Trimble FMX

[Cruiser_79]

At the moment I use the FMX with Fieldlevel of the guy where I rent the pullscraper. We work with a VRS correction via 4G but height is not stable enough for finish grading. I have a Topcon Hiper HR rover with internal uhf radio that I can use as base as well. So I would like to have my own fmx with internal radio. What protocol is the internal radio using? With my base I can choose rtcm and CMR+. Other question is or I can receive galileo and Beidou on the fmx. The Trimble dealer says no but some other guys say that with other receivers than the AG25 it should be possible. Who knows something about this?

 

[Northern farmer]

AG25 is an antenna, the Trimble FMX screen has an integrated receiver. Google says it is "Glonass ready", only dual constellation receiver (hope you have Glonass unlocked).

Topcon HR seems to support all four constellations, GPS, Glonass, Galileo and Beidou. Does not help much with FMX except that you can have the base closer to the receiver. I believe it would be easiest to use the Hiper HR via NTRIP rather than trying to make the two work over radio.

Upgrading the FMX would give a more significant accuracy improvement.

 

[Cruiser_79]

AG25 is an antenna, the Trimble FMX screen has an integrated receiver. Google says it is "Glonass ready", only dual constellation receiver (hope you have Glonass unlocked).

Topcon HR seems to support all four constellations, GPS, Glonass, Galileo and Beidou. Does not help much with FMX except that you can have the base closer to the receiver. I believe it would be easiest to use the Hiper HR via NTRIP rather than trying to make the two work over radio.

Upgrading the FMX would give a more significant accuracy improvement.

If I use my hr as a base I can only send by radio, it's not a NTRIP caster. I would like to set a base in the field on a tripod, so really close to the machines. In the past I worked abroad and I always had my Topcon HiperII base and rover with me. Worked good and more accurate and faster than the vrs corrections. Some guys I worked with still use mobile base station for their cat graders for better accuracy.
But nowadays the mobile network in the Netherlands and the rtk networks have much improved. In the agriculture hardly anyone use radio Rtk. Only when the elevations gets important the vrs stations seems a bit wobbling

 

[BeefFarmer77]

Agreed that your own base will likely give you the height accuracy you require, since the height component of GPS accuracy is always 1.5x worse than lat/long, VRS via Ntrip wont get down to less than 1cm in height like your own base will since the baseline will be much less with your own base.

Also adding Galileo and Beidou might not improve accuracy much, likely just improve robustness of tracking satellites/less loss of lock near trees etc

 

[Flatlander]

I’m using an fmx with a wm drain unlock. Very similar to field level I believe. I use it for open drains across fields. I use a base station for an rtk source and position it within the field in working in. Get a base station and you’ll not pay subscription again and have the accuracy needed fir elavation work.

 

[Northern farmer]

I’m using an fmx with a wm drain unlock. Very similar to field level I believe. I use it for open drains across fields. I use a base station for an rtk source and position it within the field in working in. Get a base station and you’ll not pay subscription again and have the accuracy needed fir elavation work.

He already has a base and wants to use it at the field he is working. Please help how to feed RTK from Hiper HR to FMX.

 

[Northern farmer]

If I use my hr as a base I can only send by radio, it's not a NTRIP caster. I would like to set a base in the field on a tripod, so really close to the machines. In the past I worked abroad and I always had my Topcon HiperII base and rover with me. Worked good and more accurate and faster than the vrs corrections. Some guys I worked with still use mobile base station for their cat graders for better accuracy.
But nowadays the mobile network in the Netherlands and the rtk networks have much improved. In the agriculture hardly anyone use radio Rtk. Only when the elevations gets important the vrs stations seems a bit wobbling

Radio RTK would be the most simple approach for a mobile base on a tripod on the location of work. I'm surprised no Trimble experts helping on the topic.

The Hiper HR seems to have wifi too. Would it have sufficient coverage if you installed a wifi client at the rover? I assume FMX can take a serial input for RTK corrections.

If wifi range is not sufficient, perhaps use two Xbee long range radios:

Radio module Long Range (LR)

Long Range Radio Module uses an external antenna to send serial port data up to 10 km or 6 miles. This RF module is compatible with XBee socket

www.ardusimple.com

or a Hiper HR compatible radio (I understand your Hiper HR has the internal radio) for the rover to avoid a mix of Topcon and Trimble radios.

 

[Cruiser_79]

Agreed that your own base will likely give you the height accuracy you require, since the height component of GPS accuracy is always 1.5x worse than lat/long, VRS via Ntrip wont get down to less than 1cm in height like your own base will since the baseline will be much less with your own base.

Also adding Galileo and Beidou might not improve accuracy much, likely just improve robustness of tracking satellites/less loss of lock near trees etc

That's exactly what i hope for, that the baseline is stable. With the VRS it happens that suddenly you have to raise your design 6-7 cm to get loss of your scraped material. Not a real problem but you don't know exactly what you're doing and in the end it can happen that you have to bring your material to the other side of the field because your cut/fill balance isn't correct anymore.

My topcon rover has a digital UHF radio that can send corrections with RTCM2.X, RTCM3.X, CMR, CMR+. I would like to know what protocol the FMX is using, I can't find it in the specs. I worked on a Trimble SPS855 base station with my rover, so it should be possible I think. The SPS855 is more a earthmoving model, don't know or the agriculture systems work with the same protocols.

