Small Scale Agri-Enterprise Question

[toquark]

Hi folks,

For a number of years the wife and I have run a small flock of TexX ewes on ground nearby we rented very cheaply from the estate I work for. We've finally managed to get a small place of our own of around 20ac, pretty reasonable quality, dry ground. We had to stretch ourselves to get it and unfortunately this meant the sheep had to go in the spring to help cover the cost of purchase, so we're starting with a blank canvass. Ultimately we'd like to get a small pedigree flock, however given the cost of the purchase and general expense of moving house etc. we're not going to be in a position to start investing in a new pedigree flock for at least a year or two. So I'm trying to decide what to do with the 20ac to maximise return in the meantime, but also keep things as simple as possible. The best plan I've come up with so far is...

Buy in c.40-50 cast hill ewes in October, sell in March. We're in lowland SW Scotland and the grass usually grows at least 10 months of the year.
Rent ground to friend (and neighbour) from April-October who buys weaned calves and sells on as forward stores, keeping c.5ac aside to make hay until July time.
Repeat cycle of buying in cast ewes, or possibly store lambs, depending on the hay situation and sell in spring.
Admire cash generated.
Begin building up pedigree flock.

I have pretty much ad-lib access to haymaking kit and could possibly buy in feed for the first year's ewes if needed - plenty of feed knocking about this year so it shouldn't be an issue to procure.

Looking for any other ideas and advice if anyone's been in a similar position.

Also does anyone know the drill regarding renting land for grazing but also retaining an area to cut hay/silage from for a period of the rental agreement? Presumably its simply the total rent minus the area and time taken to grow crop?

Thanks in advance!!

 

[Highland Mule]

How about buying cast ewes with lambs at foot in spring, and selling the lambs in autumn and the ewes in the next spring? Always feel there’s money to make that way, if you’re happy to take a risk.

For the next few months, I’d be renting it all out though, until we know for certain what’s happening with Europe etc. Sheep could be very cheap in October, and very very cheap in November, or they might be back to standard seasonal prices. Unless I had cash I was prepared to lose, this doesn’t feel like the right time to be investing in livestock.

 

[Al R]

I know someone with 20 pedigree texel yearlings for sale if you wanted to go for Texels?

Buy cast ewes would be cheapest option, depending on what the weather is like with your area and when you intend to lamb, buying first year brokers mid-end of October would be a good bet, I can imagine a lot of people will want almost everything sold before the dreaded October 31st scenario so they might be piling them in to the marts then?

 

[MDL POWERUP]

From what I seen this year I'd buy white faced hoggs and lamb then to beltex. Then sell with lambs at foot. Penriths big sale these types were 90 quid a life!

 

[toquark]

Thanks for the replies folks. The cliff edge of October 31st could be a disaster for those looking to sell but a bonanza for those looking to buy... so given the sums involved aren't vast, I'm kind of keen to take a punt if they can be bought at the right price, if not yeah, I'd just leave the grass to the spring, or rent it out for winterers.

I had considered ewes with lambs at foot in the spring, but ideally I'd like something to take me through the winter initially as we take possession in late August. If the winterers do well, I'll maybe get some ewes with lambs in the spring, if they don't fare so well, I'll likely just rent it out for the season. The current stock is off the ground and its unbelievably growthy now so there should be a decent amount of grass to take them through the winter, but I have no fodder to top up with when the weather hardens and I'd like to avoid buying in if possible.

 

[neilo]

I'd go for cast ewes, tup them, then decide in the Spring whether you want to sell them, or keep them & their lambs on.

On the pedigree flock, I would suggest you do your sums very carefully. All that glitters is not Gold, and you might well make more from commercial flock, run well. Of course, there may be more to your decision than making money.

 

[toquark]

I'd go for cast ewes, tup them, then decide in the Spring whether you want to sell them, or keep them & their lambs on.

On the pedigree flock, I would suggest you do your sums very carefully. All that glitters is not Gold, and you might well make more from commercial flock, run well. Of course, there may be more to your decision than making money.

I like that idea - hedge the bets a little.

The commercial flock we had before worked quite well for us particularly as we both work full time and the stock wasn't at home, inputs therefore had to be kept fairly low. However we've both had a bit of a hankering to show stock... I know I've no idea why either. Given we can't and have no desire to do scale, I was thinking it may offer the best return/acre also like the idea of improving the stock over time.

 

[neilo]

You can improve commercial stock over time, and I would suggest having ‘show stock’ is probably not the way to do that, other than providing a hobby.

I really would look into whether a pedigree enterprise would provide the best return per acre too, and find out all the costs involved. I have a fairly large established flock of Charollais, have a feed bill that is a fraction of most, run a higher stocking rate than most I know, and sell well enough. However, when you sit down and crunch the numbers properly, i’d Get as much or more in the bank by upping commercial flock numbers on the same acreage. Really, do your sums if return per acre is what you’re looking for.

 

[Agrivator]

Do as Neilo says.

Whatever you do, do not buy ewes with lambs at foot. There is little possibility of making a profit. It's the one time of year when the folk selling them have a smile on their faces. And the folk buying them are quite happy because all they want is a few sheep to control the grass.

 

[Woolless]

Thanks for the replies folks. The cliff edge of October 31st could be a disaster for those looking to sell but a bonanza for those looking to buy... so given the sums involved aren't vast, I'm kind of keen to take a punt if they can be bought at the right price, if not yeah, I'd just leave the grass to the spring, or rent it out for winterers.

I had considered ewes with lambs at foot in the spring, but ideally I'd like something to take me through the winter initially as we take possession in late August. If the winterers do well, I'll maybe get some ewes with lambs in the spring, if they don't fare so well, I'll likely just rent it out for the season. The current stock is off the ground and its unbelievably growthy now so there should be a decent amount of grass to take them through the winter, but I have no fodder to top up with when the weather hardens and I'd like to avoid buying in if possible.

Fodder is cheap this year, so I wouldn't let that worry you, unless the hassle of feeding it is the issue.