US Chicken imports?

[Happy]

Where is the gain for British farming in this trade deal? Sounds like America first second and third and UK there to be plundered.

Fox & Gove will happily sell UK Ag down the river for a bit of tub thumping and flag waving about any sort of trade deal they can pull off with countries outwith the EU.

They need to pull of a face saving excercise of some sort for the mess they've made of Brexit. Growth in the EU growing increasigly faster than here. Bank of England saying it's concerned about personal debt levels being too high again. Those guys need a big good news headline about what the UK can achieve in the world on it's own and have decided a trade deal with the US is it.

Unfortunately @mouse is right about who the only winner in that arrangement will be.

 

[caveman]

Truth is.
All the big fish in the AG UK pond, who have swallowed up the minnows by pushing the boundaries of every production criteria in their quest for efficiency and market share grabbing, are about to come face to face with a bigger, leaner and hungrier shark.
I will shed no tears.

 

[Blaithin]

Truth is.
All the big fish in the AG UK pond, who have swallowed up the minnows by pushing the boundaries of every production criteria in their quest for efficiency and market share grabbing, are about to come face to face with a bigger, leaner and hungrier shark.
I will shed no tears.

They'll have a hard time ditching regulations fast enough to even catch up to the ones who didn't have regulations to begin with.

 

[thesilentone]

I also see major issues on Trade deals where animal welfare and food standards are concerned.

The UK has some of the highest standards in the World, even though we don't always practice what we preach, however we cannot go backwards, the people would not allow it.

 

[caveman]

The people will allow it through their purse.
You just have to make sure they have the chance to differentiate between home produced or imported, mass produced crap.

 

[thesilentone]

The people will allow it through their purse.
You just have to make sure they have the chance to differentiate between home produced or imported, mass produced crap.

See my first comment in this topic.......

We need to turn this into an opportunity !!!

 

[MOG]

........................

The UK has some of the highest standards in the World, ...........................................

Ah those will be those pesky rules and regulations forced on us by Brussels. Once free of the shackles of the EU we can ditch all those and be a truly international player. I think you will find this was a major reason in many peoples minds when voting last year.

 

[caveman]

Ah those will be those pesky rules and regulations forced on us by Brussels. Once free of the shackles of the EU we can ditch all those and be a truly international player. I think you will find this was a major reason in many peoples minds when voting last year.

Why just ditch "higher standards".
The freedom to choose lower acceptable standards, if you so wish, is good though.

 

[thesilentone]

The key is to turn the situation to your advantage - and stop bitching !!

Whatever you view, we are here now, and the window of opportunity has opened. We need to take advantage of this, as soon as possible.

One the one hand we must continue to promote high welfare standards, if anything improve them, this is a brand.

On the other, the political game may mean trading where the same high standards do not apply, again we need to exploit this by letting the housewife decide. How, by having a ' in your face ' Local Produce section in every supermarket.

NOT items spread around, but all placed together and presented (by marketeers) .

The Housewife can be the engine that drives this if we can build on the high welfare brand. If she demands our produce, the Supermarkets would capitulate.

Hell, most Supermarkets are now just cold stores and nothing else, selling un-ripe, un-seasonal produce they can buy cheap.

Farm Sundays, Farm Parks, can become part of the food-responsible way of engaging the public, here is a chance to take back some small control of the market.

Dovetail this to Mr Gove ' 'Work for your Subsidies' by investing in even higher standards, and he gets a ' Get out of Jail Card '

 

[Guiggs]

They can keep their cheap meat but I'll have their cheap oil!

 

[johnspeehs]

Ah those will be those pesky rules and regulations forced on us by Brussels. Once free of the shackles of the EU we can ditch all those and be a truly international player. I think you will find this was a major reason in many peoples minds when voting last year.

Being free of the EU won't make an ounce of difference if you want to sell food on the world market, all the same rules and regulations plus a whole heap more will still have to be complied with, the red tape is here to stay.

