Will you be looking to take part in the future SFI/ELMS scheme? - 21/09/21

[db9go]

As i have said before how can you trust any one with a contract when one side has the ability to alter the term to suit them and not you.
Wont touch any thing were there is a government involved you all ways loose in the end

 

[Wombat]

Undervalues my time and is way to onerous and limiting to get to the different tiers.

based on current info it’s a no, if they could get decent payment rates, single year contracts (or at least a way we are protected a few years in from their usual mistakes) and not have some blocker issues between tiers then maybe.

better they subsidies American fertiliser companies who are profiteering ..... oh wait

 

[Kernow Star]

I was initially interested but since looking into the SFI scheme have found that for our 100ha dairy farm the figures just don't add up. On the highest tier it's still not worth it with the amount of land needed to be taken out of production. We would be better off milking an extra 10 cows which would be easier to manage and less hassle than what is being currently proposed.

 

[Jimdog1]

I think at this point a mass expression of disinterest is our best policy ( not difficult ). With current events in the Fertiliser/co2 market it might focus some minds at Defra?

 

[DrWazzock]

For me there are serious doubts about the mentality of the people you would be dealing with.
Banning autumn manure applications confirmed that I wouldn’t want to engage further. I know that was the EA not directly DEFRA but they are like hand in glove.
Luke warm support for the livestock sector, constant sniping about methane emissions all mean I won’t deal with them any more than I’m forced to. Sorry to say they are anti agriculture and really I don’t think they have a clue about practical farming on 200 acres. The three tier nutrient management option tells me that, with the third tier requiring variable rate technology. For us that would be a massive uneconomic overhead in terms of time and money and reduce our simple robust system to an expensive high tech mess. As I say they are clueless but have been sold this stuff by the salesman’s patter.

 

[Steevo]

As i have said before how can you trust any one with a contract when one side has the ability to alter the term to suit them and not you.
Wont touch any thing were there is a government involved you all ways loose in the end

This reminds me of the AIC/RT discussions. Especially the latest topic about the testing requirements for imports.

@Grass And Grain

 

[warksfarmer]

Defra ringing around now asking why people aren’t taking part in the pilot. Had my call and said the payment rates are miles away to even consider it as a viable option.

 

[Extreme Optimist]

It's a "No" from me unless they radically improve things. Being an all grass, livestock unit, there isn't even enough in it to pay for the admin to fill in the forms!
Also, past experience of working with Natural England suggests they don't like me very much! This coupled with their "one sided" contracts leads me to believe that it is a complete non starter. I would love to be proved wrong!!!!

 

[Steevo]

Interesting to see that the recent NFU survey suggests 84% of farmers interested in taking part in ELMS.

Survey shows demand for net zero actions in ELMs

Written by John Swire from Farm Business A new NFU survey has revealed that 84% of farmers and growers are interested in applying for Environmental Land Management schemes (ELMs), but that they want to see measures to help them achieve net zero offered alongside environmental and biodiversity...

thefarmingforum.co.uk

I know which poll I believe…

 

[teslacoils]

Interesting to see that the recent NFU survey suggests 84% of farmers interested in taking part in ELMS.

Survey shows demand for net zero actions in ELMs

Written by John Swire from Farm Business A new NFU survey has revealed that 84% of farmers and growers are interested in applying for Environmental Land Management schemes (ELMs), but that they want to see measures to help them achieve net zero offered alongside environmental and biodiversity...

thefarmingforum.co.uk

I know which poll I believe…

Maybe 84 percent of NFU members are goodlifer London tmfs and alpaca owners......

 

[yellowbelly]

Interesting to see that the recent NFU survey suggests 84% of farmers interested in taking part in ELMS.

Survey shows demand for net zero actions in ELMs

Written by John Swire from Farm Business A new NFU survey has revealed that 84% of farmers and growers are interested in applying for Environmental Land Management schemes (ELMs), but that they want to see measures to help them achieve net zero offered alongside environmental and biodiversity...

thefarmingforum.co.uk

I know which poll I believe…

Jeez
It's a good job this isn't being televised in the style of a general election - Peter Snow's swingometer would have dropped off it's fudgin pivot point..

How can the NFU be so wrong

 

[Tubbylew]

Interesting to see that the recent NFU survey suggests 84% of farmers interested in taking part in ELMS.

Survey shows demand for net zero actions in ELMs

Written by John Swire from Farm Business A new NFU survey has revealed that 84% of farmers and growers are interested in applying for Environmental Land Management schemes (ELMs), but that they want to see measures to help them achieve net zero offered alongside environmental and biodiversity...

thefarmingforum.co.uk

I know which poll I believe…

What the headline should have read "NFU only manage to get 84% of yes men to agree to government platitudes" a spokesman said "Minnete has got the names of the 16 people who have dissapointed us so badly, and they won't be asked next time".

