What moisture to start harvesting at?

[Feldspar]

Last year we managed to get harvest finished in reasonable time, but then the weather was kind and we had a fair % of the farm in spring crops which were pretty thin.

This year we have a much larger % in winter crops, the spring crops are not as ropey as last year, the area we have to cut is up 5% and the weather at harvest may be worse. That said, the combine did break down quite a bit last year, and I'm hoping we won't lose quite as much time this year.

Normally we only start cutting when cereals get below 15%, beans about the same and OSR below 9%. In years gone by this normally has meant that we are often the last to finish harvest in our area, and I think we do lose some quality as well as creating knock-on effects onto the establishment / preparation for the next crop.

With that in mind, I would like to get through harvest more quickly this year, and I think that means cutting at higher moistures.

So my question is, given that aim, how should you think about moisture levels and when to start cutting? Do you just raise the threshold up and say that I am going to start cutting at 17% for cereals and beans, and 11% say for OSR and then start at that moisture right from the beginning?

At that stage, obviously, you don't know how much the combine is going to break down, or what the weather is going to be like at all. My grandfather used to have a number of sayings, but one of his more sensible ones was, "Better to cut at 17% in the beginning of August than at 20% at the end of September."

The obvious downsides of having a very simplistic rule is that you are insensitive to changing conditions. There is clearly no point in hammering through OSR at 13% if you have a run of fine weather ahead and your wheat isn't ready yet. Against that, however, it's very easy to take it easy to start with, then have a run off unexpectedly bad weather, and then you're even more quickly into a fire-fighting situation.

One other way of thinking about it might be this: we normally have about, say, 25% of our acreage left to cut after the time I think is the ideal time to have finished. To cut that 25% within that ideal time we need to be cutting for an extra x number of hours over and above what we otherwise would have done. Therefore, as you go through the harvesting season, you have an aim to cut for x hours more at some point or other. It doesn't mean you end up actually achieving this exactly, but this might be a better way of thinking about it than a simple rule of 'start cutting at 17%'.

It seems the mentality with harvesting is that people run their operation so that they have a backlog of fields to cut -- that is, the optimum time to harvest those fields has already passed. With spraying on the other hand, we aim to get each job done at the optimum time, and think we're failing if we have a backlog of things to do. The question is whether the two different approaches are justified? I wonder whether we should instead be cutting quickly enough and for long enough that it isn't unusual to be sitting around waiting for a few more fields to become optimally fit.

A rambling post, I know, and I'm sure the answer to all of this is that experience and a feeling for the situation is what primarily dictates the strategy through harvest. Nevertheless, I'd be interesting to see how others think about this topic. Thanks in advance!

 

[Zippy768]

Interesting question, and of course, not one you can know if you answered correctly until harvest is over.
Obviously the aim is to finish by the end of August, as days do take a sharp turn into Sept.
I wouldn't harvest osr above 9% and aim for 18% on cereals. As you say, you really can't account for unforseen problems, combine etc. Ultimately if simply comes down to the weather and the forecaster in the end

 

[Feldspar]

The particular feature of our typical harvest that I think is really something to be avoided is when we end up hanging around until 2 o'clock in the afternoon waiting for the moisture to drop. When this happens, it's often difficult to all go off and do other jobs, and if that does happen sometimes it means that you miss half an hour or even an hour when the moisture is actually low enough. Not only does this mean four people waiting on the harvest side, but it then has a knock on effect on the cultivations behind too. (If ploughing I think there is such an importance to get things ploughed as early as possible to allow as much weathering as possible. If direct drilling there is slightly less of a pressure.)

I remember two harvests ago we were in wheat and had stuff fit to cut. We had two dull days where the moisture stuck at about 17 to 18% and didn't drop below that. Our neighbour was cutting on both those days, and we did nothing. That is the sort of opportunity that I think we must take to shorten our harvest.

