Wide tyres, duals or tracks.

[Wombat]

you do zero till, full stubble retention, CTF, keep an eye on fungicide & insecticide use ( ie - try to avoid damaging soil biology / fungi as much as you can ), maybe add cover crops as well, you may find you don’t need to be mole draining in the future . . .

We have fields that have been grass for 100yrs and they would benefit from a good moling just to get rid of the ponding. Either that or a full redraining

 

[Farmer Roy]

We have fields that have been grass for 100yrs and they would benefit from a good moling just to get rid of the ponding. Either that or a full redraining

100 years grass can still be compacted, be bacterially dominant & have poor moisture infiltration . . .
you need a diversity of plant species, rooting types & depths, as well as a better fungal : bacteria ratio, for any soil to have better infiltration & water holding capacity . . .

monoculture of grass, especially combined with N fertilisers or animal slurry, WILL give you bacteria dominant soils which WILL give you tight soils, less soil pores & “air” & reduced infiltration

NZ & Australian grass based dairy fields are an obvious example

 

[Kiwi Pete]

100 years grass can still be compacted, be bacterially dominant & have poor moisture infiltration . . .
you need a diversity of plant species, rooting types & depths, as well as a better fungal : bacteria ratio, for any soil to have better infiltration & water holding capacity . . .

monoculture of grass, especially combined with N fertilisers or animal slurry, WILL give you bacteria dominant soils which WILL give you tight soils, less soil pores & “air” & reduced infiltration

NZ & Australian grass based dairy fields are an obvious example

100%, fungi do nearly all the remedial work - worms get nearly all the credit for what the fungi did

 

[Wombat]

100 years grass can still be compacted, be bacterially dominant & have poor moisture infiltration . . .
you need a diversity of plant species, rooting types & depths, as well as a better fungal : bacteria ratio, for any soil to have better infiltration & water holding capacity . . .

monoculture of grass, especially combined with N fertilisers or animal slurry, WILL give you bacteria dominant soils which WILL give you tight soils, less soil pores & “air” & reduced infiltration

NZ & Australian grass based dairy fields are an obvious example

Don't disagree but the water has to go somewhere and when the water table is as high as it is here in winter. Moling and drains make the difference

 

[Sharpy]

100 years grass can still be compacted, be bacterially dominant & have poor moisture infiltration . . .
you need a diversity of plant species, rooting types & depths, as well as a better fungal : bacteria ratio, for any soil to have better infiltration & water holding capacity . . .

monoculture of grass, especially combined with N fertilisers or animal slurry, WILL give you bacteria dominant soils which WILL give you tight soils, less soil pores & “air” & reduced infiltration

NZ & Australian grass based dairy fields are an obvious example

I know what you are saying but if you are in an area that gets rain every week, often every day, nothing needs to put down deep roots, so that closes the ground up.......
But I have observed that the little field that my wifes ponies graze which receives no fert and doesn't get poached is currently drier than most of the farm despite being at the bottom of a hill.

 

[Sharpy]

100%, fungi do nearly all the remedial work - worms get nearly all the credit for what the fungi did

Are they eating the fungi?

 

[yellow belly]

Tract systems add a lot of extra weight
using ctf wide Tracks and wide tyres are not needed for drilling or combining 650 mm

for moleing wider tyres for traction but a twin leg Takes out the wheeling
unless landis close space drained then moleing is essential on land that holds a mole

 

[Lowland1]

I did have a very small scale dabble, with raised beds & not ploughing just tickling the beds with the bed former after sheep grazing. Amazing tilth with little effort. An infestation of nettles, stopped the trial. Perhaps I should have tried harder with ag chems to control the nettles? That was with a planned four year rotation of hand picked legumes, red beet, brassica & alliums

I've seen Australlian reserch on growing cereals on very wide raised beds, controlled traffic & bobbins on wheel rims to get combine & tractor on the same track width. May well have worked very well this year in the uk, expensive & complicated though.

We are going down that route. We are on a three bed system and after beans we will mow then bedtill. We are drilling maize into broccoli stubble just using the old beds and its working well.

