Trace element drench

[Tim W]

Interesting and logical.
Presume groups A, B & C were run together under the same conditions and challenges?

yes---run as 1 mob
This is the same flock that in a previous year i split in half at 8 weeks and treated 1/2 with bolus to no effect
Hence my thoughts that it is something that needs fixing on a longer term

 

[Stockbeare]

We have been applying TE's to the ground but this year's lambs were as bad as ever.

I applied cobalt sulphate to the grass last year but lambs were still short of cobalt when blood tested. So I have gone back to bolusing.

 

[Downton_shep]

My experience is the same ---i struggle with the mineral status on several farms and have been experimenting with different approaches , i bleed animals regularly in an effort to understand what is going on
Conclusions i have are
1) Drenches are good for a few days/short term boost only
2) Boluses can be useful but as part of a long term plan
3) Once lambs get severely mineral depleted it can be a long journey to get them back to productive status

Latest approach has been a trial with a flock split 3 ways for 3 different treatments
Group A ---ewes bolused at scanning & lambs bolused at 8 weeks
B ---lambs only bolused at 8 weeks
B ----control---no one bolused

Up until 8 weeks old you couldn't see any difference in the groups but after this time it is obvious to the eye and in blood analysis;
The ''A'' group are growing like stink and have good mineral blood results
The ''B'' & ''C'' groups are way behind the ''A'' group
''B'' growing ok but higher FECs and poor bloods
''C'' terrible growth and constant high worm infections , similar bloods to group ''B''

I am monitoring the ewe weights post weaning but it's too early to tell what is going on

This coming season it looks like the best and most cost effective approach for me will be to bolus the ewes at scanning and the lambs at 8 weeks, this should keep minerals at decent levels, reduce health problems and ensure good growth rates
My belief is that low mineral availability in early life has such a detrimental effect on liver/gut/organ development that it takes ages to catch up (if it ever does)

Great post!
Do you bolus the ewes at weaning? To cover them over tupping.

 

[Ffermer Bach]

Trace element services will make you a mix that you mix with water costs about 4 pence per head iirc. Never tried it though. Basically it's the same stuff as they make to put on the ground and is made up to suit your farm (following blood or soil testing)

http://www.traceelementservices.co.uk/index.html

I have heard, cant remember where, that the reason the lambs "do" better after drenching for worms, is not due to the worm drench but the selenium and cobalt added to the drench

 

[neilo]

I've heard of some people making their own trace element drench for sheep, anyone have any info?

Is it worth it? When I do drench anything, which is only ever a short term boost, I've been using this stuff for the last couple of years: https://www.welshfarmsupplies.co.uk/product/sheep-cattle-drench-with-copper/ It seems to work just as well as any of the (much) more expensive brands I've tried and costs 8p/lamb. Can you really make it much cheaper than that?

 

[ford4000]

I have heard, cant remember where, that the reason the lambs "do" better after drenching for worms, is not due to the worm drench but the selenium and cobalt added to the drench

I've only seen cobalt and selenium in white drench and I was told that the levels of them are so low, it's not worth taking into consideration

 

[GTB]

I've only seen cobalt and selenium in white drench and I was told that the levels of them are so low, it's not worth taking into consideration

+1

 

[Downton_shep]

Cobalt sulphate costs about £15 for 500g. Makes enough drench for nearly nine thousand 40kg lambs

 

[wee man]

My experience is the same ---i struggle with the mineral status on several farms and have been experimenting with different approaches , i bleed animals regularly in an effort to understand what is going on
Conclusions i have are
1) Drenches are good for a few days/short term boost only
2) Boluses can be useful but as part of a long term plan
3) Once lambs get severely mineral depleted it can be a long journey to get them back to productive status

Latest approach has been a trial with a flock split 3 ways for 3 different treatments
Group A ---ewes bolused at scanning & lambs bolused at 8 weeks
B ---lambs only bolused at 8 weeks
B ----control---no one bolused

Up until 8 weeks old you couldn't see any difference in the groups but after this time it is obvious to the eye and in blood analysis;
The ''A'' group are growing like stink and have good mineral blood results
The ''B'' & ''C'' groups are way behind the ''A'' group
''B'' growing ok but higher FECs and poor bloods
''C'' terrible growth and constant high worm infections , similar bloods to group ''B''

I am monitoring the ewe weights post weaning but it's too early to tell what is going on

This coming season it looks like the best and most cost effective approach for me will be to bolus the ewes at scanning and the lambs at 8 weeks, this should keep minerals at decent levels, reduce health problems and ensure good growth rates
My belief is that low mineral availability in early life has such a detrimental effect on liver/gut/organ development that it takes ages to catch up (if it ever does)

What minerals are you short of with this flock?

 

[bovine]

To clarify, you've bled lambs a week after a cobalt bolus or drench and they were still low?

Sorry, it was 2am. I'd calved a cow and was having a cup of tea before bed!

Technically both, but I meant drench not bolus.

As has been said, if badly low the bolus may not be enough to correct the deficiency, they provide a steady trickle but fail to boost back to normal. I remember one batch of lambs bled as low, bolused. Still not growing bled again, low but less low. Given drench, bled a month later and good levels. No way that could have been from the drench, simply bolus maintain levels that were lifted by drenching.

 

[hillman]

Cobalt sulphate costs about £15 for 500g. Makes enough drench for nearly nine thousand 40kg lambs

What rate are you mixing that at ??
3/4lb plus 1/4 copper makes 5litres at 20ml per lamb

 

[Downton_shep]

What rate are you mixing that at ??
3/4lb plus 1/4 copper makes 5litres at 20ml per lamb

70g per 5 litres
1ml per 10kg

 

[Tim W]

Great post!
Do you bolus the ewes at weaning? To cover them over tupping.

No ---1 bolus at preg scanning

 

[hillman]

70g per 5 litres
1ml per 10kg

Seems low to what I've been told ..but if it's working

 

[Tim W]

What minerals are you short of with this flock?

Primarily Co, Mn,Se

 

[Downton_shep]

Seems low to what I've been told ..but if it's working

Just following the instructions on the tub

 

[hillman]

Got a pic ?

 

[Downton_shep]

No ---1 bolus at preg scanning

Have you done any trials bolusing pre tupping? Any effect on fertility?

 

[Downton_shep]

Got a pic ?

I nearly took one when I double checked earlier! I'll get one tomorrow.

 

[Tim W]

Have you done any trials bolusing pre tupping? Any effect on fertility?

Don't have a problem with fertility/fecundity in these flocks really so just sticking to the 1 bolus at scanning
Another flock that i share farm was under-performing fecundity wise so we took to bolusing them 1 month pre tupping which made a large difference ---but we did ''up'' the whole management at the same time , i will be quitting the bolus on this flock this year so will wait to see what happens