Trailed vs Self Propelled Sprayer

Location
Cambridge
After watching that video I don't think the height control of the booms is has consistent has our Agrifacs,although it is difficult to see how undulating the ground is on camera.
I don't know, I haven't seen an Agrifac.

As I said in the description, this bit I filmed is the worst part of the farm for a sprayer boom. It's not undulating, it's a natural bowl where the booms needs to adjust 2-3m within a few seconds. It doesn't really show up on the video so you'll have to take my word for it.

When we used to have no boom control (or Norac), I would go over at 10k or less, set the booms very high, and accept that the spray quality wasn't very good.

Anyway, I'm not a Horsch salesman, I'm just putting up a video of a worst case scenario.
 
I think @Clive wanted to see our sprayer booms on some more undulating ground. This is the very worst bit we have for sprayer booms on the farm. If you went over this patch with fixed booms, you would go from them being 1-2m in the air to having an expensive accident pretty quickly. The Horsch isn't absolutely perfect, but it's pretty bloody good.


On a related note, it's fairly windy out there today, especially up on the hill, but having the booms so low really seems to almost eliminate visible drift.

I was thinking today would have been a good day to test the effect of boom height on drift. It was one of those days through the middle of the day where we would normally not spray (BBC was giving 13mph as a figures). As it was we had just some big fields with a growing list of things to do so we went. Tomorrow was looking like another similar day. The difference between being able to spray in 12-13mph winds (as per BBC weather) and not could therefore mean an extra two days of spraying which is not to be sniffed at.

This period has been interesting because it has highlighted the various different pressures / real world problems that are easy to forget when pontificating in the theoretical realm in mid-January. We've been constrained by last weekend's rain in getting pre-ems on (Spray Ranger has done well here, and still wish we had more light land); the wind has been in the wrong direction for some fields given houses which has slowed things up (maybe need to get better at spraying at night!); the Bateman's boom has broken due to spraying off cultivated land (ditch plough and maybe get a Horsch level of boom suspension); we keep trying to reduce our 'to be drilled this spring' figure which diverts manpower; one person with a bad chest infection; Easter (Why did Jesus have to choose that date to die, when he should have realised we would need people around to apply Nirvana?); and frosts keep appearing which hampers the Atlantis. All in all, even with two sprayers, it's remarkable how you can not get everything done as you would ideally like.
 

ajd132

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Suffolk
I was thinking today would have been a good day to test the effect of boom height on drift. It was one of those days through the middle of the day where we would normally not spray (BBC was giving 13mph as a figures). As it was we had just some big fields with a growing list of things to do so we went. Tomorrow was looking like another similar day. The difference between being able to spray in 12-13mph winds (as per BBC weather) and not could therefore mean an extra two days of spraying which is not to be sniffed at.

This period has been interesting because it has highlighted the various different pressures / real world problems that are easy to forget when pontificating in the theoretical realm in mid-January. We've been constrained by last weekend's rain in getting pre-ems on (Spray Ranger has done well here, and still wish we had more light land); the wind has been in the wrong direction for some fields given houses which has slowed things up (maybe need to get better at spraying at night!); the Bateman's boom has broken due to spraying off cultivated land (ditch plough and maybe get a Horsch level of boom suspension); we keep trying to reduce our 'to be drilled this spring' figure which diverts manpower; one person with a bad chest infection; Easter (Why did Jesus have to choose that date to die when he should have realised we would need people around to apply Nirvana?); and frosts keep appearing which hampers the Atlantis. All in all, even with two sprayers, it's remarkable how you can not get everything done as you would ideally like.
Completely up to date with spray and fert here, sometimes you just need to get on with it
 
Completely up to date with spray and fert here, sometimes you just need to get on with it

Being serious though, it does highlight how determined and focused it is necessary to be to keep on top of things. One determined person with one sprayer is probably going to do more acres than two not-very-determined people with two sprayers.
 

ajd132

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Suffolk
Being serious though, it does highlight how determined and focused it is necessary to be to keep on top of things. One determined person with one sprayer is probably going to do more acres than two not-very-determined people with two sprayers.
Or two determined people with one sprayer as is our case.
 
Location
Cambridge
Being serious though, it does highlight how determined and focused it is necessary to be to keep on top of things. One determined person with one sprayer is probably going to do more acres than two not-very-determined people with two sprayers.
To me this shows you still don't get it...it's not about the number of sprayers (or men necessarily). It's about keeping whatever spraying hardware you have doing its job for as long as possible. I.e. it doesn't stop for lunch, or travel back to the farm, or spend time working out what the next load is.

A sprayer sprays, drives to the next field, and sprays that, all day long. Only when you have accomplished this do you think about a bigger machine, or an additional one.

In other words, get a bowser and sort out your logistics.
 

Daniel

Member
To me this shows you still don't get it...it's not about the number of sprayers (or men necessarily). It's about keeping whatever spraying hardware you have doing its job for as long as possible. I.e. it doesn't stop for lunch, or travel back to the farm, or spend time working out what the next load is.

A sprayer sprays, drives to the next field, and sprays that, all day long. Only when you have accomplished this do you think about a bigger machine, or an additional one.

In other words, get a bowser and sort out your logistics.

Sounds like unnecessary effort, why not just get a larger sprayer and do less hours?
 

Brisel

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Midlands
Sounds like unnecessary effort, why not just get a larger sprayer and do less hours?

