Tarmac farming

Wood field · Nov 29, 2023

Can it pay ?
We are farming four blocks one is two minutes walk but two are 15 minutes by car
Chap on the phone to me was saying his tractor finance was over £600 a month ( plus vehicle finance, plus farm rent etc etc )
They cover ground up to an hour away yet he said to me , 500 odd sheep can’t pay without working off farm .
Now in my book my sheep keep me ( there’s more than 500) because I don’t have new “ everything “ ( only new vehicles we ever bought was the utv)

Folk on here have often said the first thing to be hit by loss of subs will be machinery dealers, and the thread about tractor prices is eye opening
I guess in a disjointed way I am thinking , especially with hill farming, dog and stick will get bye where shiny kit won’t
Monday morning ramblings!

Norfolk Hill Farmer · Nov 29, 2023

Depends on what numbers you’ve got 15 minutes away, if there’s a lot it might stack up, if there’s just a few, they probably won’t generate enough profit to cover your time and travelling expenses, new kit or not.

Spud · Nov 29, 2023

I used to grow 330ac of spuds in a 14 mile radius and send half of them 25miles to a merchants store
I now grow 150ac in a 7 mile radius, and store them all in our own stores.
I make the same money now as I did then, with less work and less risk.
Does that answer your question?

suffolksmallholder · Nov 29, 2023

We had a farmer who had a mob grazing flock of around 1000 and grazed all the hay paddocks on a short licence each year.
We fenced.
As a result all the grass cut was good and fresh and made nice hay aimed at the pony folk.
SS

gatepost · Nov 29, 2023

I was talking to a feed rep this week, one of his contractor/farmer customers had told him that he had never had so much money owed, several hundred thousand, folk were offering to pay bills a bit at a time, so I guess ''looking the part'' may be crippling some? whereas cutting cloth accordingly is fine.

Wood field · Nov 29, 2023

gatepost said:
I was talking to a feed rep this week, one of his contractor/farmer customers had told him that he had never had so much money owed, several hundred thousand, folk were offering to pay bills a bit at a time, so I guess ''looking the part'' may be crippling some? whereas cutting cloth accordingly is fine.

That sums it up nicely! I am not saying don’t have a nice motor or whatever, but to be throwing a grands worth of diesel a month ( he may even have said a week) on top of all the outlay just to be bigger than someone else, well I don’t get it

Tamar · Nov 29, 2023

Sometimes less is more !

AngusLad · Nov 29, 2023

It depends on your system I suppose. I contract farm 25 minutes away in one direction and rent another farm 15 minutes in the other direction. A semi retired shepherd checks stock etc for me on the contract farm but if there's problems or stock work to do I go up.
It's less than ideal and if something closer to hand came up I would drop the contract farm. The system is still fairly profitable as it is and I am fairly young and looking to grow the business. Having a larger turnover helps that.

Should add it's all upland/hill livestock farming so not much need for trailing kit all over the countryside

Hilly · Nov 29, 2023

The costs one thing its the wasted time … traveling is waste time waste of your life …..

Radnor Lad · Nov 29, 2023

I rented a block of ground 45 miles away and claimed the sub there. When I worked it out after the three year lease I’d broke even. All the sub money paid the fuel costs, maintenance and running a tractor to bale and haul the hay from there. Now I’ve cut back to two blocks of land near home and far better off

Pottersfarm · Nov 29, 2023

Wood field said:
Can it pay ?
We are farming four blocks one is two minutes walk but two are 15 minutes by car
Chap on the phone to me was saying his tractor finance was over £600 a month ( plus vehicle finance, plus farm rent etc etc )
They cover ground up to an hour away yet he said to me , 500 odd sheep can’t pay without working off farm .
Now in my book my sheep keep me ( there’s more than 500) because I don’t have new “ everything “ ( only new vehicles we ever bought was the utv)

Folk on here have often said the first thing to be hit by loss of subs will be machinery dealers, and the thread about tractor prices is eye opening
I guess in a disjointed way I am thinking , especially with hill farming, dog and stick will get bye where shiny kit won’t
Monday morning ramblings!

I wouldn’t bother. We gave up 300ac 9 miles north and 200ac 8 miles south 4 years ago. Since then our machinery costs (repairs, fuel) have dropped by 60%. I can walk out the house and walk to every field now so my truck fuel costs have halved and I’m doing 7000 miles a year less. We are no longer juggling storage and selling stuff at harvest to make space this has resulted in far better marketing or our crops.
Im not missing the 500ac worth of fertiliser and chemical costs which all came out of cash flow. I now wonder why I ever bothered in the first place to be quite honest.

Wood field · Nov 29, 2023

Hilly said:
The costs one thing its the wasted time … traveling is waste time waste of your life …..

Bit of a compromise for us as there’s no ground available adjacent either to rent or buy

But how far is to far I’ve just been up the road and topped up ball feeders / checked a mob , it took 15 mins all in, other ground we have gimmers on and I’ll go there twice a week so not to bad

Nithsdale · Nov 29, 2023

I personally believe the days of having fields/ground here there and everywhere are coming to an end... unless it's big enough to have staff/family at each place, ofcourse.

