T1

You're right, however this particular field has never been touched as it's less than an acre, we have another thousand that will perform the same and is rotationally cultivated.

I keep saying this but it's mixed farming, I'm confident with the treatment nearly any soil will perform like this in 5yrs.

Those doing this in an annual cropping scenario have much more of a challenge.

Look at the decline in efficacy of the major fungicides in the last 5 yrs, remove ctl as a partner and another 3 yrs will mean expensive or cheap fungicides won't do too much.

There's no doubt 70 quid a ha over the hedge is an easy and cheap insurance policy and will certainly pay, the question is where is the middle ground which is sustainable going forward.
 
You're right, however this particular field has never been touched as it's less than an acre, we have another thousand that will perform the same and is rotationally cultivated.

I keep saying this but it's mixed farming, I'm confident with the treatment nearly any soil will perform like this in 5yrs.

Those doing this in an annual cropping scenario have much more of a challenge.

Look at the decline in efficacy of the major fungicides in the last 5 yrs, remove ctl as a partner and another 3 yrs will mean expensive or cheap fungicides won't do too much.

There's no doubt 70 quid a ha over the hedge is an easy and cheap insurance policy and will certainly pay, the question is where is the middle ground which is sustainable going forward.

You should be in a position where there is no P and K spend and your nitrogen bill should be halved if not less compared to the textbook spend. Ive seen it done many many times in our region with no loss of yield. Im convinced that investment toward decent speeaders/tankers would be worth it for many farms for the P and K saving alone.

With the above in place and your potentially very wide rotation you will be head and shoulders above a regular arable grower even with a stiff pgr or fungicide spend. As I have before you can grow some very cheap wheat in this part of the world.
 
Last edited:

Daniel

Member
There were quite a few combinations of pre-em and spring herbicides, one field has only had a pre-em and generic starane so far for example, so i've just gone for the average T0 + T1. I have the invoice for T0 but not T1 so I cribbed it from the Chemical price tracker

Very manganese deficient soil so I did a pass with that early rather than risk it with Palio.

T0
Palio
Kantor 0.3lt
Capalo 0.6lt
Chlomequat 1lt


T1
Gallifrey 0.5lt (Starane)
Mantra 1lt -
Alatrin Evo 0.1lt (I know!)
Manganese 2lt
Copper 0.75


£97ish in total of which £38.80 on fungicide. £57 on the field without palio + kantor. We could shave money off the fungicide spend, but i'm not brave enough. I gather from the collective that a cheaper adjuvant than Kantor could be used saving myself possibly a fiver a hectare between that and the fancy Moddus.

The most worthwhile input since that was applied has been 13.5mm of rain yesterday!

T0 on Forward Wheat
0.5 Amistar Opti £12.50 litre
2 CCC £1.90 lite
£10.05 ha

T1
0.6 Elatus Era £47.5 litre
0.7 Rover 500 £5.95 litre
0.15 Moddus £23 litre
£36.12 Ha

T2 plan
1 litre Ascra £32.80 litre
2.5 kg Epsotop 28.7 p/kg
£33.55 ha

All first wheat zyatt

Having previously been with Agrii I can say moving back to an independent has been a real eye opener. Between 30-40 % saving. Agronomist was top notch but it was sales and pre season blueprint driven.

To be fair though, you’ve spent more so far on fungs than my Agrii agronomist has.
 
You should be in a position where there is no P and K spend and your nitrogen bill should be halved if not less compared to the textbook spend. Ive seen it done many many times in our region with no loss of yield. Im convinced that investment toward decent speeaders/tankers would be worth it for many farms for the P and K saving alone.

With the above in place and your potentially very wide rotation you will be head and shoulders above a regular arable grower even with a stiff pgr or fungicide spend. As I have before you can grow some very cheap wheat in this part of the world.

Yes we are p and k free apart from maize starter and I'm working on that.

We are net importers, trying to spread that evenly across crops is an on going effort and requires a whole heap more logistics and organisation than a bit of bagged fert or fibrophos.

The majority of my wheats have had slurry and 250kg/ha nitram only, straw at 60 or 70 quid an acre helps as well, wheat at 100 quid a tonne is achievable even on average ground.
 

YELROM

Member
Location
North Yorkshire
I agree also that farmers are also heavily to blame for being extremely naive to think that when push comes to shove that the distributor will put the farmer's interests over their own. Some really should know better.

However, within consumer law there are protections that do not exist for business-to-business transactions because the consumer is assumed to be more vulnerable. The problem is that, for example, a dairy farmer who has a small amount of arable is not going to have the time to learn every fine detail of every single active and its effects because their time is nearly all taken up dealing with the livestock side of their business. Arguably they are closer in vulnerability (if that's the right measure) to an ordinary high-street consumer than to a highly well informed business purchasing products with a deep understanding of the transaction's dynamics.

What is the best way to learn more about sprays as we are basically that dairy business but we grow about 250ac of wheat and barley all to be home feed mainly in rotation with grass
 

Brisel

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Midlands
What is the best way to learn more about sprays as we are basically that dairy business but we grow about 250ac of wheat and barley all to be home feed mainly in rotation with grass

On that kind of area, surely you'd be better off with an agronomist? Paying a bit more for sprays would be cheaper than doing all the training and shopping around.
 

YELROM

Member
Location
North Yorkshire
On that kind of area, surely you'd be better off with an agronomist? Paying a bit more for sprays would be cheaper than doing all the training and shopping around.

We do use an agronomist, but other than posting the recommendations on here what is the best way to check you are not getting your leg lifted with the products they recommend
 

DrWazzock

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Lincolnshire
We do use an agronomist, but other than posting the recommendations on here what is the best way to check you are not getting your leg lifted with the products they recommend

It's a difficult one. I used to have an agronomist then I tried doing it myself. I joined NIAB TAG and they sent me loads of info. I am now a member of a farmers agronomy group. But it's time consuming, there 's meetings attend and loads of info to sift through and it is by no means straightforward.

I think I will be going back to an independent agronomist.

Having said that, there really is no better than doing it yourself if you fully understand what you are doing. But agronomy is real a full time profession nowadays, not something you fit in your spare time.

So far I have managed to cut the spend down without any disasters, but it isn't a walk in the park.
 
Yes we are p and k free apart from maize starter and I'm working on that.

We are net importers, trying to spread that evenly across crops is an on going effort and requires a whole heap more logistics and organisation than a bit of bagged fert or fibrophos.

The majority of my wheats have had slurry and 250kg/ha nitram only, straw at 60 or 70 quid an acre helps as well, wheat at 100 quid a tonne is achievable even on average ground.

You can drop the maize start if your P indices are up there and get sensible seed:soil contact.

Are you in a position to put digestate or similar onto crops in the spring with a dribble bar?

If you want me to look at your 1 acre of unsprayed wheat I'd be all ears.
 

robbie

Member
BASIS
What is the best way to learn more about sprays as we are basically that dairy business but we grow about 250ac of wheat and barley all to be home feed mainly in rotation with grass
Post your recs, prices and questions here, there's several of us who'll give you our thoughts on things but obviously without actually seeing you farm and crops they can only be opinions but it's still all good imo.
 

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Red Tractor drops launch of green farming scheme amid anger from farmers

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quote: “Red Tractor has confirmed it is dropping plans to launch its green farming assurance standard in April“

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