Environment Agency & Dredging

[Skimmer]

At a ADA meeting yesterday I asked the EA head flood risk manager to give a straight direct answer to not dredging rivers.
Answer, there is nothing saying they cant dredge, they cant however destroy habitat their own biodiversity department stops them even before they can start. They have to do this by law.
Regardless of how much environmental damage is done by flooding, this means their only option is building flood defence systems.
It would need an act of parliament to change this, and this is just not going to happen.

Another interesting fact, any money dished out by government ministers to flood victims comes straight off the flood defence budget not from the treasury.

 

[Jackov Altraids]

At a ADA meeting yesterday I asked the EA head flood risk manager to give a straight direct answer to not dredging rivers.
Answer, there is nothing saying they cant dredge, they cant however destroy habitat their own biodiversity department stops them even before they can start. They have to do this by law.
Regardless of how much environmental damage is done by flooding, this means their only option is building flood defence systems.
It would need an act of parliament to change this, and this is just not going to happen.

Another interesting fact, any money dished out by government ministers to flood victims comes straight off the flood defence budget not from the treasury.

But not dredging will also eventually destroy a habitat.
That's why you have a program of maintenance.

But are you sure it was their own department?
The EA chaps I talk to say it is Natural England that continually refuse them permission to do necessary works.

 

[Skimmer]

But not dredging will also eventually destroy a habitat.
That's why you have a program of maintenance.

But are you sure it was their own department?
The EA chaps I talk to say it is Natural England that continually refuse them permission to do necessary works.

I think their own department probably prevents them so NE cant prosecute. the thing is it is illegal to destroy habitat that's it, regardless of how much damage flooding causes .
Dredging is not going to happen until flooding starts wiping out large towns not just a few thousand homes.

Even if NE gave permission for dredging I dont think the EA would risk it as some other idiotic group would take action.

 

[kiwi pom]

At a ADA meeting yesterday I asked the EA head flood risk manager to give a straight direct answer to not dredging rivers.
Answer, there is nothing saying they cant dredge, they cant however destroy habitat their own biodiversity department stops them even before they can start. They have to do this by law.
Regardless of how much environmental damage is done by flooding, this means their only option is building flood defence systems.
It would need an act of parliament to change this, and this is just not going to happen.

Another interesting fact, any money dished out by government ministers to flood victims comes straight off the flood defence budget not from the treasury.

So basically, they have to do what they're told?

All employees have to do that don't they?

 

[ollie989898]

How in the world are organisations at the mercy of Natural England, a random fudging quango staffed by who exactly? What makes their word so important?

 

[anzani]

It was the media attention to the Somerset Levels flooding that forced the change in direction that resulted in the necessary maintenance regime change. What is required is a widespread campaign to raise public support for a re-examination of the policies which Natural England force upon riperian owners, and it seems its' attitude to fellow quangos such as Environment Agency.
We now have a new Minister, Steven Barclay, who has the oversight of both these organisations. He may not have chosen his new job but it would be an opportunity for him to create his own legacy. What he will not want is media publicity, making it necessary to actually do the job.
There are many, many losers to flooding in the recent events, householders, farmers and business proprietors. Of course all insurance policy holders will pay increasing premiums, some will find they cannot get insurance again, even if they get paid out this time.
For those who have losses, and those who were lucky this time, collect and record the evidence of neglect, instances of nil or inadequate maintenance and slow or non attendance to screens, weirs, sluices etc and make reports to those responsible ,and to your local authorities, especially parish councils, and to any media contacts you may have. Its adverse publicity that will get something done.

 

[Jackov Altraids]

How in the world are organisations at the mercy of Natural England, a random fudging quango staffed by who exactly? What makes their word so important?

They have decided they have jurisdiction over 'natural habitats'.
This would include all waterways, estuaries, coastline etc.

Therefore they would seem to insist that the EA must consult them on any matters regarding flooding as it will involve these areas.

I understand some recent flooding here was due to NE refusing The EA permission to clear silt and debris from storm overflows that were blocked.

 

[Skimmer]

So basically, they have to do what they're told?

All employees have to do that don't they?

If the EA dredged rivers whoever sanctioned it would face the same consequences as John Price on the river lugg

 

[Skimmer]

It was the media attention to the Somerset Levels flooding that forced the change in direction that resulted in the necessary maintenance regime change. What is required is a widespread campaign to raise public support for a re-examination of the policies which Natural England force upon riperian owners, and it seems its' attitude to fellow quangos such as Environment Agency.
We now have a new Minister, Steven Barclay, who has the oversight of both these organisations. He may not have chosen his new job but it would be an opportunity for him to create his own legacy. What he will not want is media publicity, making it necessary to actually do the job.
There are many, many losers to flooding in the recent events, householders, farmers and business proprietors. Of course all insurance policy holders will pay increasing premiums, some will find they cannot get insurance again, even if they get paid out this time.
For those who have losses, and those who were lucky this time, collect and record the evidence of neglect, instances of nil or inadequate maintenance and slow or non attendance to screens, weirs, sluices etc and make reports to those responsible ,and to your local authorities, especially parish councils, and to any media contacts you may have. Its adverse publicity that will get something done.

