Pasture for Life dairy bred beef

[Inky]

Autumn born calves would be better would they not, by spring they will be ready to eat a lot of grass

That was my thinking as well on a suckler system, creep with some grass pellets ready for grass come the spring. Following winters on lucerne silage although it would make for an expense system if the lucerne was being bought in.

 

[Old Tip]

No need for expensive grub @Inky for sucklers, wean later so they don't get a check, store them for the rest of the winter on decent silage or hay and then get them out on grass as soon as you can in the spring and use that compensatory growth. They will be ready to go by the Autumn and any that don't can stay outside for the winter and will fatten fast the following spring. That's using Angus and Hereford Bulls, but I would say most native cattle will be ok on such a system

 

[Chasingmytail]

the alternative for us is lucerne pellets the cattle and sheep devore it. Growing lucerne is the other option but currently no experience of this. Beef cattle managed before the stuffing of cake and Im sure with the correct breeding and start to life calves could too.

Going pasture for life is also about the sustainable future of farming, importing grain from around the world and having to grow it is not sustainable for our childrens future nor is stuffing cattle full of GMO soya. Cattle are not bred to eat grain in the amounts that seem the norm now.

I was discussing this last night with the Boss and need to buy weigh bars to monitor and record weights to calves.

 

[More to life]

the alternative for us is lucerne pellets the cattle and sheep devore it. Growing lucerne is the other option but currently no experience of this. Beef cattle managed before the stuffing of cake and Im sure with the correct breeding and start to life calves could too.

Going pasture for life is also about the sustainable future of farming, importing grain from around the world and having to grow it is not sustainable for our childrens future nor is stuffing cattle full of GMO soya. Cattle are not bred to eat grain in the amounts that seem the norm now.

I was discussing this last night with the Boss and need to buy weigh bars to monitor and record weights to calves.

Do you consider artificially drying grass or Lucerne to be more environmentally friendly than using a byproduct such as rape meal ?

 

[Pedders]

why does it need to be pasture for life ? if you're looking to create your own niche market then use your own rules ......why not feed concentrates to 6 months to take advantage of the peak food conversion efficiency of the calf then make it pasture fed from there on in ..and then market it as Grass Fed ....is anyone really going to be bothered if it had a few Kgs of beef nuts 18 months ago ?
I don't think so ............

 

[Pedders]

American Grass fed beef standards

'Diet — Animals are fed only grass and forage from weaning until harvest.

http://www.americangrassfed.org/about-us/our-standards/

 

[More to life]

American Grass fed beef standards

'Diet — Animals are fed only grass and forage from weaning until harvest.

http://www.americangrassfed.org/about-us/our-standards/

American Grass fed beef standards

'Diet — Animals are fed only grass and forage from weaning until harvest.

http://www.americangrassfed.org/about-us/our-standards/

American Grass fed beef standards

'Diet — Animals are fed only grass and forage from weaning until harvest.

http://www.americangrassfed.org/about-us/our-standards/

Sorted

 

[Dan Powell]

American Grass fed beef standards

'Diet — Animals are fed only grass and forage from weaning until harvest.

http://www.americangrassfed.org/about-us/our-standards/

That sounds far more sensible.

 

[DrWazzock]

I have accidentally discovered that creep feeding the sucklers makes up for those mothers that don't have much milk, but for those with mothers that have plenty of milk, it doesn't make them grow any faster.

Interested to try forage only diet after weaning. Calf on milk and forage only seems much healthier than those on creep. Not sweating, nice shiny coat etc. hmmmm.

 

[Newby]

Calf on milk and forage only seems much healthier than those on creep. Not sweating, nice shiny coat etc. hmmmm.

Do you find calves that are fed hard sweat?

 

[DrWazzock]

Do you find calves that are fed hard sweat?

Absolutely definitely. I have a heifer calf 7 months old won't go in the creep, just eats hay and has a milky mother, doesn't sweat at all, but looks as good as the other calves. The others eat about 3 kg each of barley and lupin creep per day, and they sweat a lot. No doubt whatsoever. Probably the extra energy or something in the rumen.

 

[cows250]

I took 3 purebred North American Holstein steers straight from weaning at 6 to 8 weeks to pasture only. In the last 100 days they have gained >200 pounds and are all >400 pounds now. Considering they are only about 150-160 days old now, I'm pretty sure grass is providing plenty of nutrition without grain or any other supplements.

I'm not sure if I can get them to finish off grass as their dams and sires are high type low body condition Holsteins, but I am going to try. I do know I prefered the young dairy cow I ate last year to the fatty (purchased) steer I am eating this year.

 

[Dan Powell]

There's nothing wrong with the eating quality of the Holstein, just a shame about the conformation.

 

[Old Tip]

Sorted

Yeah that's the good old USA, cheat at everything, over here grass fed means grass fed

 

[More to life]

Yeah that's the good old USA, cheat at everything, over here grass fed means grass fed

 

[bjreroberts]

If you are wanting to do it for marketing purposes then I would think most consumers interested in grass fed beef would also want the animals reared in the most natural way possible i.e. sucklers.

