Wheat drilling 2020

[SilliamWhale]

I think all this chit chat of agronomists leading us up the garden path etc is all a bit hyperbolic.

Look you grow your plant and you makes your choices. You can get a good yield sometimes from no fungicides and minimal herbicides and no nitrogen sometimes. But equally it can go the other way and you can end up with a diseased loads of shitty chickweed.

I've done it all ways over the years (grown plenty of unsprayed cereals under enviro schemes - sometimes good, sometimes terrible) and I've done rolls royce sdhi x 2 and all the ferts and sometimes it can be barnstorming and sometimes not so much.

Its still fundamentally simple - your first couple of ton of wheat are the cheapest to grow but it is still generally cheaper to invest a bit more and have those relatively more expensive couple of tons to the acre as well.

I'm not a big fan of Brix as a measurement. For me it just measures sugars. The evidence between brix and fungal pressure is not strong imv

 

[ajd132]

I think all this chit chat of agronomists leading us up the garden path etc is all a bit hyperbolic.

Look you grow your plant and you makes your choices. You can get a good yield sometimes from no fungicides and minimal herbicides and no nitrogen sometimes. But equally it can go the other way and you can end up with a diseased loads of shitty chickweed.

I've done it all ways over the years (grown plenty of unsprayed cereals under enviro schemes - sometimes good, sometimes terrible) and I've done rolls royce sdhi x 2 and all the ferts and sometimes it can be barnstorming and sometimes not so much.

Its still fundamentally simple - your first couple of ton of wheat are the cheapest to grow but it is still generally cheaper to invest a bit more and have those relatively more expensive couple of tons to the acre as well.

I'm not a big fan of Brix as a measurement. For me it just measures sugars. The evidence between brix and fungal pressure is not strong imv

I don’t think agronomists have, the path was started through necessity to produce more food after the wars and has grown into a billion or trillion dollar industry now run by a few companies agriculture around the world has become pretty reliant upon.

 

[SilliamWhale]

I don’t think agronomists have, the path was started through necessity to produce more food after the wars and has grown into a billion or trillion dollar industry now run by a few companies agriculture around the world has become pretty reliant upon.

Hmm.

Well I suppose there is one element of it that chemistry is so expensive to develop that only big boys can do it and that has potential limitations at the moment. Same for things like combines and tractors - only a handful of companies can actually afford to develop these things.

But if you truly believed it (or at least were anti-it) then why are you getting into bed with them? You have plenty of acres - why not grass it down and grow beef and lamb from it all? Much less corporate influence

 

[ajd132]

Hmm.

Well I suppose there is one element of it that chemistry is so expensive to develop that only big boys can do it and that has potential limitations at the moment. Same for things like combines and tractors - only a handful of companies can actually afford to develop these things.

But if you truly believed it (or at least were anti-it) then why are you getting into bed with them? You have plenty of acres - why not grass it down and grow beef and lamb from it all? Much less corporate influence

I just want to be less reliant upon them, I’m not anti. I’ve seen people significantly reduce their fertiliser and chemical usage and not lose yield. I want to do this so I can make more money, to put it simply.

 

[texelburger]

Ah , but what were they last year ?

Haven't a clue.

 

[Warnesworth]

Ok, bear with me here. In my earlier days of farming, I was terrified of not getting land worked in time to weather for a seedbed. This was the day of the Simba DD packer. So we would chase the combine around slooshing clay into various sized chunks, and "packing" them into fairly loose ridges for the weather to get into, then work in front of the drill.

Two things seemed apparent - that more bf grew in the trough of the pressed ridges, and secondly big rain didn't soak into the soil evenly but ran almost around the clods and settled at the point where cultivated soil met uncultivated. After big rain, if you walked on it the top was drybbut you could hear the slurp of wet underneath. The same went for overwintered ploughing which looked like it was drying on top, but was "chocolate pudding" because all the water was trapped at the point where the soil density changed the greatest. Untouched stubble dries fairly quickly.

Since we often "need" some cultivation for best yield / enough tilth to drill / remove wheelings I now go from stubble to proper seedbed asap. So cultivator and power harrow at the same time, or disc/ press then roll. Overly loose seems to be worse for weed chit, drying, and the drill works better in well consolidated soil.

Not scientific. Just seems to be how it appears.

What you are describing is exactly what we know, if you want to destroy the natural water flow through the soil (up and down), cultivate it.

 

[teslacoils]

What you are describing is exactly what we know, if you want to destroy the natural water flow through the soil (up and down), cultivate it.

Fine line though. I've drilled straight in with a disc drill in autumn and it's been like driving over a brick. Also used a Tyne drill which worked better but still not right. Compromise is getting a shallow tilth early and rolling it tight. Adds a little more flexibility. What I had a fortnight ago was unchitted shed oats on a chuck of iron hard soil. Now I've 40mm of tilth with loads of volunteer oats and barley up. Happy that while it's not perfect, it's working and paying the bills.

 

[DrWazzock]

Grass ley that we are supposed to be ploughing down for wheat is like reinforced concrete. Tractor has blown its head gasket anyway now. Told them we should have left it alone and let it.

 

[thorpe]

the big arable operators would laugh at us , but the beef operation has overtook wheat for 2 years now, what are we doing wrong?

 

[DrWazzock]

the big arable operators would laugh at us , but the beef operation has overtook wheat for 2 years now, what are we doing wrong?

For us it comes down to weather and soil type. 2018 harvest drought. 2019 ok, 2020, say no more. Nothing seems very reliable any more on the arable front including the machinery. Old masseys ran for years trouble free. Buy secondhand now and it always comes with a stack of problems that take several years to work through.

 

[d williams]

Wheat into grass and bean stubble

 

[d williams]

Wheat into grass and bean stubble

 

[teslacoils]

Wheat into grass and bean stubble

What drill? Do you get enough consolidation in the troughs?

 

[d williams]

Mzuri yes seems firm enough may give it a second pass with roller if we have some Light rain and Frey’s back up end of the week

 

[teslacoils]

Mzuri yes seems firm enough may give it a second pass with roller if we have some Light rain and Frey’s back up end of the week

Thought so. We used to roll at ninety degrees to get it firm in the troughs for osr.

 

[redbaron]

Thought so. We used to roll at ninety degrees to get it firm in the troughs for osr.

You must enjoy a bum massage!!

 

[teslacoils]

You must enjoy a bum massage!!

Doesn't everyone?

 

[Chae1]

the big arable operators would laugh at us , but the beef operation has overtook wheat for 2 years now, what are we doing wrong?

What is your beef operation?

Interested in how your making money! Most won't have past 2 years.

 

[thorpe]

What is your beef operation?

Interested in how your making money! Most won't have past 2 years.

15 to 20 month bullocks any conti r-u- ad lib home grown mix ad lib fodder beet or potatoes 150 to 200 days only tates & protien bought in family labour we are here anyway looking after the arable. we dont buy those 60 to 90 day cattle cant see the margin in them.

 

[d williams]

15 to 20 month bullocks any conti r-u- ad lib home grown mix ad lib fodder beet or potatoes 150 to 200 days only tates & protien bought in family labour we are here anyway looking after the arable. we dont buy those 60 to 90 day cattle cant see the margin in them.

What price do you put on home grown cereals?? Market value ?? Or cost to grow plus a margin