 

[Derrick Hughes]

Why just ditch "higher standards".
The freedom to choose lower acceptable standards, if you so wish, is good though.

Lower Standards is the mass market . If your happy to supply a selected few the so be it

 

[Cowabunga]

Hell, most Supermarkets are now just cold stores and nothing else, selling un-ripe, un-seasonal produce they can buy cheap.

THAT is the reality and the housewife has already voted with her purse to buy from supermarkets, especially the cheaper supermarkets.

Good luck selling the bulk of UK produced food any other way. Any other way is only a niche that a small minority of UK producers can benefit from. The vast majority will need to compete at the supermarkets where price generally rules as illustrated above.

If the housewife is offered cheap US chicken and pork plus beef from South America at 20 to 40% cheaper than UK farmers can supply, then that is what she will buy. Therefore UK produce would be forced to reduce prices by 18 to 38% to compete or pack up and go fishing and sleep in cardboard boxes.

This will suit many very well indeed. The 'environmentalists' and vegetarian/vegan lobby, will be laughing all the way as UK livestock is decimated along with farming families.

Face it, nobody cares as long as wildlife thrives. Note that famers will have to earn any subsidies in future by supplying 'environmental benefits' not from producing food. That means farming badgers and butterflies not cattle and sheep. I wonder whether farming businesses and families can survive only on badger-subsidy income?

 

[ThatsSomeSheep]

Cheap US chicken = yet another post Brexit nail in coffin of Scottish sheep sector.

We can't all find niche markets. Most of us are just producing protein for inclusion in curry etc and a dwindling number of people who enjoy a Sunday roas. If our competitor proteins become even cheaper we ain't got much of a future.

Wish I could see the future through rose tinted Brexiteer glasses instead!

TSS

 

[thesilentone]

Cowabunga, You are right to a degree, however that is assuming all people buy with price being the only consideration, thankfully that is not the case.

Every day people buy from family butchers, bakers and market gardeners, as well as Marks and Spencer food-halls.

Not everyone buys on the lowest price alone !!!

How do people decide what type of wine to buy, given the 100's of choices, and that is the key CHOICE...

However, convenience has a value, being able to buy everything under one-roof makes things easy, it is up to the Supermarkets to ensure we buy in bulk, and not treat them like a corner shop.So they turn it around and tell US that WE say we want produce to last (which is like asking a Turkey if it likes Christmas) we obviously agree if asked " Do you want fruit and veg that lasts " as opposed to " Do you want fruit and veg that is immature, un-ripe and tasteless"

Change can be painful, even worse if you just sit back and allow it to happen and do not become engaged in your, and your children's future.

Remember, nothing is forever.....

 

[Cowabunga]

Cowabunga, You are right to a degree, however that is assuming all people buy with price being the only consideration, thankfully that is not the case.

Every day people buy from family butchers, bakers and market gardeners, as well as Marks and Spencer food-halls.

Not everyone buys on the lowest price alone !!!

How do people decide what type of wine to buy, given the 100's of choices, and that is the key CHOICE...


Change can be painful, even worse if you just sit back and allow it to happen and do not become engaged in your, and your children's future.

Remember, nothing is forever.....

The vast majority of people do buy on price though, hence the supermarket price wars and the rise of Aldi and whatever the other one's called. That's just how it is.
Given the choice, some 90% of consumers will choose to do the vast majority of their shop at the cheapest convenient supermarket and that is not going to change because you want it to. That is their choice.
I'm not allowing it to happen and did not want this shambles of Brexit in the first place and cannot imagine what the people that do are thinking will be of benefit to them, unless they specifically want cheap food, which along with 'immigration' is probably what they actually voted for. Not forgetting the millions and millions extra for the NHS of course.

As it happens, there has been a specific Lord's report this lunchtime warning of a food "race to the bottom", so I am not the only person worrying about this. Not many people in the Common's will be and certainly not those on the Left or to the Right.