 

[Two Tone]

I am a great believer in Dual wheels.
Yes, wide wheels are very good for when spraying, but for a tractor that has to be used for most other jobs, Dual’s are a much easier option.

You can argue that if you need duals, you shouldn’t be on the field, but last Autumn was classic example of their huge benefit. Do you get a crop in successfully or not?

I bought a used set off EBay to put a on my drilling tractor in early October and couldn’t believe I’d forgotten how much better they made the tractor and drill float. I reduced the depth of the combi power harrow because it no longer needed to go in so deep to deal with the tractor wheel ruts. This also meant an increase in forward speed and a massive reduction in fuel used. The crops on every field I drilled with them on are much better, especially the headlands.

Not only that, but there was a hell of a lot less damage done by the spraying tractor putting the pre-ems on, even with its wide wheels fitted!

I sometimes wonder if they are regarded as old fashioned. They were once in common use with tractors that were a lot lighter than most are today. Have we become lazy in not wanting to use them?

Even in normal years, how often can you see exactly where the tractors drove in an emerged crop, which you wouldn’t do if those tractors where fitted with Duals, that halved the compaction?

 

[Brisel]

Dual wheels for a 100hp tractor are a lot easier to handle than those matched to a 200 hp tractor. I used to be able to pop a set of 18.4x38s onto my 8340 tractor in 10 minutes by myself which still kept the tractor at 3m wide. A set of 650 x 38s will be a lot heavier for one person to do safely and take the tractor width closer to 4m which has implications for road work. IMO better radial tyres like the Increased Flexion have farmers listening to the tyre salesmen's patter that we don't need duals.

 

[yellow belly]

Dual wheels for a 100hp tractor are a lot easier to handle than those matched to a 200 hp tractor. I used to be able to pop a set of 18.4x38s onto my 8340 tractor in 10 minutes by myself which still kept the tractor at 3m wide. A set of 650 x 38s will be a lot heavier for one person to do safely and take the tractor width closer to 4m which has implications for road work. IMO better radial tyres like the Increased Flexion have farmers listening to the tyre salesmen's patter that we don't need duals.

18 38 is the biggest I would handle single handed
and Now days a wheel Carter is essential if changing wheels
I gave up duels when wheel centres kept cracking

I cultivating with a random traffic system duels or over sized wheels
but duels need pressure reducing I have seen plenty of duels where the pressure is over 15 psi so the deal is effectively a wheel weight

 

[Brisel]

I’ve always run the duals at at least 2 psi less than the tractor wheels. It helps steering when using front duals too. When the tyres on the duals are older lower pressures make them more prone to cracking and punctures. What really buggers the job up are narrow roads with raised verges or worse still, drainage grips where the spoil is put next to the grip.

 

[Gerbert]

I am a great believer in Dual wheels.
Yes, wide wheels are very good for when spraying, but for a tractor that has to be used for most other jobs, Dual’s are a much easier option.

You can argue that if you need duals, you shouldn’t be on the field, but last Autumn was classic example of their huge benefit. Do you get a crop in successfully or not?

I bought a used set off EBay to put a on my drilling tractor in early October and couldn’t believe I’d forgotten how much better they made the tractor and drill float. I reduced the depth of the combi power harrow because it no longer needed to go in so deep to deal with the tractor wheel ruts. This also meant an increase in forward speed and a massive reduction in fuel used. The crops on every field I drilled with them on are much better, especially the headlands.

Not only that, but there was a hell of a lot less damage done by the spraying tractor putting the pre-ems on, even with its wide wheels fitted!

I sometimes wonder if they are regarded as old fashioned. They were once in common use with tractors that were a lot lighter than most are today. Have we become lazy in not wanting to use them?
View attachment 857540
View attachment 857541

Even in normal years, how often can you see exactly where the tractors drove in an emerged crop, which you wouldn’t do if those tractors where fitted with Duals, that halved the compaction?

Is that a swb T7000? If so I would advise you to not use duals, the axles can't handle it. Old boss ran dual 650/65R42's on his swb puma's but broke an axle two times. Now on a lwb puma...

 

[Bob lincs]

Wide tyres and duals !

