Winter oats not looking happy at the moment!

[bankrupt]

Ally on its own knocks oats for fun let alone mixed with everything else !

The Ally Max label actually says " do not use in tank mix on Triticale" - should include that for oats as well.

 

[Flat 10]

Bit of grass wont hurt.
You dont need an agronomist walking around them either.
A very hardy and simple plant to grow.

Black grass is different

 

[nxy]

The Ally Max label actually says " do not use in tank mix on Triticale" - should include that for oats as well.

You have got me worried now.
We sprayed triticale with a mix of Ally, Tebuconazole and Amistar last week and I haven't been to look since.

 

[robbie]

The Ally Max label actually says " do not use in tank mix on Triticale" - should include that for oats as well.

Very strange, but I have AMG looking very sick on a winter barley headland I gave full rate ally to.

I avoid metsulfuron on triticale. Did I read on here once that when ally first came to the market it said something on the label about having some oat control????

 

[robs1]

I

What variety are your oats? I'm seeing the symptoms you describe across all of the oats I'm walking, but more pronounced on Mascani, less so on Eagle. I think we are seeing a combination of factors which are leading to the stress, most notably diurnal temperature fluctuations, successive frost, drought.

There is a condition in oats called 'red oats' which has an unknown cause and is therefore probably caused by stress factors. I'd also say we are seeing some dark leaf spots - again which have an unknown cause. BYDV of course does cause red/purple symptoms in oats, but given that this is widespread across the field rather than small patches (in my area) then this is unlikely to be the cause. I wasn't finding many aphids in most oat crops in my area last autumn so no insecticide applied, apart from one earlier sown block, which did have a well timed insecticide - and this crop is also showing the reddening symptoms.

The top two leaves are free of symptoms and once further leaf layers emerge and the stem extends then the crop will begin to look far more healthy

IMHO the tank mix you describe as too heavy for oats. Several years ago I did see irreversible damage from a SU herbicide mixed with PGR and fungicide. This was applied later than yours. The herbicide part of the tank mix was only applied to the headlands and not the main part of the field and there was a significant yield loss. I always split out recommendations like that with the herbicide in a separate application to the other products.

In spring oats last season just the SU + fluroxpyr gave the crop significantly more stress symptoms than an SU alone.

I'm trying to avoid metsulfuron based products where possible in oats as I believe that active in particular causes more stress than others.

Only one of my clients has a applied a PGR so far to his oats, and that was mainly due to the slurry application which has given a large canopy. PGR for most is likely to be one application at GS32 - when hopefully we have had some rain and it is warmer (only 1mm here this week.)

How long between applications do you think is long enough when splitting these large tank mixes ?

 

[chipchap]

Nobody has mentioned Oat Mosaic Virus.
soil borne virus makes the crop stunted and almost “crunchy” to walk on.
There will be some tillers much taller than others at harvest.

 

[Farma Parma]

in all honesty just sow winter oats in the spring. there still a better yielder than spring varieties i think. darnt share the pics of mine for fear of getting banished off here.
3.7t/ac Gerald Sown last week of march last year & this years sown about the same time. Mind there away now, rain we finally had yesterday 11mm has sorted them.
and whats coming esp on monday will just top job off nicely.
No Agchems yet mind. but my agronomist knows his job or he would be rightly told otherwise.

 

[Two Tone]

I reckon all SU’s have a stunting PGR effect on any crop and especially oats.
Altantis on wheat in the Spring will certainly mean we won’t need Modus as a PGR and probably half the rate of CCC we will put on if we hadn’t used Atlantis.

I used Modus on a few small, formerly lush areas of Winter barley this year and wish I hadn’t. My God is it hammered! You can see to the line where we stopped using it.
Thank God I didn’t use any on the wheat!

The Op’s mixture was far too overloaded to put on in one go! Especially on Oats.



Had an email from an Agronomist this morning about serious spray damage being seen on some farms.
Trying to blame farmers for not cleaning their sprayer tanks properly:

There have been a few sprayer hygiene problems this year which have demonstrating really bad circumstances when a sprayer has not been cleaned properly. Most of these are either an SU chemical such as Ally Max, Atlantis, other grassweed chemicals and of course Roundup. Please read the attachment, you may think it is too expensive to do this but you can loose a whole field in bad circumstances so the cost of using the correct tank cleaner is thousands of pounds saved. Unfortunately some people think that All Clear Extra is a tank cleaner where as in fact it is an SU inhibitor, Neutralize actually cleans the sprayer as well as an SU inhibitor.

IMO, spraying anything other than Mn and plant stimulants this April has involved an extra risk of crop damage.

BTW, the best tank cleaners there are, are Insecticides!

 

[Renaultman]

Ours look good but had nothing since autumn liberator hoping to spray them next week after rain and bit warmer

Same here, went in in by no means ideal conditions at 100kg/ha and look really well, had 48kgn and nothing else yet.

