what grinds your gears - Welsh Politics

[Ysgythan]

You've got to admit it sounds like it.

Plaid led by a non Welsh speaker (well learner) who does an even better job than Corbyn for claiming every public expenditure as an "investment"

Hating English people on an historic basis? That's what sport is designed to settle. Politics isn't sport. I have to use my vote to stand up for what I believe in. I can't expect anybody else to.

 

[smcapstick]

Then why vote for anybody ever again? What hope of scrutiny in our favour if we don't vote for it?

But the deed is done?

It's like voting Tory today because Labour agreed to invade Egypt in 1956.

 

[Ysgythan]

But the deed is done?

It's like voting Tory today because Labour agreed to invade Egypt in 1956.

No it's not. The starting gun has been fired, it's all now about how we run the race.

 

[7610 super q]

Imagine what the French are feeling with Brexit...

Hmmmm....the same French that tried to block our entry into the EU in 1972 ?

 

[pycoed]

Of course they are, because most voters in Wales used to claim to be socialist at least.

But you're missing the point. Welsh Tory MPs would do even less for Wales than Labour as they would just get lost in the numbers and be whipped to vote against anything remotely decentralist. The Great Repeal Bill is a power grab for Westminster, the Celtic nations have to resist it on a pure democratic basis to ensure powers from Brussels in develoved matters pass to us. To do that they need non Tory MPs.

If you voted UKIP you have the same decentralist non conformist instincts as Plaid voters.

The way to get Welsh politics to be more right wing is to vote Tory in the Assembly elections.

Ah! But you see I don't want the powers from Brussels back to "us". I want them back to Westminster. I want to abolish the Assembly (as did 44,000 others who voted for this last WAG election, despite no campaigning ).
It's a completely unnecessary tier of government: we've just got rid of Europe as one tier, we had already got rid of county/district splits & have unitary local government. Next step abolish WAG, reduce unitaries to 8-10 & there's HUGE money savings in Wales. 80AM's costs saved plus 12-14 X 75 councillors' costs, 12-14 less Chief Execs on £150K+ etc etc. What's not to like?

 

[phillipe]

Access to the single market. 76% of Wales' exports are to the EU, the highest proportion of any part of the British Isles. Exports are 86% of our economy.

Ah! But you see I don't want the powers from Brussels back to "us". I want them back to Westminster. I want to abolish the Assembly (as did 44,000 others who voted for this last WAG election, despite no campaigning ).
It's a completely unnecessary tier of government: we've just got rid of Europe as one tier, we had already got rid of county/district splits & have unitary local government. Next step abolish WAG, reduce unitaries to 8-10 & there's HUGE money savings in Wales. 80AM's costs saved plus 12-14 X 75 councillors' costs, 12-14 less Chief Execs on £150K+ etc etc. What's not to like?

and they are wanting to increases AM s by 70 odd ,more wasted money,have a count how many layers of burocracy between you and PM,there are loads,

 

[phillipe]

Ah! But you see I don't want the powers from Brussels back to "us". I want them back to Westminster. I want to abolish the Assembly (as did 44,000 others who voted for this last WAG election, despite no campaigning ).
It's a completely unnecessary tier of government: we've just got rid of Europe as one tier, we had already got rid of county/district splits & have unitary local government. Next step abolish WAG, reduce unitaries to 8-10 & there's HUGE money savings in Wales. 80AM's costs saved plus 12-14 X 75 councillors' costs, 12-14 less Chief Execs on £150K+ etc etc. What's not to like?

WAG when voted on was 50.7 percent for and 49.3 against ,a lot of people including me think its a huge waste of money

 

[Ysgythan]

@pycoed @skinnyhoskins

You may WANT to be a county of England, but I don't.

Your faith in Westminster rule in touching but sadly misguided. Where else but the Assembly is Wales, its culture, traditions and language going to be given a modicum of respect? Why should we give up hard earned concessions that some English regions also have? How would we compete with those English regions, let alone Scotland and Northern Ireland under your plan?

What you call layers of beureaucracy is actually an insurance policy for this part of the country from the oppressive urban majority.

 

[phillipe]

@pycoed @skinnyhoskins

You may WANT to be a county of England, but I don't.

Your faith in Westminster rule in touching but sadly misguided. Where else but the Assembly is Wales, its culture, traditions and language going to be given a modicum of respect? Why should we give up hard earned concessions that some English regions also have? How would we compete with those English regions, let alone Scotland and Northern Ireland under your plan?