 

[caveman]

THAT is the reality and the housewife has already voted with her purse to buy from supermarkets, especially the cheaper supermarkets.

Good luck selling the bulk of UK produced food any other way. Any other way is only a niche that a small minority of UK producers can benefit from. The vast majority will need to compete at the supermarkets where price generally rules as illustrated above.

If the housewife is offered cheap US chicken and pork plus beef from South America at 20 to 40% cheaper than UK farmers can supply, then that is what she will buy. Therefore UK produce would be forced to reduce prices by 18 to 38% to compete or pack up and go fishing and sleep in cardboard boxes.

This will suit many very well indeed. The 'environmentalists' and vegetarian/vegan lobby, will be laughing all the way as UK livestock is decimated along with farming families.

Face it, nobody cares as long as wildlife thrives. Note that famers will have to earn any subsidies in future by supplying 'environmental benefits' not from producing food. That means farming badgers and butterflies not cattle and sheep. I wonder whether farming businesses and families can survive only on badger-subsidy income?

Can't see its all a bad thing.
Perhaps the big boys who are pumping out the surplus will cut back and use smaller herds and flocks and realise the profit in using them as management tools to realise other benefits that the tax payer pays for.....a more traditional way of farming...... instead of empire building and trying to eliminate his neighbour.
You never know.
He may even have then produced a product to put on the shelf that commands a premium.

 

[Cowabunga]

Can't see its all a bad thing.
Perhaps the big boys who are pumping out the surplus will cut back and use smaller herds and flocks and realise the profit in using them as management tools to realise other benefits that the tax payer pays for.....a more traditional way of farming...... instead of empire building and trying to eliminate his neighbour.
You never know.
He may even have then produced a product to put on the shelf that commands a premium.

'Premium' is only ever going to be a small niche. I fail to see how and why otherwise sensible and rational people are blinded to this fact. The vast bulk of food that is sold will never be sold at a premium. The vast majority of UK farm produce is and always will be sold to feed the masses, not to feed the rich minority who are willing to pay a premium price for their food.

This is coming from me, a farmer that does actually sell a significant proportion of produce at a small premium to a small specialist premium cheese producer. However, I am a realist who can see further than my nose.

 

[Pasty]

If you go up against the big boys in a commodity market, you have no complaints. Nobody asked you to. The biggest factor is price. Get used to it or get out. I've had to do it in other industries. I used to sell IT equipment and do very nicely for a while. Sort of was an online sales pioneer. But then Amazon started selling my products cheaper at retail than my trade distributor could sell to me. Unbelievable at first, so secret was the price list and so hard was it to get an account with the mighty Computer 2000. Where was my bail out? Where was my subsidy to allow me to continue? I HAD to do something else. Boo hoo. Poor me. So I adapted into another sector and we carried on.

You know why I don't sell chicken meat? I've got enough of it. It's because I cannot possibly compete with a guy who thinks 100,000 birds in a shed, never seeing the light of day except through a 'window' is high welfare because he read that in a trade magazine. I wouldn't put animals through that and I wouldn't raise the Frankenstein breeds they do, given the welfare issues surrounding the parent stock (what? I just buy the chicks, not my problem) and the massive mortality rates they suffer. It may be that I may look pretty hard and find a small market for people who care how their meat is raised and thus pay me 4 times the price for a far tastier and superior product, but to be honest, I'm not sure it's worth it.

 

[caveman]

'Premium' is only ever going to be a small niche. I fail to see how and why otherwise sensible and rational people are blinded to this fact. The vast bulk of food that is sold will never be sold at a premium. The vast majority of UK farm produce is and always will be sold to feed the masses, not to feed the rich minority who are willing to pay a premium price for their food.

This is coming from me, a farmer that does actually sell a significant proportion of produce at a small premium to a small specialist premium cheese producer. However, I am a realist who can see further than my nose.

Well done you.