3 year herbal ley break crop

[dontknowanything]

Weed control would be difficult in my situation with herbal leys far too many dock and thistle seeds in my ground. Currently we are moving to 3 - 6 year ryegrass/clover leys and 2 years wheat rotation. This after a good performance from 2nd wheat in a light land DD situation this year. This is better for cleaning the ground of grassland weeds than 1 year wheat.

Have you tried getting your cows to eat docks & thistles? Personally I weed wipe thistles by hand, but I don't have too many (yet)

 

[Tim May]

How do you think you will control grass weeds in a grazing system that promotes seed head formation? This is a big worry of mine!

I think different fertility will help. Blackgrass and brome thrive where there is an abundance of n and a dead soil. We should have a better balance of n to the other nutrients and a live soil by the end of this. Thats my hope its not that black grass won't set seed it just won't thrive and get out competed. We actually want the seed to germinate but get exhausted before they develop.

 

[dontknowanything]

I think different fertility will help. Blackgrass and brome thrive where there is an abundance of n and a dead soil. We should have a better balance of n to the other nutrients and a live soil by the end of this. Thats my hope its not that black grass won't set seed it just won't thrive and get out competed. We actually want the seed to germinate but get exhausted before they develop.

Interesting. What about ryegrass & fescue? I binned the fescue from my mix on the advice of the agronomist who said it was difficult to control.

 

[Tim May]

This is the chickory I was talking about

This is whats happening to the blackgrass

This is the bindweed problem we also have.

 

[dontknowanything]

Interesting videos, but you've posted the blackgrass one twice

 

[Tim May]

Interesting. What about ryegrass & fescue? I binned the fescue from my mix on the advice of the agronomist who said it was difficult to control.

Could well be right we'll see but with two rapes in the arable rotation that should be manageable I think...

 

[Will Blackburn]

Have you tried getting your cows to eat docks & thistles? Personally I weed wipe thistles by hand, but I don't have too many (yet)

Cows will eat docks if pushed, I can only achieve this with dry cows as milk yields or growth rates suffer with the milkers or replacements.

 

[chewdles]

Planted a diverse ley last week as permanent pasture rather then as a break crop after being inspired by some of the stuff on this forum and after reading this article here http://www.outgro.co.nz/outgro-farm-series/ press the one which says "The benefits of pasture diversity"
Hopefully it will do as it says on the tin.

 

[BSH]

How do you mob stock a temporary green manure?

I believe that to get the best results, perennials are essential. Think of the root mass you can achieve with mob grazed leys, and the N fixing potential, compared to a cover crop that spends its prime growing season getting established...

What I mean is to have a fallow year when a cover crop mix or some other annual crop such as forage peas is grown that can be grazed but with the intention of the cattle trampling perhaps even more than normal to effectively kill the green material thereby filling the role of green manure. From what I have read of Gabe Browns farming system it looks like this is how he has built soils quickly. My feeling is that this system will build the soil quicker and allow more cash cropping. It does however presume that there is some other grazing on permanent pasture somewhere. If this isn't the case then some ground has to be put to grass.

 

[dontknowanything]

What I mean is to have a fallow year when a cover crop mix or some other annual crop such as forage peas is grown that can be grazed but with the intention of the cattle trampling perhaps even more than normal to effectively kill the green material thereby filling the role of green manure. From what I have read of Gabe Browns farming system it looks like this is how he has built soils quickly. My feeling is that this system will build the soil quicker and allow more cash cropping. It does however presume that there is some other grazing on permanent pasture somewhere. If this isn't the case then some ground has to be put to grass.

But if you'r not allowing regrowth of your forage plant, wouldn't it be better to get it all eaten?

 

[BSH]

No, because the thing that is building the soil is the trampled material. The way to look at it is less about feeding cows and more about feeding the soil. The cows are a tool that get some benefit, but the trampled above ground material is feeding the soil. Having seen the benefit of a mulched cover crop last year and previously with mustard and been able to compare it with short term ley, I think the cover crop has serious merit.

 

[dontknowanything]

No, because the thing that is building the soil is the trampled material. The way to look at it is less about feeding cows and more about feeding the soil. The cows are a tool that get some benefit, but the trampled above ground material is feeding the soil. Having seen the benefit of a mulched cover crop last year and previously with mustard and been able to compare it with short term ley, I think the cover crop has serious merit.

OK

 

[dontknowanything]

Can see a green haze over the field today for the first time

 

[dontknowanything]

Obviously you can see where the tramlines from pre drilling roundup, but also the combine wheelings are pretty clear.

 

[dontknowanything]

There are certainly more rape volunteers than I had hoped for. I think the topper may need to be called into action next year.

 

[dontknowanything]

 

[dontknowanything]

 

[Tim May]

What seed rate was that put on at? Also was it drilled or broadcast. Looks strong enough to me.

 

[dontknowanything]

What seed rate was that put on at? Also was it drilled or broadcast. Looks strong enough to me.

It was supposed to be 14kg/ha, but I messed up and it went on 20% light - drilled.

Still got too many OSR volunteers in it, where are the pigeons when you need them?!

 

[dontknowanything]

When would people normally go onto August drilled grass with cattle? April?