 

[JCfarmer]

What variety are your oats? I'm seeing the symptoms you describe across all of the oats I'm walking, but more pronounced on Mascani, less so on Eagle. I think we are seeing a combination of factors which are leading to the stress, most notably diurnal temperature fluctuations, successive frost, drought.

There is a condition in oats called 'red oats' which has an unknown cause and is therefore probably caused by stress factors. I'd also say we are seeing some dark leaf spots - again which have an unknown cause. BYDV of course does cause red/purple symptoms in oats, but given that this is widespread across the field rather than small patches (in my area) then this is unlikely to be the cause. I wasn't finding many aphids in most oat crops in my area last autumn so no insecticide applied, apart from one earlier sown block, which did have a well timed insecticide - and this crop is also showing the reddening symptoms.

The top two leaves are free of symptoms and once further leaf layers emerge and the stem extends then the crop will begin to look far more healthy

IMHO the tank mix you describe as too heavy for oats. Several years ago I did see irreversible damage from a SU herbicide mixed with PGR and fungicide. This was applied later than yours. The herbicide part of the tank mix was only applied to the headlands and not the main part of the field and there was a significant yield loss. I always split out recommendations like that with the herbicide in a separate application to the other products.

In spring oats last season just the SU + fluroxpyr gave the crop significantly more stress symptoms than an SU alone.

I'm trying to avoid metsulfuron based products where possible in oats as I believe that active in particular causes more stress than others.

Only one of my clients has a applied a PGR so far to his oats, and that was mainly due to the slurry application which has given a large canopy. PGR for most is likely to be one application at GS32 - when hopefully we have had some rain and it is warmer (only 1mm here this week.)

Mascani and first time growing winter oats so had put all my faith in my agronomist.

 

[JCfarmer]

It’s interesting isn’t it, we are really concerned about having flat oats and do everything to avoid it.
Reduce early N as that helps and only apply the majority once the plants start stem extension. This leads to an unintentional stressing of the crop through lack of N. Then we apply to but unaware of the stressed crop PGR/MSM/fungicide with adjuvants added, shock will then show. Usually stunted/orange/purple colour.
To avoid this, N first followed by herbicide without MSM, PGR once stem extension starts.
Don’t be lazy they are actually a good crop to grow, just don’t try and grow them like our grandparents did. You also need experience on your side, I suspect the agronomist who made the recommendation doesn’t have this yet?!

My 1st time growing them and if the agronomist has got it wrong then I am surprised but.........!?
He has a wealth of knowledge and access to more INDEPENDENT trials and information than most can only dream of.

 

[Spencer]

Looking at that mix I would of put money on him being a serviced guy...

 

[bankrupt]

so had put all my faith in my agronomist.

What level of professional indemnity are agronomists obliged to have, and does it make any difference if serviced or not?

 

[Flat 10]

I reckon all SU’s have a stunting PGR effect on any crop and especially oats.
Altantis on wheat in the Spring will certainly mean we won’t need Modus as a PGR and probably half the rate of CCC we will put on if we hadn’t used Atlantis.

I used Modus on a few small, formerly lush areas of Winter barley this year and wish I hadn’t. My God is it hammered! You can see to the line where we stopped using it.
Thank God I didn’t use any on the wheat!

The Op’s mixture was far too overloaded to put on in one go! Especially on Oats.



Had an email from an Agronomist this morning about serious spray damage being seen on some farms.
Trying to blame farmers for not cleaning their sprayer tanks properly:

There have been a few sprayer hygiene problems this year which have demonstrating really bad circumstances when a sprayer has not been cleaned properly. Most of these are either an SU chemical such as Ally Max, Atlantis, other grassweed chemicals and of course Roundup. Please read the attachment, you may think it is too expensive to do this but you can loose a whole field in bad circumstances so the cost of using the correct tank cleaner is thousands of pounds saved. Unfortunately some people think that All Clear Extra is a tank cleaner where as in fact it is an SU inhibitor, Neutralize actually cleans the sprayer as well as an SU inhibitor.

IMO, spraying anything other than Mn and plant stimulants this April has involved an extra risk of crop damage.

BTW, the best tank cleaners there are, are Insecticides!

Dishwasher tablets or de sangosse tank and equipment cleaner are allegedly very good.
how much moddus @Two Tone ?

 

[Two Tone]

Dishwasher tablets or de sangosse tank and equipment cleaner are allegedly very good.
how much moddus @Two Tone ?

0.1 Modus

 

[teslacoils]

Dishwasher tablets or de sangosse tank and equipment cleaner are allegedly very good.
how much moddus @Two Tone ?

Liquid N quite good.

 

[Flat 10]

0.1 Modus

Never hurt anything yet with 0.1

 

[David.]

0.4 of Liberator is OK, never had any dead in overlaps either.
How good is liberator on wild oats?

 

[Woodlander]

I
How long between applications do you think is long enough when splitting these large tank mixes ?

That would depend on how stressed the crop is and what was in each tank mix, but I'd say the longer the better but minimum 5-7 days if possible.

 

[MattR]

I thought contracts didn’t allow shortners

Forgive my ignorance - why's that?