That depends on how big the existing one is. Mine us 6,000 litres with a 30m boom. I could go to 40+ metres & a chuffing great 11,200 litre trailed one with 400 hp on the front. Would it do many more acres/day? How would that cope in winter on heavy land? What you suggest is fine for someone with a 24m mounted machine with 1200 litre tank. Going bigger is easier.

Can you remind me what your existing setup is please @ajd132 ?

http://www.amazone.co.uk/2656.asp
http://www.chantry-dammann.co.uk/selfpropelled.html
 
Location
Cambridge
Sounds like unnecessary effort, why not just get a larger sprayer and do less hours?
You can if you want, but in my opinion that's pretty symptomatic of why most farms don't make nearly as much money as they could.

We've gone from two sprayers to one, kept the same (or greater) ha/hr output, and increased general productivity because the bowser man can do other things. As happened yesterday, when I could help out with drilling logistics in between filling the sprayer.
 
Location
Cambridge
Sounds like unnecessary effort, why not just get a larger sprayer and do less hours?
It's also important to realise that keeping the sprayer going all the time does NOT mean one man working non stop. In fact it's less work when done properly as everyone can have lunch and breakfast breaks without slowing down the operation at all. Which is not the case when working as a bunch of lone wolves.
 

ajd132

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Suffolk
That depends on how big the existing one is. Mine us 6,000 litres with a 30m boom. I could go to 40+ metres & a chuffing great 11,200 litre trailed one with 400 hp on the front. Would it do many more acres/day? How would that cope in winter on heavy land? What you suggest is fine for someone with a 24m mounted machine with 1200 litre tank. Going bigger is easier.

Can you remind me what your existing setup is please @ajd132 ?

http://www.amazone.co.uk/2656.asp
http://www.chantry-dammann.co.uk/selfpropelled.html
It's just a 4000l Bateman tank and induction hopper on a mount we had made, which can go into a trailer or on a loading deck. Currently on an old trailer. Always use it fert and usually for fungicide spraying but we have less to do this year so may use it abit less for spraying.
People are putting considerable amounts more than us through one sprayer, I really don't see how you can get seriously behind unless you're on 5000+ with veg and potatoes through one sprayer.
early mornings and evenings are the best time for spraying so just get up earlier!
 
To me this shows you still don't get it...it's not about the number of sprayers (or men necessarily). It's about keeping whatever spraying hardware you have doing its job for as long as possible. I.e. it doesn't stop for lunch, or travel back to the farm, or spend time working out what the next load is.

A sprayer sprays, drives to the next field, and sprays that, all day long. Only when you have accomplished this do you think about a bigger machine, or an additional one.

In other words, get a bowser and sort out your logistics.

I wasn't attempting to argue about numbers of sprayers or people in that bit; instead I was saying that by being more on the ball, you can gain a lot of extra spraying time without any change in the logistics / number of sprayers or people. In any case, I am still unconvinced that it would be a better idea for us to ditch one sprayer in favour of a bowser. I don't think that we would double the output of one of the sprayers by using a bowser (I accept that you might, but it's obviously farm specific), whereas by using two sprayers (at a cost which may well be less than the cost of one sprayer plus a bowser) I think that we get closer to doubling our output.
 

ajd132

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Suffolk
How have you calculated the expected yield loss from the decreased accuracy of solid? What have you assumed the decrease in accuracy to be?
Why would there be decreased accuracy? Spoken to numerous people successfully spinning stuff 36m, if it won't Spin that far I can melt it anyway.
 
Why would there be decreased accuracy? Spoken to numerous people successfully spinning stuff 36m, if it won't Spin that far I can melt it anyway.

Obviously sub-optimal dosing round the edges of the fields if you're being responsible. I worked out roughly that we've got about 50ha of field edges around the whole farm (taking a 6m width).

How many of those people are regularly tray testing their spreaders over the different products that they use and conditions that they operate in? Or do they assume that no striping means they they're doing it successfully? I bought a proper set of Amazone trays last year and when I did test the spread pattern it wasn't that impressive and that was at 24m with new vanes and supposedly high quality product. Had meant to do a lot more this spring but haven't yet.
 

ajd132

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Suffolk
Obviously sub-optimal dosing round the edges of the fields if you're being responsible. I worked out roughly that we've got about 50ha of field edges around the whole farm (taking a 6m width).

How many of those people are regularly tray testing their spreaders over the different products that they use and conditions that they operate in? Or do they assume that no striping means they they're doing it successfully? I bought a proper set of Amazone trays last year and when I did test the spread pattern it wasn't that impressive and that was at 24m with new vanes and supposedly high quality product. Had meant to do a lot more this spring but haven't yet.
I've already planned To still do headlands with liquid and we have a set of trays
 
I've already planned To still do headlands with liquid and we have a set of trays

Good idea. I tried to be clever when drilling the OSR this year with the Mzuri placing fert and upped the rate round the first two times round the headland. At the moment some of the rape round the edge is much bigger, and so hopefully come harvest it might have evened up nicely.

Will be interesting to see what you find with the trays.
 

SFI - What % were you taking out of production?

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Red Tractor drops launch of green farming scheme amid anger from farmers

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As reported in Independent


quote: “Red Tractor has confirmed it is dropping plans to launch its green farming assurance standard in April“

read the TFF thread here: https://thefarmingforum.co.uk/index.php?threads/gfc-was-to-go-ahead-now-not-going-ahead.405234/
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