 

[renewablejohn]

missed the poll as a bit busy the last couple of weeks but definitely a no from me until they sign up to removing the clause that they can alter the contract you sign to suit themselves after you have signed it. Been caught out once it will never happen again.

 

[delilah]

Interesting to see that the recent NFU survey suggests 84% of farmers interested in taking part in ELMS.

Survey shows demand for net zero actions in ELMs

Written by John Swire from Farm Business A new NFU survey has revealed that 84% of farmers and growers are interested in applying for Environmental Land Management schemes (ELMs), but that they want to see measures to help them achieve net zero offered alongside environmental and biodiversity...

thefarmingforum.co.uk

I know which poll I believe…

The respondents outlined which potential actions would be most important for their businesses and climate action:

• 89% said hedgerow management and restoration
• 84% said maintaining permanent grassland and/or improving grassland management

Then I stick with my earlier post up thread. Yes, because by the time it comes to full rollout the SFI wont look anything like it does today.

The NFU are on Defra's Elms Engagement Group. They have been shown how the SFI needs to be amended, and they now have the evidence of their own survey that this amendment has the support of over 80% of their members. They now need to take the EEG with them in securing these amendments.

 

[Azlett]

We'd go for the SFI - all advanced level low-input grassland & hedges. It's exactly what we do anyway.

 

[DaveGrohl]

missed the poll as a bit busy the last couple of weeks but definitely a no from me until they sign up to removing the clause that they can alter the contract you sign to suit themselves after you have signed it. Been caught out once it will never happen again.

They could at least be up front about it and say "we reserve the right to fekk you over on a whim". I could respect that.

 

[Two Tone]

I’m interested in ELMS, but they seem to have confused the whole issue with SFI.
CSS MTS has been a Godsend for this farm, by taking out the worst 1/3 of the farm which was only ever profitable 2 out of 5 years.
SFI rates are just not worth the bother.
Hoping that ELMS rates will be more attractive.

Can’t answer the poll because the thread heading says SFI/ELMS.
But the poll itself only mentions SFI.

 

[HatsOff]

I’m interested in ELMS, but they seem to have confused the whole issue with SFI.
CSS MTS has been a Godsend for this farm, by taking out the worst 1/3 of the farm which was only ever profitable 2 out of 5 years.
SFI rates are just not worth the bother.
Hoping that ELMS rates will be more attractive.

Can’t answer the poll because the thread heading says SFI/ELMS.
But the poll itself only mentions SFI.

I'm sure you know, but just for clarity...

"There are 3 new schemes that will reward environmental land management (ELMS):

• Sustainable Farming Incentive (SFI)
• Local Nature Recovery
• Landscape Recovery"

Environmental Land Management schemes: overview

www.gov.uk

So SFI is the agricultural component of ELMS (even though it doesn't mention food production at all). I don't think there will be much for farmers in the other two strands.

 

[steveR]

Defra ringing around now asking why people aren’t taking part in the pilot. Had my call and said the payment rates are miles away to even consider it as a viable option.

Had you registered, or expressed interest for the Pilot?

 

[Two Tone]

I'm sure you know, but just for clarity...

"There are 3 new schemes that will reward environmental land management (ELMS):

• Sustainable Farming Incentive (SFI)
• Local Nature Recovery
• Landscape Recovery"

Environmental Land Management schemes: overview

www.gov.uk

So SFI is the agricultural component of ELMS (even though it doesn't mention food production at all). I don't think there will be much for farmers in the other two strands.

Thanks for clarifying this.

We are just about to end our 1st 5 year MTS scheme and are renewing it with another.
I’m told, rightly or wrongly, that we cannot run an early (pilot) SFI at the same time.
My intention is to join ELMS in 2024 (or as soon as it properly starts) and switch over our MTS into it, plus all the other environmental bits we are/will be doing by then.

We have now almost completely switched to DD and are hoping that the massive amount of CO2 this stops releasing from the soil into the atmosphere will be recognised within ELMS
We also have a lot of Permanent Pasture, which we hope will be recognised for its environment benefit too by then.

As with so many of these things, there is an awful lot of talk about it until it gets closer to the actual start date and fully clarified.
Too much waffle and speculation about it all until it actually starts, puts a hell of a lot of people off.

The current quoted pilot SFI figures are far too small.
ELMS is intended to start in 2024, yet BPS won’t fully end until 2027.
As the total amount of BPS/CS money is ring-fenced to be redistributed, once it has fully ended, Surely the full rates of SFI/ELMS cannot be fully achieved until after 2027.

This is causing the most enormously confusing feck-up!
Especially as it is supposed to be designed that ANY farmer should be able to do this in a day, without requiring an Agent to help!