TB test and selling cows

[Henarar]

We have our herd TB test soon and we have a couple cows to pd
I was wondering if say we jabbed on the Tuesday and got the cows scanned could we sell them to a red market on weds?

 

[GTB]

Don't think you can sell anything between jabbing and reading.

 

[Philip Watkins]

If they're jabbed and not read I think that will class as a failed test.

 

[Tarw Coch]

If they're jabbed and not read I think that will class as a failed test.

Has this changed in recent years? About 5 or 6 years ago I asked our vet about taking some barrens the week of our TB test, he didn't see any problem, we didn't bother jabbing them.

 

[Lovegoodstock]

I thought but may well be wrong, red markets can take cattle untested from holdings not under restrictions, so why not pd first, if empty don't test and take them to be killed, if in calf test them? Not sure of your area and the rules but we have a 60 day window to test, used to do it on 1 day but now do over 3 days, I sent 5 culls during test no problems, obviously on tb sheet added when they were moved off holding to avoid complications their end

 

[Henarar]

We were thinking that this was the case that it was fine as long as we didn't jab them and they were gone from the holding before the end of our test window
after all you don't have to test all your animals on the same day
and if they are sold before they need to be tested you can't test them obviously
I was just checking
@matthew ?

 

[GTB]

It may be different in other regions but I'm pretty sure that if cattle are jabbed here they must be read or it's a failed test. A few years ago we had some fat cattle booked in for the day after jabbing and the vet insisted we put the jabbing day down on the movement date so that he could say they weren't there on day one.

Things have tightened up since bcms and apha computer systems are all linked these days and there's not much leeway for rule bending. Plus ministry vet' can do spot checks and sometimes they do turn up on reading day. I've noticed vet' on general are far more careful nowadays with measuring both top and bottom skins on both days instead of just running cattle through the race on reading day and just having a quick feel.

 

[matthew]

We were thinking that this was the case that it was fine as long as we didn't jab them and they were gone from the holding before the end of our test window
after all you don't have to test all your animals on the same day
and if they are sold before they need to be tested you can't test them obviously
I was just checking
@matthew ?

My understanding is that with a herd test, ALL animals must be presented. If you have purchased preMT stock then an instruction, unless it was very recent, will show on the vet's print out as 'do not test' .

The test is a two part process and again, I understood no 'OFF' movements between the jab day and reading.
Too many things can happen in those two days to make planned cattle exits go wrong.

It may be different in other regions but I'm pretty sure that if cattle are jabbed here they must be read or it's a failed test. A few years ago we had some fat cattle booked in for the day after jabbing and the vet insisted we put the jabbing day down on the movement date so that he could say they weren't there on day one.

That was my understanding too. Your vet was not only accomodating you, he was covering his own ar$e.

 

[Henarar]

My understanding is that with a herd test, ALL animals must be presented. If you have purchased preMT stock then an instruction, unless it was very recent, will show on the vet's print out as 'do not test' .

so what about those that test half there cattle one week and half the next can they not sell any animals after the first test has commenced

 

[Henarar]

I must point out I am not trying to do anything underhand here just trying to save a vet visit

 

[milkloss]

We are testing half our animals one week and the other the next, for our annual test. This works easier for us as any disasters can be sorted on the day and the vet is able to do something else that day that crops up. The cattle are also split in two groups of yards 200 yards apart so lots of moving cattle to try and squeeze in one day.

 

[matthew]

so what about those that test half there cattle one week and half the next can they not sell any animals after the first test has commenced

They first lot will be logged into some database somewhere, I would have thought. And no, they should not be sold until read. If say dairy milkers and youngstock are kept on one holding, then the shut down could, theoretically be that long. Friends I have with 1000 plus cattle do half Monday, half Tuesday and read Thursday / friday. So one week.

I must point out I am not trying to do anything underhand here just trying to save a vet visit

TB testing is fine in theory, but real farms have a habit of throwing spanners in the theoretical works. Defra work on a window box scale. A paved one with plastic cattle. But you knew that, didn't you?

 

[Henarar]

They first lot will be logged into some database somewhere, I would have thought. And no, they should not be sold until read. If say dairy milkers and youngstock are kept on one holding, then the shut down could, theoretically be that long. Friends I have with 1000 plus cattle do half Monday, half Tuesday and read Thursday / friday. So one week.



TB testing is fine in theory, but real farms have a habit of throwing spanners in the theoretical works. Defra work on a window box scale. A paved one with plastic cattle. But you knew that, didn't you?

yes

 

[Henarar]

We are testing half our animals one week and the other the next, for our annual test. This works easier for us as any disasters can be sorted on the day and the vet is able to do something else that day that crops up. The cattle are also split in two groups of yards 200 yards apart so lots of moving cattle to try and squeeze in one day.

so you couldn't sell anything from the start of the first test till the end of the second one then, at least that is my understanding from what matthew has said

 

[Samcowman]

We have sent cattle to slaughter in the middle of the test as long as they aren't logged on the vets computer as being jabbed then there's no problem. I think the problem is an animal being recorded as being jabbed on day 1 and not being there for the reading on day 2 could be seen as 'hiding' a reactor.

 

[milkloss]

so you couldn't sell anything from the start of the first test till the end of the second one then, at least that is my understanding from what matthew has said

Provided it hasn’t been jabbed I think you would be ok. I shouldn’t think our vet actually inputs them on the system till both tests have been done anyway. Not sure if that is the done thing or not but it does give a chance to make sure all animals have been tested and whether a dead one hasn’t been knocked off the system etc.

 

[Henarar]

 

[gone up the hill]

No you cant do this OP.

You can send cattle direct to slaughter between the day they are jabbed upto and including the day you read the test but you cannot jab them on the first day and they must be killed either before or on the day you read the test.

Edit ; the above was the case unless they have changed the rules recently

 

[Princess Pooper]

I must point out I am not trying to do anything underhand here just trying to save a vet visit

Why don't you PD them on reading day? Although will take longer than if done on jab day, will still save you the vet visit.

 

[Henarar]

No you cant do this OP.

You can send cattle direct to slaughter between the day they are jabbed upto and including the day you read the test but you cannot jab them on the first day and they must be killed either before or on the day you read the test.

Edit ; the above was the case unless they have changed the rules recently

I thought a red market was the same as direct to slaughter ?