Farmers need to put more effort into lobbying attending meetings to make a difference. I think being too busy to attend local environmental meetings is no longer a viable option. We can't fill places on the idb meaning councillors get votes carried.

 

[Drillman]

Well if the EA can't do anything they may as well sell off the 1000s of clipboards and high viz jackets that they won’t be needing. Make all the staff redundant and save the general public a fortune that can be spent on increased insurance premiums as a result of flood damage instead.

 

[Kaisney100]

This situation is much worse than simply not dredging the rivers. Below is a quote from a Natural England Blog from October 2023:

'The nutrient neutrality policy was therefore established by Government to tackle pollution to help meet the government’s legal commitments to restore species abundance whilst enabling sustainable development of new homes. As part of that policy Natural England was asked by the Environment Secretary to deliver the nutrient mitigation scheme. Our role is to deliver practical solutions on the ground - such as funding the creation of new wetlands that will absorb pollution – which offset additional pollution from new houses. We then “sell” these benefits as credits to developers so they can quickly get planning permission and enable much needed homes. The nutrient mitigation scheme works alongside other measures and provides a lasting, sustainable solution that delivers wider public benefits, such as new nature reserves and greenspaces'

So not only will they not dredge, but they will be creating new wetlands out of farmland. We have received notification that EDF Energy have an interest in acquiring over 100 acres of ground in our village (that floods). We haven't been told of their plans but if given the go ahead by the government they will compulsory purchase the land. Then they could strip the topsoil away and keep the area under water. EDF acquire a Carbon Sink. Natural England get a swamp full of flies. Small family farms lose their livelihoods. The village floods in the winter but is a swarm of insects in the summer. This could well be the new reality.

 

[anzani]

EA budget 2022/3 £1,650,000,000
NE budget 2022/3 £261,000,000

 

[Vader]

They have decided they have jurisdiction over 'natural habitats'.
This would include all waterways, estuaries, coastline etc.

Therefore they would seem to insist that the EA must consult them on any matters regarding flooding as it will involve these areas.

I understand some recent flooding here was due to NE refusing The EA permission to clear silt and debris from storm overflows that were blocked.

But the trouble is a lot of big drains and ditches they refuse to clear out are man made structures. But once a animal sets up home, its habitat..

 

[Skimmer]

Well if the EA can't do anything they may as well sell off the 1000s of clipboards and high viz jackets that they won’t be needing. Make all the staff redundant and save the general public a fortune that can be spent on increased insurance premiums as a result of flood damage instead.

The flood defence are actually trying hard to find ways round legislation one way they tried here was enhanced weed cutting it was working quite well until a member of the public reported a bank side willow tree removal to the biodiversity department and that was that.

 

[Vader]

At a ADA meeting yesterday I asked the EA head flood risk manager to give a straight direct answer to not dredging rivers.
Answer, there is nothing saying they cant dredge, they cant however destroy habitat their own biodiversity department stops them even before they can start. They have to do this by law.
Regardless of how much environmental damage is done by flooding, this means their only option is building flood defence systems.
It would need an act of parliament to change this, and this is just not going to happen.

Another interesting fact, any money dished out by government ministers to flood victims comes straight off the flood defence budget not from the treasury.

this 100% correct? did you ask the EA bloke in private or in public so other heard?

 

[Skimmer]

But the trouble is a lot of big drains and ditches they refuse to clear out are man made structures. But once a animal sets up home, its habitat..

That's right

 

[Skimmer]

this 100% correct? did you ask the EA bloke in private or in public so other heard?

In public

 

[Lakesdigger]

How in the world are organisations at the mercy of Natural England, a random fudging quango staffed by who exactly? What makes their word so important?

NE used to in effect be a dept of the EA but several years ago this was in effect reversed. NE are basically boss of EA so that's why f all gets done.

 

[Muddyroads]

4 weeks ago our river meadows were covered in spider web gossamer. A week later and the river started to flood, I spent half an hour moving the ewes off to higher ground. During this time, as the grass started to submerge thousands upon thousands of small spiders, about the size of my small finger nails, began floating downstream. It got me wondering just how much wildlife is destroyed by these floods in comparison to the so called protection offered by not maintaining waterways.
I doubt if many of the spiders survived this, never mind small mammals.

 

[Skimmer]

4 weeks ago our river meadows were covered in spider web gossamer. A week later and the river started to flood, I spent half an hour moving the ewes off to higher ground. During this time, as the grass started to submerge thousands upon thousands of small spiders, about the size of my small finger nails, began floating downstream. It got me wondering just how much wildlife is destroyed by these floods in comparison to the so called protection offered by not maintaining waterways.
I doubt if many of the spiders survived this, never mind small mammals.
View attachment 1148715

Nobody's broken the law though despite damaged caused, in actual fact you should be allowed to prosecute NE for not allowing necessary maintenance