The more problematic situation is where you get a day where the moisture will get down to say 14%, but it starts at 18% in the morning. Often you will have moved to a new farm with one store to fill. In this instance cutting slightly wetter for us comes with more problems. We have no continuous drier; instead we have nearly all drive on air floors. To stick 60-100t of wet grain at 18% in the back of a shed which will otherwise have 14-15% grain in is not something we want to do. You can tip the odd trailer load to the side of the store and then mix it in, but with these high output combines if you cut for a few hours you've got more than a few trailer loads.

In this second situation it does seem more difficult to pinch extra hours here and there. It is farm dependent though. In our main yard, especially this year where we have more of just one variety, we have a number of different sheds, and so it's easier to segregate moisture. Cut at 18% in the morning and stick that in the new store with the gas burners, then switch to an older store to put in grain once it gets below 15%. Then when it gets dark switch back to the new store again.

 

[Pieces_of_Eight]

All depends on your drying capacity/costs and what rotational pressure you have.

Every situation will be different.

 

[Farmer Miggins]

You have indicated that you are bulk drying, your grandfather was right about 20% in September, the warm air in August carries so much more moisture out of the grain even if it went in store wet and you most likely won't even need your burners. If the wheat is fit to cut, even if there is green straw, get all that you can with the sun on your back @ 18% or even higher if the forecast is unsettled.

 

[SilliamWhale]

You have indicated that you are bulk drying, your grandfather was right about 20% in September, the warm air in August carries so much more moisture out of the grain even if it went in store wet and you most likely won't even need your burners. If the wheat is fit to cut, even if there is green straw, get all that you can with the sun on your back @ 18% or even higher if the forecast is unsettled.

But on the flipside often here wheat is properly ripe till september. So in august we get a heavy rain and it will take 3 days to come back down to dry but in september it can only be a day.

 

[Brisel]

Mine isn't ripe yet!





I'll get me coat

 

[Flat 10]

I think your moisture threshold rises as you have more fit crops in front of you. Of course you can be a bit proactive and if the forecast is for a week of rain say you might push on at higher moistures the day before.........
I think you have worked this out for yourself. If I was in your position I would buy a mobile drier/drying trailer for emergency situations. I would also start off cutting at 1% over at all times with your acreage to cut, regardless of harvest situation.

 

[Badshot]

I've got sod all to cut in comparison, but I guess I do the cults, spraying etc too by myself, and I'm happy to cut at 17%. Its all bread wheat, and I put solar panels on the grainstore which equal my drying costs every year.

 

[DRC]

Interesting question, and of course, not one you can know if you answered correctly until harvest is over.
Obviously the aim is to finish by the end of August, as days do take a sharp turn into Sept.
I wouldn't harvest osr above 9% and aim for 18% on cereals. As you say, you really can't account for unforseen problems, combine etc. Ultimately if simply comes down to the weather and the forecaster in the end

Disagree with this, as up here more wheat is cut in September, which is often a much better month than August, and the wheat is properly ripe.

 

[yellow belly]

Grow early varieties so wheat is ready in early august this can save 5%of costs compared to late varietie
Moisture meters are inaccurate on fresh harvested grain
One year we harvested the first half dry even though half the readings off the combine gave high mc readings the local coop lab gave use the true mc several locals could not find any grain dry enough

Once it is fit damp morning grain can be mixed find a way
With on floor dryers it is possible to dry the back bays

Wheat If it is under 18 % I combine but it needs to be ready if need be a couple of loads go through the mobile dryer
Pedistals will keep 17 % grain till out loading and dried then
Rape 12 % if the mobile is available
Better wet early than wet late

 

[Brisel]

Last year we managed to get harvest finished in reasonable time, but then the weather was kind and we had a fair % of the farm in spring crops which were pretty thin.

This year we have a much larger % in winter crops, the spring crops are not as ropey as last year, the area we have to cut is up 5% and the weather at harvest may be worse. That said, the combine did break down quite a bit last year, and I'm hoping we won't lose quite as much time this year.

Normally we only start cutting when cereals get below 15%, beans about the same and OSR below 9%. In years gone by this normally has meant that we are often the last to finish harvest in our area, and I think we do lose some quality as well as creating knock-on effects onto the establishment / preparation for the next crop.

