Sprayer MOT

[bobk]

I cannot remember. Just a small amount because I do remember I paid the local ag dept in cash. The invoice was passed to my accountant together with all others for 2015 last January. It would a guess to say about €10. Given the number of people who attended that would well cover the costs of those who ran the course.

Bear in mind that those attending were very small scale people who cannot possibly make even the min wage (€505 a month) from their land so cannot afford big fees either. There were a lot of women on the course, and I suspect that was because they could read and their husbands cannot.

I paid £250 for an hour , most of which was the inspector telling me about his life in Australia ... wasn't you was it.?

 

[DRC]

What the heck is the justification and point of doing a 'grandfather's test'? Surely if there is a testing and certification system at all, everyone should meet the same high standard and gain the same qualification and rights. Why would anyone even try for a grandfather's test, which is presumably a lesser level of competence, when the full blown qualification is fairly basic common sense and covers legal requirements on all aspects anyway. I cannot fathom the logic of it. If it is for the illiterate, how can they understand the label information and conform to legal requirements anyway. Better that they fail and let someone who can demonstrate competence to the proper standard do the job, be that a contractor or neighbour.

I did he grandfather top up test. Certainly not illiterate, just wanted to choose the cheapest option with the least hassle. I'm more experienced than a lot of the testers, so why give them the satisfaction. My son got his pa1 and 2 at uni, done with a very basic manual fold sprayer on the back of a small tractor, in their yard. He was then technically more qualified than me, despite him never having actually sprayed a field, whereas I had years of experience ( which counts for nothing seemingly).
The whole thing is a job creation joke.

 

[bobk]

I did he grandfather top up test. Certainly not illiterate, just wanted to choose the cheapest option with the least hassle. I'm more experienced than a lot of the testers, so why give them the satisfaction. My son got his pa1 and 2 at uni, done with a very basic manual fold sprayer on the back of a small tractor, in their yard. He was then technically more qualified than me, despite him never having actually sprayed a field, whereas I had years of experience ( which counts for nothing seemingly).
The whole thing is a job creation joke.

And it was @silverfox who gave me the tip about this procedure

 

[Philip Watkins]

Did my PA1 & PA6 earlier this month, nowhere on either certificate does it mention PA1 or PA6.

 

[DRC]

I paid £250 for an hour , most of which was the inspector telling me about his life in Australia ... wasn't you was it.?

We had the same bloke. I also heard all about his Aussie trip. He actually did me and my neighbour at the same time, so worked out cheaper, but we weren't supposed to tell anyone, as not supposed to do it.
As we looked over the gate at my neighbours wheat field, we were asked to name something in he field that aided accurate spraying. you've guessed it, tramline's!!

 

[Pheasant Surprise]

Did my PA1 & PA6 earlier this month, nowhere on either certificate does it mention PA1 or PA6.View attachment 432476

The PA1 and 6 endorsements will be on the back of the photo card when you eventually get it

 

[Philip Watkins]

The PA1 and 6 endorsements will be on the back of the photo card when you eventually get it

Perhaps I better apply for one then.

 

[7610 super q]

Did my PA1 & PA6 earlier this month, nowhere on either certificate does it mention PA1 or PA6.View attachment 432476

So...it would appear your username isn't fake after all.....

 

[Red Fred]

I don't think I've had a photocard, how do you get one?

 

[Pheasant Surprise]

Perhaps I better apply for one then.

That's entirely up to you, but I think this thread is hostile enough without steering it down the path of the merits or otherwise of CPD etc.

 

[Cowabunga]

But if we loose more active ingredients due to the actions of a few who do not know any better as they have not received the appropriate training , what is that going to cost the industry. Probably a lot more than a couple of hundred pounds that you spend on sprayer testing.

I agree as far as crop assurance in general is concerned they are just getting out of hand with some of the daft rules that they dream up with no obvious benefit to the consumer or producer.

It would also be interesting to see just how well Crop Assurance companies are doing their job!
We had a sprayer testing customer who we had not seen for a few years who had just discreetly changed the date on the test sheet for a few years. Just proves to me that Crop Assurance are happy to take your money but not carry out their side of the bargin.
One rule for one.......

