cropmaster
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- pwllheli
Who's at the national this year ?
- Thread starter ploughman61
- Start date
My point exactly
Words fail me!
cropmaster
Member
- Location
- pwllheli
Yes I had the least points for that finish
Alderslade and Brewer had a bit not ploughed on their finishes and Chappells had bits fallen in but haven't seen any points
cropmaster
Member
- Location
- pwllheli
cropmaster
Member
- Location
- pwllheli
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Dream on Harry with your utopian thoughts. The general consensus of opinion is that the seminars have done more harm than good. As for signing off new starters then who is to sign them off? The individuals conducting the seminars I think not. Therein lies the problem because some of them are the people creating radically bad scores which bear no relationship to the ploughing. I could think of many occasions where a new aspect should be introduced - foul and abusive use of a scoresheet just so the wrong’uns can be weeded out and prevented from judging.
It’s not just the judging but the whole points system that needs a radical overhaul. The current scoresheet has never really been changed as it allows winners to be picked.
Look to Southern Ireland, World and European rules. Herein lies the answer. Not in their entirety but enough good points drawn from all of them and we would have the best score sheet. Biggest drawback to this is that it would not be ploughmen creating it but the family firm which is largely why we are debating this in the first instance.
rusty nuts
Member
I know a lot of good judges who could not even spell semanore.
Could not help but wonder ‘what’s one o’ them Russian smoking jars with rubber tubes got to do with ploughing’
You are confused. It is one of them Russian tea urns fitted with flags to signal when the tea is readyCould not help but wonder ‘what’s one o’ them Russian smoking jars with rubber tubes got to do with ploughing’
My ideas may be a dream indeed, but they are better than the nightmare we now have. Other sports work this system, but they also have a controlling body, with teeth, to enforce it.
As for signing off new starters then who is to sign them off? The individuals conducting the seminars I think not. Therein lies the problem because some of them are the people creating radically bad scores which bear no relationship to the ploughing. I could think of many occasions where a new aspect should be introduced - foul and abusive use of a scoresheet just so the wrong’uns can be weeded out and prevented from judging.
It’s not just the judging but the whole points system that needs a radical overhaul. The current scoresheet has never really been changed as it allows winners to be picked.
Look to Southern Ireland, World and European rules. Herein lies the answer. Not in their entirety but enough good points drawn from all of them and we would have the best score sheet. Biggest drawback to this is that it would not be ploughmen creating it but the family firm which is largely why we are debating this in the first instance.
Seminars have turned up one problem in that many ploughmen now know how bad some judges are, the usual lack of technical knowledge exhibited by the local landowner, is now obvious, whereas before both ploughmen and judge were of the same awareness. This is causing a build up of angst, and verbal attacks by ploughmen on judges and stewards are becoming more common.
I may be viewing through rose tinted glasses, but I feel incompetence is the cause of many odd results, I cant believe that most would risk their integrity in order to make sure his favourite ploughman won, and those that do, would be much more skilful in making the scores look right. For example, just award max points for the opening, in a close class that would be enough, and by the time questions are being asked, the evidence is buried!
I believe that the score sheet is as good as it needs to be, though the points are worth too much, which leads to an increase it the use of the countback idea. This could work, but it should be related to actual ploughing operations, not the "Artistic Impression" used now.
Can we stop raking over the coals,it is achieving nothing, and the constant agitation is preventing any new ideas taking root.
Might I suggest a trip up to Doncaster next March Harry, a seat on the board, executive membership and Bobs your uncle - job sorted.
Two things.
Points are not worth too much for if you reduce the working totals to ten see how many count backs this brings.
Stand firm and don’t let the guys with the dodgy scoresheets and pencils convince you that they are honest men.
tcn ploughman
Member
tcn ploughman
Member
Harry if you think the constant agitation is on here preventing any new ideas, think again it's directors just sitting there at the meetings saying nothing.
Directors who dont direct? Bound to be some of those, and there should be a mechanism for their removal. The angst is not just on here, its there, if only as an undercurrent at most matches, evidenced by the obvious disagreement exhibited at prize givings! Never have so many shoulders been shrugged, or heads shaken upon hearing the awards.
There has always been a group who disagree with the results, but they are now approaching majority status, and that is going to lead to problems, one of which could be matches becoming bereft of judges. That may not be all bad, ploughmen would then have to judge the work and would find it hard to disagree with any result!
I think reducing the points would lead to more tied results, there were very few, if any on the old 40 point system.
I believe that the ten system has spawned the division of a point into tenths in some aspects.
A seat on the board? Now just how could a class filling slightly above average ploughman whos main input is to make the good look good, ever reach such exulted heights? Especially one who is passionate in his wish to see match ploughing remain in being, and is unlikely to toe any family imposed line however friendly he may be with individual members( thought I would mention that, saves you the job!)