Vaccinating badgers

[Jdunn55]

Hi all, I've got my countryside stewardship officer wanting to sign me up to vaccinate my badgers, I have no idea if this is good or bad. It's free but I have also heard in the past that if you vaccinate an infected badger itll shed tb much more - is this true? Currently tb free on this farm but the badger population is massive

Thanks

 

[Cowmansam]

I wouldn’t be inviting any badger hugger animal rights types round my place if it was me

 

[bluepower]

Hi all, I've got my countryside stewardship officer wanting to sign me up to vaccinate my badgers, I have no idea if this is good or bad. It's free but I have also heard in the past that if you vaccinate an infected badger itll shed tb much more - is this true? Currently tb free on this farm but the badger population is massive

Thanks

Personally I would be very cautious, particularly if NE are involved. Make sure you know what you are agreeing too and the implications of allowing this to happen. As we all know vaccination has not had good results on other trials. Look what happened at NT Killerton estate.

 

[holwellcourtfarm]

@matthew is the person for chapter and verse on this.

My understanding is that the vaccine is very unreliable in healthy badgers and utterly ineffective in already infected ones.

That's before the issue of how to ensure a high enough proportion of the population are done and they get boosters when needed.

Effective vaccination of cattle is feasible, effective vaccination of badgers is, I belive, a farce.

 

[primmiemoo]

If you have lots of badgers, but no TB, then you have healthy badgers. For Pete's sake don't do anything to disturb your healthy badgers!

 

[matthew]

It would be good if it worked.
It does not work.
Several trials have been done, both in England, Wales and Rep of Ireland - none had the slightest effect on TB in cattle, and in one trial where they actually pm'd pre screened vaccinated badgers, all had lesions and all were shedding. One (D313) was so badly infected that he was euthanised ahead of time.

In these trials all the badgers were pre screened for existing disease. In practise this does not happen.

And then there's a herd of deer:

After the cat, a herd of deer culled.

Despite acknowledging the success of the farmer led badger culls, with cattle breakdowns and slaughterings down by an average of over 50 per...

bovinetb.blogspot.com

and a domestic cat.

More on the cat

We quoted the Abstract from a paper published last week, on the infection of a domestic cat with the Danish strain of m.bovis, found in ...

bovinetb.blogspot.com

The fact that BCG can only damp down tuberculosis over many generations is not a good reason for vaccinating cattle. It has not worked in humans for over 100 years, and in the face of the challenge our cattle face from increasing environmental contamination, means it will not work here.

It has been tried both here and in Africa and failed miserably.

BCG vaccination - cattle

And now to cattle BCG vaccines: heavily promoted by guitarist, pop idol and astrophysicist Dr. Brian May as 'only months away' with no obv...

bovinetb.blogspot.com

I suppose you could compare it to the current covid jabs. The efficacy rate of which is around the high 80 per cent. Which means that up to 20 per cent of people could still get a hefty dose of SARS-Cov-2 and need hospitalisaton. Of the 80 percent 'successfully' vaccinated, they too can contract CV19, and share it. But the theory is that they don't become so ill as to need hospitalisation.

Trials have shown that badgers vaccinated with BCG still get lesions, still shed TB bacteria and still infect cattle. And worse than that, in at least one now documented instance, the strain of TB bacteria infecting a third party, was shown to be the Danish strain 1331 - unique to badger BCG.

 

[JSmith]

Hi all, I've got my countryside stewardship officer wanting to sign me up to vaccinate my badgers, I have no idea if this is good or bad. It's free but I have also heard in the past that if you vaccinate an infected badger itll shed tb much more - is this true? Currently tb free on this farm but the badger population is massive

Thanks

There’s only one way to vaccinate a badger a stop TB, an it’s not by injecting it with a needle!!

 

[cider_eater]

They need to be kept under control one way a another!!
if anyone had a struggling grandson went farming and lost the animals got rejected How would you feel ?

 

[organicguy]

If you vaccinate badgers you will not be allowed to cull nor your neighbours within a buffer zone.
There is no evidence of vaccinating badgers to be effective, they rarely turn up for their booster on time.

Don't do it.

 

[LTH]

Don’t do it, your potentially introducing the disease into a healthy population. And the folk that want to vaccinate badgers as also the ones who want to stop a cull. Unless you have a problem leave them.

 

[matthew]

Don’t do it, your potentially introducing the disease into a healthy population. And the folk that want to vaccinate badgers as also the ones who want to stop a cull. Unless you have a problem leave them.

Agree with that, but try to discourage the chuck outs (old, sick and young males) from taking up residence. Keep a single group on as much land as they need without scrapping for territory. Management.

 

[holwellcourtfarm]

Just pondering.....

"Research" is only undertaken where someone will find it. This funding all the badger research have, so far, had vested interests not helpful to the cattle industry.