Not saying there isn't an economic case for doing what you are suggesting, so you may as well feed them concentrates if that is what is required.

 

[cows250]

There's nothing wrong with the eating quality of the Holstein, just a shame about the conformation.

What conformation? But, yes, they eat well. I am sure 90+% of the beef I have eaten here in the States was Holstein. Even a good portion of the "Certified Angus Beef" here is a black hided Holstein with good marbling.

These 3 are the test subjects. I will be doing at least 50 more calves that way next May (we still have snow in April). If I can get some of the older ones to finish I will keep some of the next 50 over the 2017/18 winter. If none can finish, I will just sell them all to the feedlot next November.

 

[Pedders]

just been online and found the Pasture for life standards ...wish I hadnt bothered http://www.pastureforlife.org/media/2014/03/PFLA-standards.pdf
just green tinged claptrap with lots of environmental footprint references and bleating about welfare .. ...you can feed fodder beet but not sugar beet ..why not ?
you might as well just become organic and join the soil association if you're that much of a masochist ...
only calves souced from other P4L certified farms are allowed to be used as well so that cuts out 99% of the available calves and will only serve to make it prohibitively expensive to do and by definition it will turn into a niche product for very wealthy consumers like organic has done and so miss out of a huge potential market .
its all very well to be so environmentally and welfare high minded..but none of the rest of us are going round destroying the planet or not looking after our animals properly are we ?
the real benefit of grass fed and IMO how it should be marketed is in the quality of the meat specifiically the omega fatty acids which are said to be good for the heart and it appears these benefits can be conferred in a relatively short time (6 weeks) certainly the last twelve months of its life would be plenty of time to do this

theres a study from Ireland here http://cdn.marksdailyapple.com/word...beefbettern3thanconventionalbeefBJN2011-2.pdf

better of starting your own group and doing it properly so people can afford to buy it .......

 

[Dan Powell]

It's a tricky balancing act for sure. I think perhaps they are trying to create a market for native breed suckler beef that is more profitable than at the moment. They're not really interested in dairy bred beef cattle.

My gut feeling, and I have read a little on the subject, is that suckler systems are inherently inefficient, and should only be used on rough grazing / hills / moors etc. If you want cattle in the lowlands then keep dairy cows and finish their offspring for beef as that is a more efficient use of resources.

Where I do agree with Pasture For Life, is that feeding a ruminant a grain-based diet is going to be viewed as more and more unethical. Not only that, I think a well managed grass based system would be more profitable in many cases. Having spend a lot of time and energy examining my beef production costs over the last 2 years, it is clear that as soon as you put that animal in a shed and start feeding it, your daily costs go through the roof, whereas at grass you're making some decent money.

My thread is fundamentally about to what extent I can push that. Could I rear calves at grass (with a milk bar type system), paddock graze them, overwinter on kale and finish the following year at grass with maybe just a brief time indoors in extreme weather, because if I can then beef will make decent money for me. A premium would be the cherry on the cake.

 

[Pedders]

It's a tricky balancing act for sure. I think perhaps they are trying to create a market for native breed suckler beef that is more profitable than at the moment. They're not really interested in dairy bred beef cattle.

My gut feeling, and I have read a little on the subject, is that suckler systems are inherently inefficient, and should only be used on rough grazing / hills / moors etc. If you want cattle in the lowlands then keep dairy cows and finish their offspring for beef as that is a more efficient use of resources.

Where I do agree with Pasture For Life, is that feeding a ruminant a grain-based diet is going to be viewed as more and more unethical. Not only that, I think a well managed grass based system would be more profitable in many cases. Having spend a lot of time and energy examining my beef production costs over the last 2 years, it is clear that as soon as you put that animal in a shed and start feeding it, your daily costs go through the roof, whereas at grass you're making some decent money.

My thread is fundamentally about to what extent I can push that. Could I rear calves at grass (with a milk bar type system), paddock graze them, overwinter on kale and finish the following year at grass with maybe just a brief time indoors in extreme weather, because if I can then beef will make decent money for me. A premium would be the cherry on the cake.

I don't see why feeding grain to cattle is unethical anymore than driving a car is ......a lot of nonsense is spouted by the greens and to base one's business decisons based on their rhetoric is IMO flawed ...feed grain if its profitable or don't if its not you really shouldn't let the latest enviroloon cause cloud your business judgement I can bet you anything you like that the average consumer certainly doesn't when she's shopping for the weekly joint ....


I hope the answer to your question is yes because what you are describing is exactly what we have just started doing with our first batch of Angus cross heifers ...weaned calves coming in from a local dairy farm and then outdoor wintering on a turnips/radish/rape/peas/tic beans/vetch/wheat mix with barley straw and molasses then early summer will be spent on annual forages and grass but not planning on finishing ...they'll go to a local finisher for that but if it works out we would be looking at trying to finish at least some the following year
on paper it's a relatively quick turnover and leaves a decent margin ....this time next year Rodney we'll be millionaires ....