So New Zealand farmers; how do you make it pay?

[ollie989898]

Who on TFF actually checks the same group of stock 3 times a day?

Thinking about this, all the places I ever worked on they checked/fed the outlying stock, heifers and the like once per day. Cavles fed and checked and sorted twice per day. Dairy cattle/dry cows obviously checked more often as part of the routine.

Checking 150 sheep right next to the steading 3 times per day?

Talking of fallen stock, up in the hills and the dales, a single missing sheep might be hard to find? And if you did, the hunt take them away no?

 

[kfpben]

One of the key things that always seems to be forgotten in this discussion of efficiency and subsidy is the pattern of land holding.

If I had a farm in NZ (or many places in the ‘New World’) that was a nice big fenced block with no obstacles, buildings in the middle and a farm track for access I could probably run 3,000 ewes on my own with a bit of part time family help for the big jobs.

Meanwhile in Southern England...my grazing is split into many different areas and dissected by roads, tracks, hedges, villages so I end up spending far too much time trailering sheep and cattle about the place.

 

[ollie989898]

One of the key things that always seems to be forgotten in this discussion of efficiency and subsidy is the pattern of land holding.

If I had a farm in NZ (or many places in the ‘New World’) that was a nice big fenced block with no obstacles, buildings in the middle and a farm track for access I could probably run 3,000 ewes on my own with a bit of part time family help for the big jobs.

Meanwhile in Southern England...my grazing is split into many different areas and dissected by roads, tracks, hedges, villages so I end up spending far too much time trailering sheep and cattle about the place.

These sound like powerful disincentives to not keep sheep?

 

[Bury the Trash]

By stealing other people's markets

what are you on about.


why don't people read more? ,especially if they cant travel and find out for themselves

mind blinkered vision also comes into it guess....

 

[kfpben]

These sound like powerful disincentives to not keep sheep?

If it’s permanent pasture though?

 

[ollie989898]

If it’s permanent pasture though?

In short- If it ain't economic to farm, it ain't economic to farm? Put into environmental schemes?

 

[Cowlife]

To a certain degree it costs as much too keep 10 sheep as it does too keep 100 sheep... in New Zealand it’s probably more it costs as much to keep 1000 sheep as it does too keep 10,000 add too that there relaxed attitude towards losses and deadstock and checking stock, when they are lambing I bet they ride round once a week picking the dead ones up then after that it’s see you in 3 months when we start weighing lambs... if they even weigh lambs? They maybe just gather them in and know at 16 weeks old they will be somewhere near and send everything that looks near...

Reminds me of a guy I was friendly with when I was out in southland. I d go out in the ute with him occasionally to look sheep. My job was opening gates and throwing on a few dead ones to freeze for the dog. Wasn't much labour involved. They had other enterprises on and off farm.
I also remember another couple of guys converting to dairying as they said no money in sheep. That was over ten years ago.

 

[kiwi pom]

I'm not a farmer, my mother in law owns a sheep farm in southland, approx 1000 ewe's, that's all I know about sheep.

One of the key things that always seems to be forgotten in this discussion of efficiency and subsidy is the pattern of land holding.

If I had a farm in NZ (or many places in the ‘New World’) that was a nice big fenced block with no obstacles, buildings in the middle and a farm track for access I could probably run 3,000 ewes on my own with a bit of part time family help for the big jobs.

Meanwhile in Southern England...my grazing is split into many different areas and dissected by roads, tracks, hedges, villages so I end up spending far too much time trailering sheep and cattle about the place.

This is a big factor, farms are often in large blocks and owned by the farmer. Renting in general is I think rare, if you think about it renting land automatically means two people are making money from it. I don't think that pays here.
Renting 5 acres here and there just doesn't pay so isn't done.
There's some poor animal welfare here no doubt but you can say that about some farms in the UK too.

Generally I don't think Kiwi sheep farmers do make it pay all that well, I think many UK farmers are way better off.
The biggest difference I see is wealth seems to be counted differently.
A good comparison would be to measure the amount of land or number of stock the average UK or NZ farmer needs to make a living.
UK wins every time here in my opinion.

