To mask up or not?

If you want to increase NHS capacity quickly, getting vaccinated would currently seem to be the answer.

This is quite a sobering read:

"Of the Covid patients treated in intensive care in recent months, the majority — nearly 75 per cent according to the latest data — have chosen not to be vaccinated. As Professor Andrew Pollard, director of the Oxford Vaccine Group, put it this week: “This ongoing horror, which is taking place across ICUs in Britain, is now largely restricted to unvaccinated people.”
I understand that the figure is higher in the WM region, and higher still in some ethnic groupings, who will not be vaccinated. Bizarre to me.

Got a motorcycling chum, 2nd Gen here from Kashmir, about 40-45, came very close to meeting his maker this Autumn with Covid complications, and still does not feel the jab is worthwhile... . :unsure:

As I said to a mutual aquaintance who is a medic, Chum 1 was a close contendor for the Darwin Award
 
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Raider112

Member
BBC and Government’s remit is to both avoid panic and protect the population. They don’t want to tell you the truth about human susceptibility to outside malevolent influences, and mortality, which is actually no different to any other animal’s, is that anything could potentially wipe out great swathes of us at any time. The probability at any given time is low but increases as severity decreases. The line between everyone's life and death is a very fine one indeed and one you should not take so lightly. That you dismiss the deaths of so many people so lightly, as you explicitly stated in your recent post, is quite disgusting. Not an attitude we would expect from a civilised, decent and rational person.

No they don't. The BBC once claimed you may be able to catch covid from your dog. That was when I stopped paying the licence fee.

The type of death does matter. A lot of the deaths for those over 80 is not just one singular cause. To pretend that all deaths are tragic and all lives at of equal value is playground stuff. Average age of a covid death is 83. You have to have a least some sense to keep that in perspective. It doesn't mean old people don't matter it means directly resources appropriately rather than pretending everyone is getting seriously ill
 

Raider112

Member
That woman is a well known journalist doctor who has been a big labour campaigner and lockdown fanatic. So she is not totally unbiased, she definitely has committed to a certain viewpoint.

Vaccination still needs to be a choice in my view rather than force.
You saying that the stuff Essex man posts is unbiased?:ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
 

Muck Spreader

Member
Location
Limousin
That woman is a well known journalist doctor who has been a big labour campaigner and lockdown fanatic. So she is not totally unbiased, she definitely has committed to a certain viewpoint.

Vaccination still needs to be a choice in my view rather than force.
What has any of that got to do with what she is dealing with every day. The important thing is to deal with these charlatans lurking on social media, who have propelled some people back to the middle ages in their understanding of medical science.
 

essex man

Member
Location
colchester
What has any of that got to do with what she is dealing with every day. The important thing is to deal with these charlatans lurking on social media, who have propelled some people back to the middle ages in their understanding of medical science.
Yes! Silence the dissenters!
Thought we just needed to do as we are told and leave the science to the scientists!?
 
What has any of that got to do with what she is dealing with every day. The important thing is to deal with these charlatans lurking on social media, who have propelled some people back to the middle ages in their understanding of medical science.

This is not true though. There are a lot of very decent doctors and healthcare professionals being silenced or censored in the name of promoting a singular view. This is not healthy at all. There is no such thing as one science or one viewpoint - remember we had a pandemic plan before and we junked it.

Remember this is a 0.05% average chance of death even if you catch it.
 

Cheesehead

Member
Livestock Farmer
Yes! Silence the dissenters!
Thought we just needed to do as we are told and leave the science to the scientists!?
Yes leave the science to scientists actually actually sounds like a good idea. That is actually something I can agree with you on much better they study things like volcanoes so they can better predict eruptions, work on and design better more efficient and safer nuclear reactors or work on finding better treatments or cures for things like ebola and cancer etc rather me trying knock something's out in the hay shed.

Only have to hear my dad go "oops" while skinning a lamb and see the Heinz chipolatas to know I'd rather a medical doctor perform surgery on me.
 
You saying that the stuff Essex man posts is unbiased?:ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:


Not at all. I'm just saying perspective is needed. But half of you are wetting your knickers about something dispropotionately.

Being cautious or sceptical about a vaccine that was promised to set people free that clearly doesn't stop transmission isn't quackery - doesn't make people anti vax. Expressing that masks are useless at a practical day to day level doesn't mean that covid isn't serious - it just means that the justification for masks isn't very strong.

At what stage do you need to realise that this isn't the disease that it was claimed? Yes its serious for some but its not for the overwhelmingly majority.
 
Assuming that medical treatment is available, which wouldn’t be the case if we all get it at the same time.

We don't all get it at the same time though. A virus is still going to circulate come what may.

Wales has had about 6 covid deaths a day since March average. The type of death that is must matter if we are going to be sensible about it - ie age, comorbidities etc. You need a good reason for turning society upside down for 6 deaths a day in 3 million I'd say.
 
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Highland Mule

Member
Livestock Farmer
We don't all get it at the same time though. A virus is still going to circulate come what may
The rate of growth is a function of the R number, which is itself affected by both the virus itself and also the various factors that society can do to slow down spread. These include lockdowns, vaccines, PPE (including masks) and hygiene. If we ignore all the societal factors, the underlying virus growth rate is assessed by the scientists as being sufficient to overwhelm the capacity of the health service, so yes - we would pretty much “all get it at the same time”.
 
The rate of growth is a function of the R number, which is itself affected by both the virus itself and also the various factors that society can do to slow down spread. These include lockdowns, vaccines, PPE (including masks) and hygiene. If we ignore all the societal factors, the underlying virus growth rate is assessed by the scientists as being sufficient to overwhelm the capacity of the health service, so yes - we would pretty much “all get it at the same time”.

The R number does not necessarily tell you how to manage a disease.


As I say in Wales we've had about 6 deaths a day average since March. What we don't know is the number of those are from care home and hospital attained deaths because that does matter because it means there is a different risk to them than the general population.

Covid is simply working its way through the population.
 

Charlie Gill

Member
Location
Kent
Not at all. I'm just saying perspective is needed. But half of you are wetting your knickers about something dispropotionately.
.....
I'm not sure anyone here is, well I hope they aren't. There's a lot of fun to be had on twitter though if you follow #dontcomply, now that lot are definitely a bunch of big babies :ROFLMAO:
 
I'm not sure anyone here is, well I hope they aren't. There's a lot of fun to be had on twitter though if you follow #dontcomply, now that lot are definitely a bunch of big babies :ROFLMAO:

As I say I've had two vaccines but I definitely defend the right of someone not to have a vaccine if they don't want it. Particularly as vaccines do not reduce transmission to others. This was considered a perfectly normal viewpoint until 12 months ago.

Furthermore we know the vaccines are still in the trial stage
 

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