 

[Cruiser_79]

Radio RTK would be the most simple approach for a mobile base on a tripod on the location of work. I'm surprised no Trimble experts helping on the topic.

The Hiper HR seems to have wifi too. Would it have sufficient coverage if you installed a wifi client at the rover? I assume FMX can take a serial input for RTK corrections.

If wifi range is not sufficient, perhaps use two Xbee long range radios:

Radio module Long Range (LR)

Long Range Radio Module uses an external antenna to send serial port data up to 10 km or 6 miles. This RF module is compatible with XBee socket

www.ardusimple.com

or a Hiper HR compatible radio (I understand your Hiper HR has the internal radio) for the rover to avoid a mix of Topcon and Trimble radios.

I could check or I can hook that xbee radio's to both my Topcon HR and the FMX. In that case I won't need the internal radio's of the FMX and HiperHR? Building in a radio in the FMX was another 600 euro's they said. And than I have to hope they know what brand and type it is, and that it will receive data from my HR with UHF radio. Blending different makes of radio's is a disaster I know from the past...
I checked the Hiper HR settings and for an external radio I can only choose satel radios, SRL-35 and RE-S1 radio. I can also go for 'undefined' and hope it will be okay if the rtk format and frequency are correct.

I see on that site ardusimple.com that they sell base/rover kits as well. Would that be any good? Price is quite reasonable if i compare that to Topcon or Trimble base stations. I don't care what brand is on my stuff, if it does the job and it is accurate enough any brand is good for me.

 

[clbarclay]

I would like to be able to give an explanation for how to get a FMX to work using NMEA from an ardusimple f9p, but alas I never managed got mine talking to each other before fixing the ag25.

 

[e3120]

I would like to be able to give an explanation for how to get a FMX to work using NMEA from an ardusimple f9p, but alas I never managed got mine talking to each other before fixing the ag25.

I was told, but never got round to confirming, that even if you could get a Trimble to accept an external signal, it wouldn't use it to steer. They don't want to make it easy.

I do have 1 Trimble sending to another over TCIP, for section control.

 

[clbarclay]

I know about the FMX not allowing auto steer with a non trimble external receiver, but I don't use the fmx to steer anymore. It mostly only works an isobus fert spreader now. All other functions should still work though for isobus implements or grade control.

 

[Cruiser_79]

I was told, but never got round to confirming, that even if you could get a Trimble to accept an external signal, it wouldn't use it to steer. They don't want to make it easy.

I do have 1 Trimble sending to another over TCIP, for section control.

I'm not sure, but I thought it would still run if you send/transmit CMR or CMR+ protocol.

 

[Cruiser_79]

I saw another brand that sells base stations with radio and NTRIP server. It's a Fieldbee L2. Sends with RTCM 3.x protocol. Does anyone know something about it this brand? For time being I could use my Hiper HR if it works, but if someone else drives the pull scraper and pull grader I often have to go surveying myself with the quadbike and topcon stuff. Than it would be ideal if I can send guys with their own base to the field.

 

[Terrier]

I could check or I can hook that xbee radio's to both my Topcon HR and the FMX. In that case I won't need the internal radio's of the FMX and HiperHR? Building in a radio in the FMX was another 600 euro's they said. And than I have to hope they know what brand and type it is, and that it will receive data from my HR with UHF radio. Blending different makes of radio's is a disaster I know from the past...
I checked the Hiper HR settings and for an external radio I can only choose satel radios, SRL-35 and RE-S1 radio. I can also go for 'undefined' and hope it will be okay if the rtk format and frequency are correct.

I see on that site ardusimple.com that they sell base/rover kits as well. Would that be any good? Price is quite reasonable if i compare that to Topcon or Trimble base stations. I don't care what brand is on my stuff, if it does the job and it is accurate enough any brand is good for me.

FMX will use CMR or CMR+. You will also need to configure the base radio protocols to be the same as the FMX internal radio and set the same baud rates.
CMR is only the RTK format and not the radio protocol.

 

[Cruiser_79]

FMX will use CMR or CMR+. You will also need to configure the base radio protocols to be the same as the FMX internal radio and set the same baud rates.
CMR is only the RTK format and not the radio protocol.

Okay I thought the Fmx would use rtcm as well. For my Topcon base not a problem, it can transmit and receive CMR, CMR+ and rtcm2.x and 3.x. Only that Fieldbee base station can only send rtcm the datasheet says.
Baudrate, modulation (gmsk, 4fsk) are also some things I have to check in the FMX.
The fieldbee can be used as NTrip base, would that make the baseline much better than a virtual base or will radio still be best?

 

[Terrier]

Okay I thought the Fmx would use rtcm as well. For my Topcon base not a problem, it can transmit and receive CMR, CMR+ and rtcm2.x and 3.x. Only that Fieldbee base station can only send rtcm the datasheet says.
Baudrate, modulation (gmsk, 4fsk) are also some things I have to check in the FMX.
The fieldbee can be used as NTrip base, would that make the baseline much better than a virtual base or will radio still be best?

It might do RTCM, I’m not sure. Earlier Trimble receivers such as the 252 didn’t and then the 262s did. The FMX might coincide with the slightly later ones.
I think you will get it to work with the Fieldbee.