With that in mind, I would like to get through harvest more quickly this year, and I think that means cutting at higher moistures.

So my question is, given that aim, how should you think about moisture levels and when to start cutting? Do you just raise the threshold up and say that I am going to start cutting at 17% for cereals and beans, and 11% say for OSR and then start at that moisture right from the beginning?

At that stage, obviously, you don't know how much the combine is going to break down, or what the weather is going to be like at all. My grandfather used to have a number of sayings, but one of his more sensible ones was, "Better to cut at 17% in the beginning of August than at 20% at the end of September."

The obvious downsides of having a very simplistic rule is that you are insensitive to changing conditions. There is clearly no point in hammering through OSR at 13% if you have a run of fine weather ahead and your wheat isn't ready yet. Against that, however, it's very easy to take it easy to start with, then have a run off unexpectedly bad weather, and then you're even more quickly into a fire-fighting situation.

One other way of thinking about it might be this: we normally have about, say, 25% of our acreage left to cut after the time I think is the ideal time to have finished. To cut that 25% within that ideal time we need to be cutting for an extra x number of hours over and above what we otherwise would have done. Therefore, as you go through the harvesting season, you have an aim to cut for x hours more at some point or other. It doesn't mean you end up actually achieving this exactly, but this might be a better way of thinking about it than a simple rule of 'start cutting at 17%'.

It seems the mentality with harvesting is that people run their operation so that they have a backlog of fields to cut -- that is, the optimum time to harvest those fields has already passed. With spraying on the other hand, we aim to get each job done at the optimum time, and think we're failing if we have a backlog of things to do. The question is whether the two different approaches are justified? I wonder whether we should instead be cutting quickly enough and for long enough that it isn't unusual to be sitting around waiting for a few more fields to become optimally fit.

A rambling post, I know, and I'm sure the answer to all of this is that experience and a feeling for the situation is what primarily dictates the strategy through harvest. Nevertheless, I'd be interesting to see how others think about this topic. Thanks in advance!

Every farm is different, but it's a good discussion topic.

Lots of farmers start 3 days before the grain is really ripe, grinding away at greenery. Start 2 days earlier than that and it gets expensive when you bung the combine up... If you have a crop that needs to be cut as soon as it is ripe like milling wheat, malting barley or oats then starting a bit sooner is hard to resist.

I'm moving the start time for everyone from 7.30am to 7am in an effort to get going earlier, then stopping 1/2 hour earlier at night. Having blown down, serviced up then had a coffee it is frequently 9.30am before putting the machine into gear only to find that the grain is already down to 17%. Blowing off at night might be less itchy for the driver who would otherwise be sat in the seat, covered in shite all day! A head torch will be a good investment IMO.

I see one obvious gain to be had with your system. Cut wetter! Unless the fan isn't man enough or you are grossly overloading the store then you can dry up to 20% moisture wheat with underfloor air. Instead of spending and extra £10k/year on a bigger combine to cut less hours at lower moisture, why not spend half that each year on upgrading fan sizes or fitting modulated gas burners to the stores so you can dry wetter grain?

I agree with comments above about picking a mixture of varieties with different maturity scores. This will help spread harvesting out. What does a day's combining cost? 10 hours at £220/hr for the combine, 2 trailers @ £35/hr each then a storeman and fork lift @ £35/hr. That's £3250/day which covers a the yield difference of a RL variety with 2% lower score than what you would have got. Factor in an extra day in August to prepare the land for the following crop, longer days...

Grain losses - Have you ever been on a Claas operator's course? Near the end of the day Ed Miller (I know he doesn't do these any more) gets a spread sheet out that shows what a combining gang costs per hour then plays around with the grain loss % to show how you could finish harvest 3-4 days earlier. The cost savings really add up to something worth discussing. You and I talked about thsi last summer & you sent me a copy of a spreadsheet you knocked up to calculate combine grain losses.

 

[franklin]

At 17% in early August would be a no as its probably not dead enough to thresh nicely.