What you call layers of beureaucracy is actually an insurance policy for this part of the country from the oppressive urban majority.

thats why we all have one vote,you vote your way and i will vote my way,i am a born and bred welshman,and i think the wag is a waste ,you think different,what ever the results of election i will say fair enough move on ,will you?

 

[Ysgythan]

thats why we all have one vote,you vote your way and i will vote my way,i am a born and bred welshman,and i think the wag is a waste ,you think different,what ever the results of election i will say fair enough move on ,will you?

Why would you think I wouldn't? It's part of what I was saying above, you accept the context and work within it. There's nothing wrong with wanting change though, as we both do.

 

[pycoed]

@pycoed @skinnyhoskins

You may WANT to be a county of England, but I don't.

Your faith in Westminster rule in touching but sadly misguided. Where else but the Assembly is Wales, its culture, traditions and language going to be given a modicum of respect? Why should we give up hard earned concessions that some English regions also have? How would we compete with those English regions, let alone Scotland and Northern Ireland under your plan?

What you call layers of beureaucracy is actually an insurance policy for this part of the country from the oppressive urban majority.

I want to be a county of BRITAIN not England!!
WAG is an "insurance policy" we can't afford. My 10 years experience of WAG at work is that it was concerned only with the "oppressive urban majority" as you call it, except that it ranged from Bridgend to Newport & going a little north of Llandaff, perhaps, to Ponty.
I have little confidence in Westminster, but a lot less in Cardiff. What I want is a lot less government full stop.

 

[Ysgythan]

I want to be a county of BRITAIN not England!!

Did you deliberately drop the "r"?

 

[Sussex Martin]

Access to the single market. 76% of Wales' exports are to the EU, the highest proportion of any part of the British Isles. Exports are 86% of our economy.

Do you honestly believe that access to Europe will be non existent? Do you believe in Her Juncker's sabre rattling?
I'm an optimist, you are very pessimistic, the solution will lie somewhere in between but will be a lot better for all if TM goes to the negotiating table with a strong hand.

 

[7610 super q]

Now look what's happened.....we've got a Welsh politics section.

 

[linga]

Of course they are, because most voters in Wales used to claim to be socialist at least.

But you're missing the point. Welsh Tory MPs would do even less for Wales than Labour as they would just get lost in the numbers and be whipped to vote against anything remotely decentralist. The Great Repeal Bill is a power grab for Westminster, the Celtic nations have to resist it on a pure democratic basis to ensure powers from Brussels in develoved matters pass to us. To do that they need non Tory MPs.

If you voted UKIP you have the same decentralist non conformist instincts as Plaid voters.

The way to get Welsh politics to be more right wing is to vote Tory in the Assembly elections.

The Great Repeal Bill is certainly a power grab, removing power from Brussels to our elected Parliament. Now, the UK Parliament is certainly not perfect but its where power for the UK should lie.
Many ministers including the Prime Minister have clearly stated that any power currently devolved to the devolved Countries will stay there so the Welsh Assembly will lose no power and will probably gain additional powers after the UK leaves the EU

 

[roscoe erf]

Now look what's happened.....we've got a Welsh politics section.

that wont last long

 

[Ysgythan]

Do you honestly believe that access to Europe will be non existent? Do you believe in Her Juncker's sabre rattling?
I'm an optimist, you are very pessimistic, the solution will lie somewhere in between but will be a lot better for all if TM goes to the negotiating table with a strong hand.

She'll get her mandate and her strong hand from England. She doesn't need welsh MPs, needs to be kept honest, Labour and the Lib Dems aren't up to it. UKIP irrelevant.

 

[Ysgythan]

Minister have clearly stated that any power currently devolved to the devolved Countries will stay there so the Welsh Assembly will lose no power and will probably gain additional powers after the UK leaves the EU

That's why we need Plaid MPs, to ensure theses aren't just fine words.

 

[Ysgythan]

that wont last long

So far it's me verses.

 

[GTB]

I tend to vote for Plaid in the general election simply because my little vote won't make much difference to uk govt policy but a plaid mp can bring up welsh issues to his/her hearts content without having to worry about towing the party line. Besides, only the Lib Dems and Plaid have any chance of winning in this constituency and I don't see our incumbent lib dem doing much for us.