That's the standard rubbish rolled out by the training and inspection industry that I hear over and over again. Ive no doubt that you are subtly brainwashed to say and believe that.
No matter what, a lot of products are going to be withdrawn precisely because their certification is too onerous and expensive these days. Also because pesticide companies are swallowing each other up at an alarming rate, and once they do, they dump the least profitable ingredients and products from their ever-combining portfolios.
Then there is the Glyphosate conundrum. We are in real danger of losing one of the safest and most useful herbicides available, not because of any of the reasons dear to your heart, but because of politics and pressure from nut-job groups who object to Monsanto et-al in Europe.

 

[Cowabunga]

I took my "Grandfather" test last year. It had to be done before 26th Nov 2015. The EU seems to like 26th Nov as a date relating to sprayers.

The reason I took it was because it was a half day course at the local ag college for a very small fee rather than a full week at a much higher fee. It actually was for the illiterate too. People were split into two groups - those who could read and those who could not. Those who could not were led through the written exam at the end by a small group of people who verbally asked the questions and helped with the marking down of the answers.

You must realise that there are huge numbers of EU ctizens who were never taught to read and write, but these people have farmed their few hundred square yards of land for maybe 70 years and some actually do spray herbicides, insecticides and fungicides through a knapsack sprayer. Without the Certificate they have been banned from buying these products since 26th Nov last year.

There are no contractors or neighbours with the relevant certificate permitting the spraying of someone else's land.

The UK is a group of foreign islands to the rest of the EU, and everything is very different. Only one of the many reasons I voted for Brexit.

Paradoxically, it seems you would rather be like them than be like 'us'. Not sure whether to or

Yet you and I will still have to abide by 'their' rules and still have their rules 'gold plated' by British pen pushers and the training/inspection industry that so many are part of, regardless of our trading partnership status.

 

[Bumble Bee]

That's the standard rubbish rolled out by the training and inspection industry that I hear over and over again. Ive no doubt that you are subtly brainwashed to say and believe that.
No matter what, a lot of products are going to be withdrawn precisely because their certification is too onerous and expensive these days. Also because pesticide companies are swallowing each other up at an alarming rate, and once they do, they dump the least profitable ingredients and products from their ever-combining portfolios.
Then there is the Glyphosate conundrum. We are in real danger of losing one of the safest and most useful herbicides available, not because of any of the reasons dear to your heart, but because of politics and pressure from nut-job groups who object to Monsanto et-al in Europe.

I agree with you regarding Glyphosate. There seems to be no science involved in the argument. If we loose one of the safest chems then what chance have we got at keep any of the others.

I don't believe that i have been brainwashed. You only have to look at IPU and no doubt shortly Metaldehyde. Their presence in water has led to or will lead too their withdrawal. Partly but not wholly down to poor application practice.

For you information sprayer & spreader testing is only a very small part of our business. I am not here to defend the training and inspection industry. I see myself as a farmer and contractor first and formost. I am arguing my point as a user/applicator of crop protection products, but with the benefit of what i and my team have seen whilst testing. It may not be what you or some in the industry want to hear or even believe. But it is what we have seen.

 

[Old McDonald]

I paid £250 for an hour , most of which was the inspector telling me about his life in Australia ... wasn't you was it.?

That is robbery. Definitely not me though. I reckon I would make the world's worst teacher, because I believe you should never tell anybody else how to do something.

 

[Red Fred]

Once I'd got over the shock of paying, I found the PA1 and 2 were actually pretty good, and I enjoyed spending a couple of days out with different folks and equipment. It also made me look at my own set up and give the sprayer the once over with more critical eyes.
The worst thing about it was that it showed me how much I have forgotten since college days. If I had only kept it all in my head, I'd be rich by now

 

[Cowabunga]

I agree with you regarding Glyphosate. There seems to be no science involved in the argument. If we loose one of the safest chems then what chance have we got at keep any of the others.

I don't believe that i have been brainwashed. You only have to look at IPU and no doubt shortly Metaldehyde. Their presence in water has led to or will lead too their withdrawal. Partly but not wholly down to poor application practice.