 

[Two Tone]

Is that a swb T7000? If so I would advise you to not use duals, the axles can't handle it. Old boss ran dual 650/65R42's on his swb puma's but broke an axle two times. Now on a lwb puma...

It is a 7050. I make sure the Duals are set at least 2 psi below the inners wheels. Fortunately, I don’t need to do much in the way of road work with the duals on. So any risk to the axles is minimal.

As with all these things, a lot more care is needed when using something not standard such as Dual wheels, especially when turning sharp on concrete. Anybody driving it with an attitude of “It’s not mine, so it doesn’t matter” wants banning from it! Preferably sacking!

In the field, the advantages are enormous.

Thanks for the advice, anyway.

 

[Gerbert]

I agree, you need to be carefull alright. The puma was loaded with as little weights on the front as possible (thus having pretty much all weight on the rear axle on the headlands) and the tractor wasn't mishandled as such but not spared either.
It was a lovely sight, a relatively low weight puma 145 on dual 650/65R42's. After the first axle breaking, they where a bit more carefull but broke again the next year. Luckily both times on the field.
I take it yours are 38's? That should be a little safer I guess.

 

[Cowcorn]

I am a great believer in Dual wheels.
Yes, wide wheels are very good for when spraying, but for a tractor that has to be used for most other jobs, Dual’s are a much easier option.

You can argue that if you need duals, you shouldn’t be on the field, but last Autumn was classic example of their huge benefit. Do you get a crop in successfully or not?

I bought a used set off EBay to put a on my drilling tractor in early October and couldn’t believe I’d forgotten how much better they made the tractor and drill float. I reduced the depth of the combi power harrow because it no longer needed to go in so deep to deal with the tractor wheel ruts. This also meant an increase in forward speed and a massive reduction in fuel used. The crops on every field I drilled with them on are much better, especially the headlands.

Not only that, but there was a hell of a lot less damage done by the spraying tractor putting the pre-ems on, even with its wide wheels fitted!

I sometimes wonder if they are regarded as old fashioned. They were once in common use with tractors that were a lot lighter than most are today. Have we become lazy in not wanting to use them?
View attachment 857540
View attachment 857541

Even in normal years, how often can you see exactly where the tractors drove in an emerged crop, which you wouldn’t do if those tractors where fitted with Duals, that halved the compaction?

Very true, years ago we would never venture out to drill winter cereals with the MF 30 without duals on the 784. This backend i dragged the duals out of the back of the shed and the 8340 travelled really well behind the plough . My 60 acres of ww look pretty good very even and no baldy patches. Wont be leaving them off at the drilling tractor again !

 

[Kiwi Pete]

Are they eating the fungi?

Bacteria do, if their numbers get out of whack, which is generally why N addicts are pissing into the wind with their soils
Add a bit of "insurance" fungicide and it's a firstclass ticket to Shitsville, and will never be sustainably profitable

 

[Devil's advocate]

Bacteria do, if their numbers get out of whack, which is generally why N addicts are pissing into the wind with their soils
Add a bit of "insurance" fungicide and it's a firstclass ticket to Shitsville, and will never be sustainably profitable

Yet I use lots of Nitrogen & fungicide & grow far better crops than my Dad & Granddad ever did.

Although I'm keen to learn, maybe more precise targetting of fungicide?

 

[Kiwi Pete]

Yet I use lots of Nitrogen & fungicide & grow far better crops than my Dad & Granddad ever did.

Although I'm keen to learn, maybe more precise targetting of fungicide?

It's one of those very fine balancing acts, isn't it?
There is a limit as to what you can do towards "least harm" while keeping your business running, and also a limit as to what rotations you can run.

Tongue in cheek here, when you say "better crops" did you mean bigger crops - or more profitable crops? I see a massive divergence down here, eg what used to be considered a good grain area no longer is - they can still grow the crops, but not make any money from them.
The big rise in OSR is a part of the problem, as brassicas don't form mycorrhizal associations, every year in rape means a year the AMF are diminishing .
I think that is maybe more detrimental to soil fungi than a well-timed fungicide pass even for insurance purposes?
Hard to say, but something is wrecking the soil ecology around the district, that much is apparent!
What is causing the most stress is hard to determine.