 

[bobk]

Under 18% here , as @silverfox points out we rarely start before september , but we will this year .

 

[shakerator]

Last year we managed to get harvest finished in reasonable time, but then the weather was kind and we had a fair % of the farm in spring crops which were pretty thin.

This year we have a much larger % in winter crops, the spring crops are not as ropey as last year, the area we have to cut is up 5% and the weather at harvest may be worse. That said, the combine did break down quite a bit last year, and I'm hoping we won't lose quite as much time this year.

Normally we only start cutting when cereals get below 15%, beans about the same and OSR below 9%. In years gone by this normally has meant that we are often the last to finish harvest in our area, and I think we do lose some quality as well as creating knock-on effects onto the establishment / preparation for the next crop.

With that in mind, I would like to get through harvest more quickly this year, and I think that means cutting at higher moistures.

So my question is, given that aim, how should you think about moisture levels and when to start cutting? Do you just raise the threshold up and say that I am going to start cutting at 17% for cereals and beans, and 11% say for OSR and then start at that moisture right from the beginning?

At that stage, obviously, you don't know how much the combine is going to break down, or what the weather is going to be like at all. My grandfather used to have a number of sayings, but one of his more sensible ones was, "Better to cut at 17% in the beginning of August than at 20% at the end of September."

The obvious downsides of having a very simplistic rule is that you are insensitive to changing conditions. There is clearly no point in hammering through OSR at 13% if you have a run of fine weather ahead and your wheat isn't ready yet. Against that, however, it's very easy to take it easy to start with, then have a run off unexpectedly bad weather, and then you're even more quickly into a fire-fighting situation.

One other way of thinking about it might be this: we normally have about, say, 25% of our acreage left to cut after the time I think is the ideal time to have finished. To cut that 25% within that ideal time we need to be cutting for an extra x number of hours over and above what we otherwise would have done. Therefore, as you go through the harvesting season, you have an aim to cut for x hours more at some point or other. It doesn't mean you end up actually achieving this exactly, but this might be a better way of thinking about it than a simple rule of 'start cutting at 17%'.

It seems the mentality with harvesting is that people run their operation so that they have a backlog of fields to cut -- that is, the optimum time to harvest those fields has already passed. With spraying on the other hand, we aim to get each job done at the optimum time, and think we're failing if we have a backlog of things to do. The question is whether the two different approaches are justified? I wonder whether we should instead be cutting quickly enough and for long enough that it isn't unusual to be sitting around waiting for a few more fields to become optimally fit.

A rambling post, I know, and I'm sure the answer to all of this is that experience and a feeling for the situation is what primarily dictates the strategy through harvest. Nevertheless, I'd be interesting to see how others think about this topic. Thanks in advance!

Wheat / beans 18%
Barley / Oats. 17

Will cut the first 2 at night , last 2 during day as most will be ready together this year, plan blocks accordingly

 

[limestone brash]

Barley best cut before it's fit as when it is properly fit only needs a heavy shower for the heads to start going down

 

[fudge]

Do you have a record of your average moisture content at harvest over the past 5 years? If that figure is above 15% I would start sooner since on average you know you will have to accept wetter grain at some point in the harvest.

 

[Breakthru]

Lucky boys, if it goes through the combine its fit. wait for nirvana that you describe and the tail end is lost. The secret is as stated above, air, which has natural heat in Aug early Sept, so the earlier you start up here the better.

 

[yellow belly]

I would always go for a bigger combine than invest in a bigger dryer
when it is dry go like hell

most of my wheat is with varietys with a negative figure for earliness the last 3 years I have had more than a weeks earlier start which has bot half the wheat combine before the mid august rain that puts things back to September

in the 1980s 90 % of varieties were this early and harvest was always early and yields higher

 

[glasshouse]

I always started 2 days before it was really fit, in case of breakdowns which sometimes happened.
shove the first few loads throught the drier just to get it cranked up and find all the repairs we forgot to do over summer.
In scotland a drier is more important than a combine.