Would you support a united Ireland?

Discussion in 'Brexit & Politics' started by Sweepa, May 16, 2018.

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(Poll)Would you support an united Ireland?

  1. Yes

    42 vote(s)
    58.3%
  2. No

    22 vote(s)
    30.6%
  3. Undecided

    8 vote(s)
    11.1%

  1. But then, you just don’t like anything to do with the eu
     
  2. arcobob

    arcobob Member

    Location:
    Norfolk
    Who could find a sensible reason to like anything about that bunch of megalomaniacs ?
     
    ollie989898 likes this.
  3. JimAndy

    JimAndy Member

    Location:
    portadown
    at the moment NO maybe in the future i could, it would all depend on how much further the RoI separated Church and state, as i would need a near/total separation of church and state before i would think about it, btw is has nothing to do with the church being Roman catholic , is simply that as an Agnostic i don't think any church should be involved with government.

    As a Farmer i don't want access to RoI i want access to the 65 million people in the UK, i know that many of the processing plants that I sell my stuff too are in the RoI but i have no love for the milk plants that last year when times were hard were paying 1-1.5p/liter LESS for milk got from the north than the south, i have no love for the meat plants that over the years have paid less for N.Ireland beef/sheep because they know we have nowhere else to sell. or for a cercend Irish beef baron who was quoted as saying that if any N.I beef appeared in his UK plants then that herd would be banned for all his Irish plants
     
    ollie989898 and arcobob like this.
  4. Ashtree

    Ashtree Member

    How do you deduce that the church has ANY influence on the modern ROI state! That old order is over. This weeks abortion referendum and massive yes to abortion majority, has completely driven a stake through the heart of church influence in either government or general society.

    Now, as for NI ...... ????? Seems to me the religious fundamentalists pretty much lay out the rules to the DUP and UUP to a lesser extent.
     
    Happy at it, JCMaloney and Sweepa like this.
  5. Danllan

    Danllan Member

    Location:
    Sir Gar / Carms
    The EU, quite right. The EEC on the other hand, if it had remained as an area purely for free trade and cooperation, had its good points.

    Once again it seems apposite to suggest that you don't suppose that because someone is anti-EU they dislike 'Europe' per se; much of the culture is to be admired, there have been many great achievements from the continent, but I believe nothing warrants a surrender of sovereignty, the enforced economic abandonment of our kith and kin and the subjugation of our democracy - and those are just the fundamentals, being apart from the many other faults that lie with the EU.

    How's the weather there, enough rain? Dare I write it, we could do with a bit of a drenching... :eek:
     
  6. JimAndy

    JimAndy Member

    Location:
    portadown
    while it true the Church's (the CoI is just as bad) no longer wield as much power as they use too, they still have massive influence within education and health care

    and as for the NI political party's (for I include all the party's form both sides) Don't get me started on them, you get a 10,000 word rant calling them all the names of the day
     
    arcobob likes this.
  7. arcobob

    arcobob Member

    Location:
    Norfolk
    Religious factions campaign and fight for influence over the minds of the people, including those in government. They represent a power struggle parallel to government and often exert great influence on the same. The ends to which they will go are every bit as evil as any rogue state and their leaders are unelected, gaining power by blackmail and coercion. History does not tell lies and for religion and its representatives to have influence in elected democracies is absolutely intolerable.
     
  8. Joe

    Joe Member

    Location:
    Carlow Ireland
    Changing at pace though, wouldn't be long until Church's are removed from education and healthcare either by reducing resources or society. Never thought I would see the referendum result few weeks ago, schools are next on the list and healthcare reform has already begun with a new children's hospital being built leading the way.
     
  9. arcobob likes this.
  10. arcobob

    arcobob Member

    Location:
    Norfolk
  11. Ashtree

    Ashtree Member

    We have already had one referendum this year. The result is clear. The instructions of the people will accordingly be enshrined in law and acted upon by the Dail by the end of the year. We won’t be pizzing about and infighting two years after the referendum with nothing to show for our efforts.

    Over the next two years, we have six more referendums lined up to be voted on and we expect our parliment will implement our instructions.

    We have many failings in our little republic, but nevertheless we have a fantastic modern constitution backed up by a truly representative PR voting system.

    We also have an elected President, who can be relied upon to further scrutinise the actions of parliment and where necessary, take steps to ensure the will of the people is not being ignored.

    Would we ever in a million years accept an unrepresentative first past the post electoral system, backed up by an archaic dynastic monarchy? Not in a million years!!!
     
  12. arcobob

    arcobob Member

    Location:
    Norfolk
    Well it has worked after a muddled fashion for 96 years, a truly magnificent record. I suppose a referendum is better than a civil war.
     
  13. Muck Spreader

    Muck Spreader Member

    Location:
    Limousin
    IMO referendums tend to show poor government in many but not all situations. Handing responsibility over to the electorate on especially of complex decisions is basically passing the buck by the elected representatives.
     
    arcobob likes this.
  14. Ashtree

    Ashtree Member

    It’s not possible for parliment to change any element of the constitution without the permission of the people through a referendum.
    Our constitution was written in 1948, and reflected societal values at the time. Seventy years later, Ireland and is a very, very different place. It’s necessary to reflect that in the constitution and continue to do so in future.
    As government need to and wish to make the necessary modernisations, they can do so only through a referendum.
     
  15. arcobob

    arcobob Member

    Location:
    Norfolk
    Our constitution, such as it is, was written in 1215. There have been a few changes since then but we generally make it up as we go along. Referenda are expensive to run in a population of 65 million, yours would be rather cheaper, but I still imagine that it is all about avoiding upsetting the church.
     
  16. Joe

    Joe Member

    Location:
    Carlow Ireland
    Think your massively wrong there, majority of people here don't care about upsetting the church. Only issue with the church here is trying to work out how to extract them from day to day society such as education and health. Its a process they set-up over a century and while it wouldn't take a century to remove them, it does take time to complete such tasks.
     
  17. Ashtree

    Ashtree Member

    You are so informed my dear boy. So uninformed.
    The church and state in Ireland are getting more and more apart by the day. It’s basically game set and match for the church.
    Same sex marriage!! Openly gay Taoiseach!! Abortion eith amendment removed from the constitution. New guidelines issuing this week that students in all state schools may opt out of any kind of religious education. Etc, etc,.
    Any person of any religion or none provided he, she, or it for that matter provide that they are Irish citizens, may stand for election for head of state (president).
    I think that is far more than can be said for your own country!! Eh!! Religious bigotry alive and well in the British church / state / monarchical system!!!
    1215 you said ....... time to be moving on a bit my dear man!!!
     
    Puresteal likes this.
  18. Boohoo

    Boohoo Member

    Location:
    Newtownabbey
  19. arcobob

    arcobob Member

    Location:
    Norfolk
    It has been pointed out that the church no longer has much influence but it certainly had in 1948 when your constitution was drawn up, hence my suggestion that they had input which is now being unraveled.
    Amazing how quickly things progress. I started your post as a boy and then became a man in a matter of minutes.
     
  20. Ashtree

    Ashtree Member

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