Stock that Suits the Farm and System

[Derrick Hughes]

Hell of a lot better than a cow that loses condition when working.

The dairy cross stopped the fatty cow but then the Holstein put a stop to that

 

[kfpben]

Sounds like you just need to keep more cattle if they're all getting too fat off grass only?

 

[JP1]

Not to sure .
Everyone would have 20000 herdwicks on that principle.
If your ground is that good maybe you haven't found just the strain of bigger breed. Nothing wrong with British whites btw

Nothing's yet taken them off the top of the Cumbrian Fells where they evolved, so the logic fits.

 

[GTB]

I wouldn't get too hung up on fat cows as long as they rear a good calf. If they got fat but didn't rear a tidy calf I'd be worried. As said maybe the cattle are just too hardy for your ground and a more prolific breed would suit better?

 

[GTB]

Bigger cows suit poorer pastures?

No, def not!

 

[Forever Fendt]

If they are all getting in calf and doing the calf ok i would not worry about them getting fat of grass as its costing next to nothing to do this and you will have a good cull value when the time comes

 

[Northeastfarmer]

As the saying goes...the fat cows look after themselves and the thin ones look after you

 

[scholland]

A decent suckler should be pretty fat this time of year, as long as she has a decent calf let her put the cheap grass on her back then she can use that energy reserve through the winter when feed is more expensive.
A thin cow is no use here, if she's thin now she'll be some sight come November.

 

[DrWazzock]

As far as I see it, the small cows cost me less to keep, are in less danger of going fat so suit me better. Easier handled as well as less weight on the ground.

I like to run with surplus grass in case we burn up here in the normally dry east so the cow needs to be able to stay thin even with suplus grass.

Maybe I shouldn't worm the cows.

 

[Henarar]

Joel Salatin would run up to you and hug you for that post. He adopts just the same principle for his hogs, chickens and cattle. They just have to be functional, healthy and trouble free. He despises pedigree anything

that's awfully nice of him
would he still hold this opinion if said pedigree animal was functional, healthy and trouble free ?

 

[JP1]

that's awfully nice of him
would he still hold this opinion if said pedigree animal was functional, healthy and trouble free ?

His findings to date have been that home bred and retained good hybrids succeed and carry no premium

 

[Henarar]

As far as I see it, the small cows cost me less to keep, are in less danger of going fat so suit me better. Easier handled as well as less weight on the ground.

I like to run with surplus grass in case we burn up here in the normally dry east so the cow needs to be able to stay thin even with suplus grass.

Maybe I shouldn't worm the cows.

think your worrying about fat cows to much
if they want to be fat let them get on with it as long as they do the job

 

[Henarar]

His findings to date have been that home bred and retained good hybrids succeed and carry no premium

dare say but that don't answer the question
would he even be able to pick out every ped animal put in front of him
silly statement

 

[John Chance]

Well grown calves and fat cows at housing ? Great. Feed the cows straw over the winter to bring to them down a bit. Maybe bump up stocking rates at grass ?

Not sure there's anything much in the pedigree vs the rest argument. A good un is a good un and a bad un is a bad un. I suppose the only advantage of pedigree cattle is that they should breed a type very predictably without throwing back to something unwanted ? I still keep coming back to thinking that the best system must a maternal group (with a maternal bull) breeding for replacements with the bulk of the herd crossed to terminals. But you need the numbers. But you need the numbers anyway.

 

[JP1]

dare say but that don't answer the question
would he even be able to pick out every ped animal put in front of him
silly statement

Don't follow?

He doesn't buy in anything pedigree, just breeds his own hybrid self replacements

 

[Dead Rabbits]

Don't follow?

He doesn't buy in anything pedigree, just breeds his own hybrid self replacements

The impression I got from Mr.Salatin was that worrying about breed, pedigrees etc, fits into the "sh!t that doesn't matter" folder. Use what works on your farm and environment and do not worry about the rest. Do not try and change the environment to suit the cow, change the cow to suit its environment.

@DrWazzock, I think you are on the right track, select from the ones that work and slowly replace the ones that do not.

 

[Lovegoodstock]

The dairy cross stopped the fatty cow but then the Holstein put a stop to that

Whilst I went out of milk 5 years ago, remember being told a dairy cow couldn't milk if fit/fat, we were proper british friesan herd and our cows were fit hen we dried them off, ok only doing 6500 litres average, but then averaged 9 lactations at a calving interval of 380 days. Our first cross out of these cows carry condition, they milk all summer, and are weaned in what most say too good a condition, then I winter them on a energy mineralised lick , 20 quid a winter, and straw only, nov to april another 100 quid, generally move feeders for bed. As initial point made, horses for courses, fat cows don't necessarily mean they are not working, a fat cow with no milk yes deserves culling as pointless, but a cow can be fit and milk, and look after her calf and herself

 

[Kiwi Pete]

Yes- get your system... then select the animals and species that suit your system.
Or let them select themselves..

Much easier and cheaper than making the system fit something that's not ideal.

Plenty of "busy fools" doing just that!!

 

[jondear]

I think the tb job is buggering up keeping the best stock and breeding from them !It's always those that you will lose.

 

[Henarar]

Don't follow?

He doesn't buy in anything pedigree, just breeds his own hybrid self replacements

Why comment on something he knows nothing about then