But 1 man band running ground spread over 30-40miles just doesn't stack up (it never has). Problem is for every 'far away' farmer who will give up a bit of ground there will be several locals very keen to take it (and probably pay over the odds meaning it still doesn't stack up

)

Wood field · Nov 29, 2023

Nithsdale said:
I personally believe the days of having fields/ground here there and everywhere are coming to an end... unless it's big enough to have staff/family at each place, ofcourse.

But 1 man band running ground spread over 30-40miles just doesn't stack up (it never has). Problem is for every 'far away' farmer who will give up a bit of ground there will be several locals very keen to take it (and probably pay over the odds meaning it still doesn't stack up )

I think the local geography helps/ hinders , as I’m sure it will in your area , we are on steep valley sides where traditional farming would be 40 odd acres and a moor run , now to grow the farm means taking on away ground, we can visually see both farthest blocks from the main farm but it’s a 5 mile road trip to each

Were selling one block in April with the thoughts of holding on to see if anything closer comes up
I guess if we’re not careful ( all of us) we can be busy fools !

Cowabunga · Nov 29, 2023

Wood field said:
Can it pay ?
We are farming four blocks one is two minutes walk but two are 15 minutes by car
Chap on the phone to me was saying his tractor finance was over £600 a month ( plus vehicle finance, plus farm rent etc etc )
They cover ground up to an hour away yet he said to me , 500 odd sheep can’t pay without working off farm .
Now in my book my sheep keep me ( there’s more than 500) because I don’t have new “ everything “ ( only new vehicles we ever bought was the utv)

Folk on here have often said the first thing to be hit by loss of subs will be machinery dealers, and the thread about tractor prices is eye opening
I guess in a disjointed way I am thinking , especially with hill farming, dog and stick will get bye where shiny kit won’t
Monday morning ramblings!

Farming as a hobby is all very well as long as you do so below the radar and without the regulations and paperwork. I’m afraid that is the future for rural UK though, with more and more giving up and/or going dog and stick where very little food is produced for the urban masses who will, through their supermarkets, import the vast majority of what they require.

Rees Mogg is on record as being in favour of abandoning UK food production in favour of imports, not even for cheaper food but to avoid the need for foreign seasonal labour [‘immigrants', if they stayed which surely is avoidable] for harvests. Perhaps he is right? The writing is certainly on the wall that political priorities have changed and this has become much clearer over the last decade. We need clarity.

The next decade is likely to produce the most profound changes to UK agriculture since 1940 and not in a good way. Forget livestock production and grow trees and wilderness instead of grass. Grass is only good for the odd little Welsh Cob pony here and there. The rural population who depend on farming either directly or indirectly had better find alternative means of employment and income fairly soon. Zero Carbon takes priority over everything, even though it is a farcical charade likely to impoverish the mass population.

yellowbelly · Nov 29, 2023

Wood field said:
Can it pay

It all depends what rent you're paying for off lying blocks.

Time, travelling, diesel, etc is effectively rent.

We have several such chunks of grazing but pay little or no cash rent........

.......we also have one block where the cash transaction goes in the opposite direction as grazing is part of the environmental conditions that the landlord can not fulfil as he has no livestock.

One of the advantages of being a livestock farmer in a predominantly arable county.

It would be nice if we could get all our grazing on a similar basis

Wood field · Nov 29, 2023

yellowbelly said:
It all depends what rent you're paying for off lying blocks.

Time, travelling, diesel, etc is effectively rent.

We have several such chunks of grazing but pay little or no cash rent........

.......we also have one block where the cash transaction goes in the opposite direction as grazing is part of the environmental conditions that the landlord can not fulfil as he has no livestock.

One of the advantages of being a livestock farmer in a predominantly arable county.

It would be nice if we could get all our grazing on a similar basis

We’re competing with neighbours and all sheep!
The moor run is our lifeline as we can up our numbers
We are fortunate in owning all our In bye land , there’s just not enough of it

Aspiring Peasants · Nov 29, 2023

I have 30 acres which is 5 miles away on the other side of town and another 52 acres which is 3 miles away, they are roughly in the same direction, there is also 30 acres 1/2 mile down the road but on the other side of a busy dual carriageway.. It wastes a lot of time especially when moving stock, fortunately there is a good friend lives opposite the 30 acres and he will let me know if he sees anything wrong and my wife is happy to have a ride out and check things, often when she is going to town for something else. I had 3 people last year enquiring whether we'd rent them the 30 acres so I think it would let quite well. May be the best option if everything was taken into account. I tell myself it’s worth keeping because it’s 300 ft lower than where we live so earlier and more sheltered in the spring

Blue. · Nov 29, 2023

I had 24 acres 9 miles away,new housing along the way meant temporary traffic lights every week of so,I don’t miss having it one bit,everything within a mile now.

Jonp · Nov 29, 2023

I rented a field 9 miles away from the farm, used it for cows as their winter field. Now the cows are gone I was dithering about giving it up, thinking I could put sheep on it over winter. The landlord has just sold it so the decision was taken for me. Glad it's gone as I realised it costs a fortune in time and diesel going back and forth and for keeping sheep on over winter it didn't make financial sense and didn't warrant the worry about loose dogs or loose sheep on the neighbouring golf course. Cheaper and less stress to keep the sheep close by on the farm and feed them when the grass runs bare as it's less than three months till lambing and they'd need a bit of feed anyhow.

Tarmac farming

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