SMALL SCALE HYDRO ELECTRIC

[IANTO]

Has anyone looked at the feasilibilty or costs of small scale Hydro.

There was a Slate Quarry near me and there are still 2 Ponds and the remains of a leat following the land countours through 8 fields.

This apparently drove the planer for planing slate slabs. Amongst other things they produced slate for Billiard Tables.

The water supply should be adequate to drive a Turbine.

Anyone with costs and figures, particularly in comparison to wind as that is another option.

Thanks in advance.

 

[sleepy]

I think there is a member in Wales with such a setup, think his name begins with a P?

He posted some pictures of it a while ago.

 

[Jim75]

Ju

I think there is a member in Wales with such a setup, think his name begins with a P?

He posted some pictures of it a while ago.

Just looking at it now and trying to pursuade the father in law. Head of pressure is what your after. Got about 80-100m here depending on location. They reckon 4 yr payback I'm going on 6-7.

 

[IANTO]

Ju

Just looking at it now and trying to pursuade the father in law. Head of pressure is what your after. Got about 80-100m here depending on location. They reckon 4 yr payback I'm going on 6-7.

One pond was constructed by daming a small stream who's source is roughly half a mile upsteam. It is also fed by a number of springs, that drain through field ditches. From there a leat was constructed following the land contours. The leat runs parallel to the stream, across the bottom of four fields, before following the hill contours for another four fields. At the point where the leat stops following the stream, there is at least a 100ft drop, at 70 degrees down to the stream bed. If I could the contour maps which I have somewhere, I could give a more accurate picture.

I am simply thrashing ideas about and have not done any research, and therefore may be talking rubbish (before else says, as usual).

Is it simply the Head that is important, or does volume, and the speed of descent play a mart.

As the leat was cleverly engineered in the early 1800's or 1700's to follow the contours, it flows very slowly, and there is not much momentum.

From what I remember of Physics at School 45 years ago Force = Mass X Acceleration.

Mass will be governed by the size of pipe connected from a holding tank which would have to be constructed at the point where the leat was diverted, to the Turbine at stream level.

By the way, purely out of curosity and to show my ignorance. What does Hud er chappin mean.

I believe "chappin" means knocking, and "Hud er chappin" possibly "I am knocking".

Is it simply Scots Patois aka Rabbie Burns Speak, or is it derived from Scots Gaelic?

Acceleration from water falling on a 70 degree slope will however be much higher, than simply following the contours.

Am I on the correct track.

 

[Jim75]

I think so, I'm a novice here too but had an initial survey done recently which is them looking on OS maps and can tell whether it is worth it, next step is a site visit. More head of pressure = more power available. From there data I only have .044 cubic m/sec so not very much. The figures are skewed a bit because they included some neighbours land but that's why site visit would be next. Cheers

Jim

Ps I have it as Aberdeenshire speak basically means keep the wheels turning, push the stick forward. Ha ha

 

[RushesToo]

You might try this site:
http://smallhydro.com/
Very useful for finding potential power output

 

[joe soapy]

4 main problems with hydro,
cattle treading in the leat
leaves
snow
dead sheep.
if you can solve them then its good power

 

[Y Fan Wen]

Um, where to start really. OK, If you have 20 feet of head (vertical) and one cubic foot of water per second, you have the potential for 1 kilowatt. I generate a maximum of 12kw from 200 foot head and my catchment area is about 600 acres. Standard leat construction is for a fall of not more than 1:700. Keeps the flow slow enough to avoid erosion. Pipe diameter should be sized so that water speed at max output does not exceed 4 feet per second. That keeps pipe friction losses to an acceptable level (dynamic loss of head), eight inch diameter here.

http://www.evans-engineering.co.uk/

I will re read this thread when I have a mo and answer specific queries.

 

[IANTO]

4 main problems with hydro,
cattle treading in the leat - Leat follows land contours and for the first four fields, to the point where I envisage it would be diverted is fenced off. The bottom of the fields were quite steep and difficult to farm properly, and the Woodland was encroaching. Currently for SFP purposes, grazed woodland, but that could change.

leaves - Leaves will be the main problem. Not sure if there is any easy answer.

snow - ? I have never seen the leat clogged with snow. Any snow that falls melts, as the water temperature is higher.

dead sheep. - Again as leat is fenced off, should not be a problem.

if you can solve them then its good power

 

[bazza3034]

Anybody install a vortex turbine looks a great system I wonder who supplies them

 

[renewablejohn]

Anybody install a vortex turbine looks a great system I wonder who supplies them

Problem is the Environment Agency and gaining approval.

 

[bazza3034]

Why tell them if you have a private stream or as they call it here a burn

 

[renewablejohn]

Why tell them if you have a private stream or as they call it here a burn

Now I never said that.

 

[Servac]

One pond was constructed by daming a small stream who's source is roughly half a mile upsteam. It is also fed by a number of springs, that drain through field ditches. From there a leat was constructed following the land contours. The leat runs parallel to the stream, across the bottom of four fields, before following the hill contours for another four fields. At the point where the leat stops following the stream, there is at least a 100ft drop, at 70 degrees down to the stream bed. If I could the contour maps which I have somewhere, I could give a more accurate picture.

I am simply thrashing ideas about and have not done any research, and therefore may be talking rubbish (before else says, as usual).

Is it simply the Head that is important, or does volume, and the speed of descent play a mart.

As the leat was cleverly engineered in the early 1800's or 1700's to follow the contours, it flows very slowly, and there is not much momentum.

From what I remember of Physics at School 45 years ago Force = Mass X Acceleration.

Mass will be governed by the size of pipe connected from a holding tank which would have to be constructed at the point where the leat was diverted, to the Turbine at stream level.

By the way, purely out of curosity and to show my ignorance. What does Hud er chappin mean.

I believe "chappin" means knocking, and "Hud er chappin" possibly "I am knocking".

Is it simply Scots Patois aka Rabbie Burns Speak, or is it derived from Scots Gaelic?

Acceleration from water falling on a 70 degree slope will however be much higher, than simply following the contours.

Am I on the correct track.

The rate of fall isnt that important for performance, its more so for cost as you would need more pipe and larger pipe to reduce losses. You are after pressure from head rather than momentum.

 

[f0ster]

one of my customers got turned down by the authorities for a water turbine. it was not that big only about 5kw max. so he built it anyway, you would never find it if you did not know where to look.

 

[renewablejohn]

It is really annoying that the Environment agency make it so difficult especially now that low head turbines like the vortex are so much more efficient then the old style water wheels.

 

[bazza3034]

I watched a vortex turbine on YouTube it puts out 15kw look a great job that the 1 I was thinking of

 

[f0ster]

the turbulent water turbine looks just the job but you might find you are not allowed to take the quantity of water it requires to operate. the environment agency will only let you take a small percentage of the total water flow in a river/stream

 

[renewablejohn]

The rate of fall isnt that important for performance, its more so for cost as you would need more pipe and larger pipe to reduce losses. You are after pressure from head rather than momentum.

On a low head turbine like the vortex its all about maintaining momentum as you can be working with as little as 1.5 mtrs head which has very little pressure.

 

[rusty]

Viewed a system in Cumbria on a dairy/sheep farm. They had a 70kw turbine and the intake was about 1000m up the hill. Water intake was through a big mesh like a cheese grater. Pipe down the hill was about 300-400mm diameter. Looked to be a good earner with payback in under 4 years . They had done a lot of the installation themselves which had helped keep costs down.