 

[lloyd]

One of the differences here is we're not
allowed to exterminate all the predators
only selected ones.

 

[atlas]

When I was in New Zealand a few years ago I drove a lorry for a contracting outfit for a few weeks delivering hay and straw about a few farms. It is very different system no sheds for stock or fodder I was delivering loads of rye grass to the corner of a root field for dairy cows to winter on or dropping a load up on some hillside you would have some old tractor and loader like a DB990 to unload . so there costs are low .

 

[andybk]

My Nephew farms sheep in NZ.

Part time job with 6000 ewes, on top of a hill with just a dog and stick. No sheds, no machinery !

He came across for my Sons wedding in October. I mentioned the sheep must soon be lambing and he said they started just before he came to the UK and they would be fine until he got back !! What dies just gets rolled into the creek.

When you remove all those costs, you should be able to make a living.

thats exactly the issue , anything that lives or dies in uk has to have a paper trail , nothing wrong with that but imports should be policed the same way from wherever or scrap he reg , every reg makes a cost and it all adds up

 

[tepapa]

To put NZ's animal welfare into perspective. Over the last 30yrs, whilst British farmers have bred for pretty faces and colored markings, NZ bred for a functional sheep that needs minimal interference, especially at lambing.

Pulling every lamb at birth and keeping them indoors for a week doesn't mean you have better animal welfare and don't get me started on lame ewes.

 

[kiwi pom]

thats exactly the issue , anything that lives or dies in uk has to have a paper trail , nothing wrong with that but imports should be policed the same way from wherever or scrap he reg , every reg makes a cost and it all adds up

Don't know what the regs are for sheep but cattle are fairly strict here now with electronic tags.
As I posted on another thread, the UK has some fairly remote areas that are stocked with sheep. There must be some that go missing? What happens with them?

 

[ollie989898]

I thought it was myth that NZ and Australian livestock weren't tagged? Given the nature of the export markets they fulfil I bet everything they do is by the book. Countries like Qatar etc, you will only fall out with once.

 

[kiwi pom]

A polite question, questions to our New Zealand forum friends, how come we cant make it pay and you can ? please some facts and figures, also how much is agricultural land at the moment and is there many farms for sale, because here with all the moaning about the poor, or negative profit in UK agriculture, and i moan as much as many, the fact is not a lot of farms, land are for sale, look at a farmers weekly from the 1980s-1990s and see the pages of land farms for sale then?

Not the warmest part of the country @bluebell but a decent size sheep farm if you're keen.

Team Southland - Property Brokers

southernwiderealestate.co.nz

 

[Lexie]

Who on TFF actually checks the same group of stock 3 times a day?

Thinking about this, all the places I ever worked on they checked/fed the outlying stock, heifers and the like once per day. Cavles fed and checked and sorted twice per day. Dairy cattle/dry cows obviously checked more often as part of the routine.

Checking 150 sheep right next to the steading 3 times per day?

Talking of fallen stock, up in the hills and the dales, a single missing sheep might be hard to find? And if you did, the hunt take them away no?

Costs 25 quid each for hunt kennels but u need the tickets to pass farm assurance

 

[Mc115reed]

Costs 25 quid each for hunt kennels but u need the tickets to pass farm assurance

Costs me £10.20 too drop a ewe off at local deadstock place?! I thought the hunt was supposed too be free lol

 

[Lexie]

Costs me £10.20 too drop a ewe off at local deadstock place?! I thought the hunt was supposed too be free lol

Wow hasn't been that low here for a few years. Calves r free for some reason

 

[andybk]

Wow hasn't been that low here for a few years. Calves r free for some reason

they skin and salt them to sell for leather market , well our place does , otherwise £18 per sheep / bag of lambs

 

[Kiwi Pete]

I don't have any option ?‍

...simple as that

Plenty of revenue -don't spend it on crap -profit is the result.

Returns are pretty dim here despite the hype, I think the stats show about an average 1.6% for sheep+beef.
I'm can't be average because 1.6% wouldn't even look at our mortgage..