- Location
- Derbyshire
This might bring on a 'good' debate
- Thread starter romneymarsh
- Start date
- Location
- Derbyshire
I accept your point there Andy but if you look at breeds like Suffolk and Texel - both of which hold their flockbooks on BASCO - you can see that a lot of unrecorded flocks buy the occasional recorded tup as they move forward and vice versa. They are also selecting on visual terminal traits (which will still move the flock forward - but how dast?). Where unrecorded tups enter a recorded flock, the subsequent lambs are recorded and you can see where they sit in the scheme and how that changes. I believe Signet have a graph that shows unrecorded Suffolks compared with recorded Suffolks and their rate of genetic gain for muscling and growth.
That's why the backlash against negative fat has taken place and the algorithms changed because the high index low far bloodlines were going through the breeds quickly even though a small percentage of breeders record. When the big boys started doing it the game changed.
- Location
- Derbyshire
This was it.
The negative fat is now penalised with an ATAN function in the index in most terminal breeds. You want an optimal level and thus very fat or over lean lines are not rewarded with a high index.
Silly question, how do they know?
Sounds a bit like the sheep industry then---
Reducing subsidies
Slim margins
Need's to up it's game
- Location
- Mendips Somerset
I will say with regard ebv etc , do away with the overall number , use the basco charts on sales pens . The overall number is what probably gives the whole job a bad name . hate all the signet numbers with a passion
below is the french document regard indexes , so its easy to select on individual traits
below is the french document regard indexes , so its easy to select on individual traits
Last edited:
- Location
- Welshman living in Nottinghamshire
...if you can read French!!
- Location
- Mendips Somerset
yea but you get the idea with the spider chart to the right ,
- Location
- Montgomeryshire
I find trait ebvs (numbers) a lot easier to follow than those spider chart things. To make it even easier, a coloured bar chart of those trait ebvs is available from Signet, and seems to be the favoured print out now.
I agree that the overall index is just a nonsense, but when I suggested it was outdated and we should be promoting on traits for different systems, I was told that most farmers couldn't/didn't want to understand it.
there is a fine line between confidence and bullshite.
- Location
- Mendips Somerset
I find trait ebvs (numbers) a lot easier to follow than those spider chart things. To make it even easier, a coloured bar chart of those trait ebvs is available from Signet, and seems to be the favoured print out now.
I agree that the overall index is just a nonsense, but when I suggested it was outdated and we should be promoting on traits for different systems, I was told that most farmers couldn't/didn't want to understand it.
i think when we are all looking for a new tup we all are looking for something that will take our own sheep forward or try and correct any deficiencies , the bar chart can only be a good thing for your scheme its easy for the uninitiated to understand . though the spider chart is quite easy to work out inner circle for breed average and stretch the points or not according to evaluation ,
yes traits on differing systems would be a good call ,maybe complicated to administer , the good ol boys and feeders are in denial at what they actually do , so that wont work .
there is a fine line between confidence and bullshite.
Absolutely. You can't bulls**t without it...
and there is plenty on here - sometimes it goes on for pages and pages,life and get one comes to mind - i guess might just take me own advice...
- sometimes it goes on for pages and pages,life and get one comes to mind - i guess might just take me own advice...
ive got one .... im just avoiding it at the moment........
why ?ive got one .... im just avoiding it at the moment........