Spring barley pre-ems

Flat 10

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Fen Edge
Do people think they do much good? I have only ever used half rate liberator and pdm or PDM + DFF and having seen what that would do early in the autumn on this farm (not enough!) it makes me think its a waste of time applying it to spring barley. Last year used very little as late drilled and only treated a bad 4ha field but not brave enough to leave a tramline. Also autumn applied pre-ems seem to do a good job on BLWs but I always have to follow up in Spring Barley. In bad BG situations just delay drilling and up seed rates and rely on Barley's competitive nature to limit seed return? I admit to being a bit worried about those who have drilled barley in jan who have BG on farm. I think there's also an argument for limiting exposure of BG to sub lethal doses of actives and leaving use until you really need them in WW. Dry spring conditions also don't help. Even in a dry winter like this one pre-ems get enough moisture to activate them.
What does the TFF collective think? Am I talking more rubbish than normal? Would I get on better with Avadex as better in dry conditions. All thoughts appreciated.
 

Matt77

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
East Sussex
My agronomist opinion last year was to get the Avadex and flufenacet in stock and see what we got weather wise, put the Avadex on if unsure of rain but put both on if rain forecast, couldn’t have timed it better last year, all in and rolled with light rain forecast for all of the following week so put both on, very clean crop of barley followed but we’ll never know if that was the very fast crop development, hence out growing the weed, or the herbicide doing its thing.
 

Brisel

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Midlands
Yes. I only do them on bad fields and they have worked well here. Half rate Liberator and half rate Crystal to stay legal. I've yet to see no rain after drilling but it could happen. Dry autumns after pre em treatment of wheat aren't unusual.
 

Flat 10

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Fen Edge
Yes. I only do them on bad fields and they have worked well here. Half rate Liberator and half rate Crystal to stay legal. I've yet to see no rain after drilling but it could happen. Dry autumns after pre em treatment of wheat aren't unusual.
And that gives you full rate ffct?
 

DaveGrohl

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Cumbria
We tried pre-em on spring barley for the first time, didn't even know there was such a thing til last year. Complete and utter waste of time and (considerable) money. It could even have stressed the already stressed seedlings further. We had to go again with our usual spray later. I know last year was a freak but we'll never ever use them again on spring barley.
 

T Hectares

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Berkshire
Think it's a bit of lottery TBH.
Drilling late April last year with the following hot dry weather meant I left residuals in the store, but had very clean SB as the BG had largely emerged and been sprayed off and any late germinating stuff was well subdued by the thick SB...
At the moment conditions are ideal here for residuals to work, but if BG pressure is high I'd still want to wait for more BG to emerge before drilling, I've drilled SB early March before and chucked Avadex, Crystal and Liberator at it and still had dirty crops as the residuals quickly break down in warming soils, later drilled crops have had less or no pre em and have been as clean or cleaner.
No plans to drill anything here yet, I will start on cleaner fields first and leave the dirtier ones until a good flush has been seen, whenever that is !!
 

Flat 10

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Fen Edge
I think I will probably do 10ha out of my 40. Problem is here delaying after 1st week March I’m sure costs yield, on the lighter land anyway. (You could ask how I got BG on fairly light land but I’m not the only one.....)
 
As I rely on ffct in wheat I do not use it on s barley
Just use Avadex as it is effective on wild oats
Relying on the same chemicals in wheat and barley increases the risk of resistance fops dims and many banned actives all have resistance issues to bg and wild oats
Wild oat resistance To fops dims would make combineable crops very difficult to grow

The reason I grow spring barley is for a bg break so plant it later as cultural control

If I had no bg and had lighter land I would plant earlier
 

Flat 10

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Fen Edge
I have been thinking further about this and i think that it quite often checks the crop which is another reason for not applying it. Autumn crops have time to recover from being knocked but spring crops are often stressed enough as it is without adding to the burden.
 

Chae1

Member
Location
Aberdeenshire
I have been thinking further about this and i think that it quite often checks the crop which is another reason for not applying it. Autumn crops have time to recover from being knocked but spring crops are often stressed enough as it is without adding to the burden.

I sometimes just do headlands as these seem to grow more annual meadow grass.

Can't say I've ever seen any difference in crop emergence and development.
 

Steevo

Member
Location
Gloucestershire
Planted all ours here yesterday and day before. First time ever to have it planted in March. Was lucky to get it in by end of April last year.

Usually do a pre-em of sorts and will do likewise this year too depending on agronomists recipe.

Probably went a bit high with the seed rate (250kg/ha) but early direct-drilled it seemed sensible to keep it high and hopefully help compete against the weeds too.

I might regret it come harvest!
 

JCfarmer

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
warks
Planted all ours here yesterday and day before. First time ever to have it planted in March. Was lucky to get it in by end of April last year.

Usually do a pre-em of sorts and will do likewise this year too depending on agronomists recipe.

Probably went a bit high with the seed rate (250kg/ha) but early direct-drilled it seemed sensible to keep it high and hopefully help compete against the weeds too.

I might regret it come harvest!
Home saved seed, what was the 1000tgw?
 

JCfarmer

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
warks
Spoke with my independent agronomist about avadex on sp barley but said high seed rate for bad grass weed areas. I can apply avadex at drilling easy enough.
 

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