Maybe we cattle farmers should fund our own badger research? We could find genuinely neutral research on the social structure and migration patents of current UK badger populations. Perhaps even get a robust picture of their impact on other species as well.....

 

[matthew]

Just pondering.....

"Research" is only undertaken where someone will find it. This funding all the badger research have, so far, had vested interests not helpful to the cattle industry.

Maybe we cattle farmers should fund our own badger research? We could find genuinely neutral research on the social structure and migration patents of current UK badger populations. Perhaps even get a robust picture of their impact on other species as well.....

Agree with all of that.
The TB blog rests on Owen Paterson's 538 parliamentray questions and their answers, posed in 2003 / 4.
Seventeen long years ago.

The research which led to those answers was solid and unbiased from scientists who had a salary, not a bung. It still stands.

The problem we have now is that a few generations of 'hopefuls' on, the establishments have to earn their keep. And in the main, that means repeating old research - and either skewing the methodology to get the result desired by their current paymasters (RBCT) or fudging the conclusion enough to repeat the exercise. (PCR)

Read what the diminutive John Bourne told the Efra committee about 'his' trial in 2007. But he and his cohorts were more than happy to trouser the cash and deliver. Unfortunately for them, the culling trial did deliver significant benefits, especially if you happened to farm in the centre of a zone.

"This is the answer ....

... now, what was the question?" The ISG final report from the RBCT Badger Dispersal Trial was categoric in its recommendations. Badger cu...

bovinetb.blogspot.com

I am very uneasy about the OP's initial info:
"I've got my countryside stewardship officer wanting to sign me up to vaccinate my badgers "

On what grounds would such a person ask this? Is it / was it part of the original stewardship agreement, or like gamma ifn used in cull areas, snuck in after the signing? Is it voluntary?

And what could be the reason for such an add on? (Other than NE's new CEO - one Tony Juniper's links to other badgery groups. And of course if the culls do end as is proposed, NE need a new toy and data for their staff to monitor and control.)

 

[Ffermer Bach]

We have all heard the expression "go woke, go broke", well I think this badger vaccination is an example of this on a national scale! I would not allow vaccination here if I was asked.

 

[Ffermer Bach]

Just pondering.....

"Research" is only undertaken where someone will find it. This funding all the badger research have, so far, had vested interests not helpful to the cattle industry.

Maybe we cattle farmers should fund our own badger research? We could find genuinely neutral research on the social structure and migration patents of current UK badger populations. Perhaps even get a robust picture of their impact on other species as well.....

I have posted on another thread, a friend was doing her Phd and it was funded by a major industrialist, when the results were not as were wanted the funding was withdrawn for the research. The final year was undertaken unfunded (and the results stood as the science indicated), now the interesting question is, how many researchers would be willing to continue with their funding withdrawn and how has this altered type of action altered research outcomes?

 

[roscoe erf]

Just pondering.....

"Research" is only undertaken where someone will find it. This funding all the badger research have, so far, had vested interests not helpful to the cattle industry.

Maybe we cattle farmers should fund our own badger research? We could find genuinely neutral research on the social structure and migration patents of current UK badger populations. Perhaps even get a robust picture of their impact on other species as well.....

maybe have some kind of farmers union that could help set this up eh..........................................

 

[7610 super q]

maybe have some kind of farmers union that could help set this up eh..........................................

Yes, some sort of national union. We could call it The Union of National Farmers.
Only proper farmers to be affiliated though. Those that tell us RT takes only 10 minutes to do, those that get their telehandler Loler inspected, and those that plant seeds badly without ploughing will be barred from joining.

 

[roscoe erf]

Yes, some sort of national union. We could call it The Union of National Farmers.
Only proper farmers to be affiliated though. Those that tell us RT takes only 10 minutes to do, those that get their telehandler Loler inspected, and those that plant seeds badly without ploughing will be barred from joining.

I think you might have something there I wonder why its not been thought of up till know

 

[Hfd Cattle]

Yes, some sort of national union. We could call it The Union of National Farmers.
Only proper farmers to be affiliated though. Those that tell us RT takes only 10 minutes to do, those that get their telehandler Loler inspected, and those that plant seeds badly without ploughing will be barred from joining.

Agree with you 99%of the time ...however if my Telehandler hadn't got a Loler certificate on it last Feb I would have been in serious trouble . It was just lucky that I bought it with one on it and it was still valid . It expires next week and I will renew it ........ previously I would never have bothered ! It doesn't stop accidents but it would have been a huge hammer for the HSE to hit me with . All they could do me for was a warning letter for not having my seat belt on ....Tossers !

Back to badgers .....

 

[Man_in_black]

Hi all, I've got my countryside stewardship officer wanting to sign me up to vaccinate my badgers, I have no idea if this is good or bad. It's free but I have also heard in the past that if you vaccinate an infected badger itll shed tb much more - is this true? Currently tb free on this farm but the badger population is massive

Thanks

Absolutely f**k that. Only injection I'd support is a lead one.