Yes, I've heard it all before. Their presence in water and all that, just like nitrogen and NVZ's, where any N in drinking water that results from agriculture [or anywhere for that matter], although detectable, has no detrimental effect whatsoever. The oft cited reason is 'blue baby syndrome' of course, which has itself been long debunked at anything like the levels we are talking about. At the moment, our elected politicians at the Welsh Assembly are talking about making Ceredigion, where only a tiny amount is a catchment area, and that in the hills where no N or slurry is applied, all a NVZ. That will kill the already strangled dairy industry, which is just about the only industry they've got in these areas with any turnover apart from civil servants and quangos.
None of this is about real risk or proper science at all. It is about bulls**t politics pushed by the urban middle class that are too well fed on cheap food they don't appreciate.

For you information sprayer & spreader testing is only a very small part of our business. I am not here to defend the training and inspection industry. I see myself as a farmer and contractor first and formost. I am arguing my point as a user/applicator of crop protection products, but with the benefit of what i and my team have seen whilst testing. It may not be what you or some in the industry want to hear or even believe. But it is what we have seen.

It always is only pocket money to part time farmers or failed farmers. While there are very good farmers and people taking the extra money with the spare time they have got [is that 'increasing their efficiency"?], I know of several others who are complete shambles in their own right, holding training courses and doing inspections. I am confident that you are one of the better ones.

 

[bobk]

Yes, I've heard it all before. Their presence in water and all that, just like nitrogen and NVZ's, where any N in drinking water that results from agriculture [or anywhere for that matter], although detectable, has no detrimental effect whatsoever. The oft cited reason is 'blue baby syndrome' of course, which has itself been long debunked at anything like the levels we are talking about. At the moment, our elected politicians at the Welsh Assembly are talking about making Ceredigion, where only a tiny amount is a catchment area, and that in the hills where no N or slurry is applied, all a NVZ. That will kill the already strangled dairy industry, which is just about the only industry they've got in these areas with any turnover apart from civil servants and quangos.
None of this is about real risk or proper science at all. It is about bullpoo politics pushed by the urban middle class that are too well fed on cheap food they don't appreciate.


It always is only pocket money to part time farmers or failed farmers. While there are very good farmers and people taking the extra money with the spare time they have got [is that 'increasing their efficiency"?], I know of several others who are complete shambles in their own right, holding training courses and doing inspections. I am confident that you are one of the better ones.

ffs Duck , you need a chill pill or a f**kin holiday .... you're turning in to puntabrava

 

[Cowabunga]

Once I'd got over the shock of paying, I found the PA1 and 2 were actually pretty good, and I enjoyed spending a couple of days out with different folks and equipment. It also made me look at my own set up and give the sprayer the once over with more critical eyes.
The worst thing about it was that it showed me how much I have forgotten since college days. If I had only kept it all in my head, I'd be rich by now

I enjoyed the course too. I just cannot see how the 'grandfather's course', taking a few hours including the assessment, can be anything like as testing of the candidates competency or understanding as the Pa1 and Pa2 courses.
Yes, I did learn a few things, but things I would say were not critical to safe or accurate application for me personally. The main thing I learnt was how to do the risk assessment in order to cover my arse. The rest I already knew for the most part.

Yes, I really enjoyed the course and the exams. We had a good couple of trainers, no doubt about it.

 

[Cowabunga]

ffs Duck , you need a chill pill or a fudgein holiday .... you're turning in to puntabrava

Lord forbid!

 

[Old McDonald]

Paradoxically, it seems you would rather be like them than be like 'us'. Not sure whether to or

Yet you and I will still have to abide by 'their' rules and still have their rules 'gold plated' by British pen pushers and the training/inspection industry that so many are part of, regardless of our trading partnership status.

Why would you think I would rather be like them? I have told you the facts. Nothing either of us can do about changing them.

Just because I am passing through a country (and behaving myself whilst there) that does not make me one of them. I do believe France might benefit from a couple of years of me telling them what Brits really think of them, rather than the Francophiles who move there.

Whilst in a country I abide by the rules, regulations, and laws of that country. I do not have to like them, but I do have to put up with them - and hopefully, take advantage of a few too. I also pay the tax I should pay.

This idea that Britain "gold plates" EU rules is a nonsense. Every country's farmers claim the same thing. The rules start in Brussels, and there is limited opportunity to change them. I agree that some countries are, at present, slightly more sympathetic to their rural population, but that is rapidly changing across the whole of Europe.