Why is the Uk agricultural industry becoming almost “obsessed by carbon free farming”???

bigw

Member
Location
Scotland
To call it carbon 'accounting' is sacrilege really. Say I complete a carbon audit, my use of ammonium nitrate would be a large portion of my total footprint. At the same time as a major polluter Yara does the same and accounts for their C02 from AN production. So the fert is counted twice? Just one example of the mess carbon accounting seems to be

You would think that all our inputs should be accounted for by the people that manufacture them. Agriculture needs to get its act together otherwise it will get rolled over.
 

holwellcourtfarm

Member
NFFN Member
Can growth and better life co-exist?
Depends what growth you mean. If you mean conventional economic "GDP growth" then it's about to collapse the ecosystem.

Future human growth should be framed in terms of sustaining or improving daily wellbeing whilst significantly cutting negative impacts on our ecosystem health.

That requires big changes in lifestyle though and, probably, large falls in GDP.

Perceived quality of life could actually improve though for all but the very rich.......
 

holwellcourtfarm

Member
NFFN Member
To call it carbon 'accounting' is sacrilege really. Say I complete a carbon audit, my use of ammonium nitrate would be a large portion of my total footprint. At the same time as a major polluter Yara does the same and accounts for their C02 from AN production. So the fert is counted twice? Just one example of the mess carbon accounting seems to be
The whole issue of "system boundaries" in carbon accounting is a fraught one being argued over right now.

The biggest flaw apparent in Joseph Poore's work appears to be inconsistent application of system boundaries between different food type assessments.
 

Foxhollow

Member
Location
Bury St Edmunds
The concept of carbon neutral is impossible to achieve. Then to apply it to only a small segment of a supply chain is even more absurd. As we have all read on this forum about the dairy and cattle carbon footprint which does not take into account the grazing aspect and the spreading of muck back onto the fields. That just demonstrates that the carbon usage calculations are flawed. It is just people playing with numbers and assumptions to achieve what they want to present. It is no different to people doing surveys/polls and then using statistics to prove their point.
What is even more mind boggling is that major oil producers are saying that they will become carbon neutral yet what they extract goes on to produce the greatest emitters of carbon. It is also the same with electric vehicles being promoted as so green, environmentally friendly, carbon efficient. Yet if someone did the whole supply chain calculation from cradle to grave of carbon usage from manufacture, usage of energy, production of energy and disposal of vehicle it is not much different to a ICE vehicle. Yes an electric vehicle is cleaner in terms of direct particle emissions around it. Do not get me wrong I do see the electric vehicles as being good and will be the future, but they are selling the concept of it being the savior to the planet. It will only be one part just as farming will have its part to play but everyone in the long supply chain needs to be in tune with each other.
 
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Tim W

Member
Location
Wiltshire
Maybe the question should be, why are UK farmers not obsessed with becoming carbon neutral?
I can empathize with this
If aspiring to become carbon neutral means less pollution ,more environmentally & conservation minded farming then I'm in
Maybe I'm a cynic but I just despair at the rush to replace land owning subsidy with a carbon subsidy .... it's a con
 

unlacedgecko

Member
Livestock Farmer
I can empathize with this
If aspiring to become carbon neutral means less pollution ,more environmentally & conservation minded farming then I'm in
Maybe I'm a cynic but I just despair at the rush to replace land owning subsidy with a carbon subsidy .... it's a con
Another means to transfer wealth from tax payers to landowners.
 
Depends what growth you mean. If you mean conventional economic "GDP growth" then it's about to collapse the ecosystem.

Future human growth should be framed in terms of sustaining or improving daily wellbeing whilst significantly cutting negative impacts on our ecosystem health.

That requires big changes in lifestyle though and, probably, large falls in GDP.

Perceived quality of life could actually improve though for all but the very rich.......

I don't think it is about to collapse the ecosystem actually. Although I am still a conservationist at heart.

But the other stuff is complicated.
 

sjt01

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
North Norfolk
To call it carbon 'accounting' is sacrilege really. Say I complete a carbon audit, my use of ammonium nitrate would be a large portion of my total footprint. At the same time as a major polluter Yara does the same and accounts for their C02 from AN production. So the fert is counted twice? Just one example of the mess carbon accounting seems to be
It is supposed to be like VAT - you are charged for what comes in, and credited for what goes out.
 

holwellcourtfarm

Member
NFFN Member
I don't think it is about to collapse the ecosystem actually. Although I am still a conservationist at heart.

But the other stuff is complicated.
Collapse is happening. We just don't see it because our time horizons don't fit.

To a fruit fly 3 days is a lifetime.
To a Yew tree a lifetime is several thousand years.

Species decline has accelerated over recent decades. It only needs enough key pollinators to die out in our local area for plant life to start rapidly declining.

Key ecosystem processes would then follow.
 
Collapse is happening. We just don't see it because our time horizons don't fit.

To a fruit fly 3 days is a lifetime.
To a Yew tree a lifetime is several thousand years.

Species decline has accelerated over recent decades. It only needs enough key pollinators to die out in our local area for plant life to start rapidly declining.

Key ecosystem processes would then follow.

To be honest in the UK we got rid of a load of our big species by about 12AD -wolf, beaver, bear etc had all gone by then as had a lot of deforestation. Its not as if the ecological niche is not filled by more of another species anyway.

There is also a interesting stat that climate change fanatics often worry about not their own local area but about places far away from them more. Which I find odd.

I have no doubt we will start to evolve away from fossil fuel use but I also am not convinced that what is predicted to happen will happen.
 

Henarar

Member
Livestock Farmer
'Carbon free' is a virtual concept of environmentalism to keep up with virtual currencies and 'virtual' meat.
When you are exhausting the worlds resources you need to create new money streams.
Bill Gates dream is the perfect example of how wrong this is. Pay the big tech companies all your money for a false sense of saving the world while living the same.
The only way to save the planet is to live sustainably and end the mindset of 'growth' being essential.
The trouble is, all those with money may lose out and are willing to spend a lot to make sure it never happens.
The only way to save the planet is to move it, perhaps this is what we should do.
A few more miles from the sun would negate a couple degrees of temp rise
 

Update on the Sustainable Farming Incentive pilot

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Update on the Sustainable Farming Incentive pilot

Written by Lisa Applin

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In July, we opened the applications window for farmers to join our Sustainable Farming Incentive pilot.

The Sustainable Farming Incentive is 1 of the 3 new environmental land management schemes. It sits alongside the future Local Nature Recovery and Landscape Recovery schemes.

Through the Sustainable Farming Incentive, farmers will be paid for environmentally sustainable actions – ones that are simple to do and do not require previous agri-environment scheme experience.

We are piloting the scheme to...
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