheep with a Synthetic Pyrethroid as we were no only getting Lice but high levels of Ticks. Doing them pre lambing eliminates the Ticks on the lambs as well.

 

[tepapa]

Three things (I can think) that will influence size of lambs.
1) the size of the placenta is Influenced by nutrition in mid pregnancy. Underfed ewes (using body condition) will divert energy into the placenta to ensure lamb survival. The bigger the placenta the more cotyledons and nutrition available to the lamb in late pregnancy.
Also why you get tiny runts of lambs from fattening ewe hoggs which you would think have been fed well, but in fact too well.
2) number of cotyledons (the buttons on the placenta) attached to the lamb. the greater number the more buttons the more points for feed transfer to the lamb. Handling/stress early in pregnancy will effect the attachment of the placenta to embryo. That's why you will get tiny lambs along side a normal size lamb.
3) nutrition in final stage of pregnancy. But that will effect both lambs not just one twin.

 

[Crashem8340]

Thanks for all the replies ,I can’t see it being nutrition all sheep have had the same treatment during pregnancy going on winter grazing and unlimited mineral blocks they all had corn 6 weeks pre lambing and were provided with whatever they needed.I was wondering if would be more abortion related ?

 

[GTB]

Thanks for all the replies ,I can’t see it being nutrition all sheep have had the same treatment during pregnancy going on winter grazing and unlimited mineral blocks they all had corn 6 weeks pre lambing and were provided with whatever they needed.I was wondering if would be more abortion related ?

Certainly could be.

 

[tepapa]

Thanks for all the replies ,I can’t see it being nutrition all sheep have had the same treatment during pregnancy going on winter grazing and unlimited mineral blocks they all had corn 6 weeks pre lambing and were provided with whatever they needed.I was wondering if would be more abortion related ?

Consider Nutrition to the lamb through the placenta not necessarily nutrition to the ewe herself.

 

[Boydvalley]

Thanks for all the replies ,I can’t see it being nutrition all sheep have had the same treatment during pregnancy going on winter grazing and unlimited mineral blocks they all had corn 6 weeks pre lambing and were provided with whatever they needed.I was wondering if would be more abortion related ?

Almost certainly abortion related. We used to suffer with small lambs and occasional abortions but nothing came back on lab tests. Eventually in our case it was confirmed as Enzo. Vaccinated and solved the problem. Used to hate the start of lambing now we go straight into good large lambs. We keep first lambers separate from when they go to the ram because of a camphlybactor outbreak and had 5 or 6 of these scanned as twins with only one lamb but none in the main flock which I can't explain unless the scanner got tired/cold doing the second group and they were never there in the first place!

 

[Nithsdale]

I think NZ research has suggested that lamb size is decided very early in pregnancy but I would agree what I have experienced is that frequency of lambing difficulties can be influenced very late on. Not exactly the same thing, of course.

@Nithsdale Farmer, I will take the credit for enlightening you with that pearl of wisdom about lean ewes (which I in turn got from AHDB's 'Feeding the Ewe').

Iv definitely seen too much grass cause problems in hoggs. One of the last year's I lambed my hoggs I had no end of hung/stuck lambs... i was advised to shift them off of decent grass into the barest field I had by an old 'herd - almost like turning a tap off, the problems stopped.


I do mind it was you who said it, on my TexX thread, now

 

[Woolless]

Iv definitely seen too much grass cause problems in hoggs. One of the last year's I lambed my hoggs I had no end of hung/stuck lambs... i was advised to shift them off of decent grass into the barest field I had by an old 'herd - almost like turning a tap off, the problems stopped.


I do mind it was you who said it, on my TexX thread, now

Regarding hoggs with big lambs, a friend of mine was having real bother. Brought them into the shed on hay only with the same immediate effect.

 

[romneymarsh]

@Crashem8340 Do you have increasing numbers of ticks on farm and do you treat ewes for them ? Your location will also have a bearing on tick activity. Small lambs is a symptom of tick bourne fever when niave sheep are introduced to a previously unincountered tick population.

 

[dunk999]

Almost certainly abortion related. We used to suffer with small lambs and occasional abortions but nothing came back on lab tests. Eventually in our case it was confirmed as Enzo. Vaccinated and solved the problem. Used to hate the start of lambing now we go straight into good large lambs. We keep first lambers separate from when they go to the ram because of a camphlybactor outbreak and had 5 or 6 of these scanned as twins with only one lamb but none in the main flock which I can't explain unless the scanner got tired/cold doing the second group and they were never there in the first place!

We had a horrible Enzo outbreak last year dead and small weak lambs, have subsequently vaccinated entire flock last autumn which has remarkedly reduced losses however still got quite a few small weak lambs at beginning of lambing around week before due date. Is this the Enzo phasing out should I look forward to next year?

 

[Ysgythan]

As above. Not mentioned though:

• Border Disease
• Scarring from previous tough lambing/Caesars

 

[Spartacus]

If it is toxo then there would be mummified lambs as well as smaller lambs.