River Lugg, Herefordshire

[Pistonbroke]

Tue 10 Jan 2023 06.30 GMT
"However, Powys county council is still approving intensive poultry units in the catchment. Last year, Fish Legal challenged a decision by Powys to approve a unit at Wern Haelog near Builth Wells, housing 90,000 chickens, but lost the case.

Last week, the Welsh government sent a holding direction to Powys county council to prevent it approving a new industrial poultry unit, also near Builth Wells, which would house 100,000 chickens at any one time. Welsh ministers will now decide whether to ‘call in’ the application, and rule on the chicken farm at government level."

Landmark decision on mega poultry farm could mean ‘life or death’ of River Wye

Welsh government considers whether to block plan after experts say manure from intensive units is turning Wye into ‘pea soup’

www.theguardian.com

Posted on 10 January 2023
"Herefordshire Council gave permission after its ecology officer advised planning officers that there was no need for a Habitats Regulation Assessment because the shed would not lead to any possibility of effects to the River Wye. That was in spite of the fact that there are already a number of livestock sheds on the site and the manure stored and spread on the land has only one place to go during rainfall, into the River Dore, into the River Monnow and ultimately into the River Wye.

At the Court of Appeal David argued that the High Court was wrong to accept ‘post hoc’ justification from the ecology officer that was submitted three months after planning permission had been granted and that the planning committee had been misled into believing that there was no need for a Habitats Regulations Assessment.

In his application to the Supreme Court, David argues that the approach of the lower courts to planning cases has meant that the “precautionary principle” has not been applied. This is the legal standard that any scientific doubt about a project’s impact on a protected site should be eliminated before permission is granted.

This case also addresses the cumulative impacts of the intensive farming development, already on this site, and in the Wye SAC."

Campaigner applies to Supreme Court over Wye Valley cattle shed plan | Leigh Day

Herefordshire man David Sahota has asked the Supreme Court to hear his claim that planning permission was given unlawfully for a cattle shed on the edge of the River Wye Special Area of Conservation.

www.leighday.co.uk

"The latest serious threat is from a new farming development on the banks of the River Dore, which is a tributary whose waters run into the River Wye. Good Law Project is now supporting a legal bid to stop this from going ahead.


The plans, which have been given the green light by Herefordshire Council, will see the expansion of Bage Court Farm in the village of Dorstone, including the construction of a giant new livestock shed. The increase in manure run-off generated by this development will see yet more ecological damage inflicted on the Dore and by extension, the River Wye."

The River Wye is under threat

Good Law Project's mission is to achieve change through the law. We uphold democracy, protect the environment, and ensure no one is left behind.

www.crowdjustice.com

I live near Builth Wells and know both of the farms concerned. They are both miles away from the wye and not near any other rivers. The one is trying to expand and already exports the manure to AD plants and the proposed one wants to do the same

 

[honeyend]

Rubbish

My job is totally governed by 'compliance', the mantra being, if its not written down, it never happened. You get a verbal instruction you follow it up with an email which includes everything discussed and asks for conformation, hell I even have a email dairy which I record anything that I think may be a problem, so I have a time line, and its very effective about not being dumped on. Most people do not work like this and if you have been in business f worked with a system for a long time, think you know how it works, you may think that using your judgement will be enough, not knowing that the 'paper' environment has changed. We've always done it this way, is now not a defence.
Pleading guilty is often not an admission of guilt but a calculation of the costs involved, can you fund the the fight and will what you win pay your total investment? A simple garden boundary dispute can cost over £40k.
Always send an email if you are hoping to act on something you are told.
The good thing in all this is disturbance is natures lottery and usually turns allows other things a chance to establish. I would be taking photos every month to have evidence of how quickly it recovers.

 

[Blackleg]

I live near Builth Wells and know both of the farms concerned. They are both miles away from the wye and not near any other rivers. The one is trying to expand and already exports the manure to AD plants and the proposed one wants to do the same

Earlier this year, Powys Council granted planning permission for two intensive poultry units up to 90,000 birds at Wern Haelog near Builth Wells next to the Wye. The proposal included a plan to export the manure and dirty water to an anaerobic digestor nearby. However, as the Brecon Beacons National Park Authority, Herefordshire County Council, and the Campaign for the Protection of Rural Wales (‘CPRW’) pointed out, the digestate would still contain very high levels of phosphates that would be spread on land within the catchment of the SAC.


But the council granted planning permission, arguing that what happens to the manure once It has been changed into digestate Is “not material”.


Fish Legal argued in the High Court in Cardiff that Powys had not considered the spreading of digestate within the Wye catchment – but was refused permission to proceed with a judicial review. Fish Legal then appealed to the Court of Appeal.


Error of law


Despite refusing Fish Legal’s appeal, Lord justice Lewison acknowledged that Powys’ position that the spreading of digestate was not material was “arguably” an “error of law”. But, nevertheless, Lewison LJ went on to say that the Council had conducted a full assessment of impact and had relied on Natural Resources Wales’ lack of objection in granting planning permission. In his short ruling he also suggests that the council could “rely on the existence of a regulatory regime, of which NRW was itself the regulator”.


Justin Neal, Fish Legal Solicitor commented, “This is obviously disappointing – not least for the river Wye. The difficulty we have is that although there is more than one way to describe the same assessment provided by the council, we can’t see where the spreading of digestate was considered. And NRW do not – as far as we are aware – regulate the spreading of digestate – nor is it fully regulated as a permitted activity. So, there are massive regulatory gaps where pollution is likely to occur.”


He continued, “For the time being, the Wye has become little more than a receptacle for pollution with no one really stepping in to turn things around. We suggest that NRW now confirms publicly that it does not regulate the spreading of digestate and to say what it intends to do to stop digestate fertiliser from causing pollution.”

 

[Pistonbroke]

Earlier this year, Powys Council granted planning permission for two intensive poultry units up to 90,000 birds at Wern Haelog near Builth Wells next to the Wye. The proposal included a plan to export the manure and dirty water to an anaerobic digestor nearby. However, as the Brecon Beacons National Park Authority, Herefordshire County Council, and the Campaign for the Protection of Rural Wales (‘CPRW’) pointed out, the digestate would still contain very high levels of phosphates that would be spread on land within the catchment of the SAC.


But the council granted planning permission, arguing that what happens to the manure once It has been changed into digestate Is “not material”.


Fish Legal argued in the High Court in Cardiff that Powys had not considered the spreading of digestate within the Wye catchment – but was refused permission to proceed with a judicial review. Fish Legal then appealed to the Court of Appeal.


Error of law


Despite refusing Fish Legal’s appeal, Lord justice Lewison acknowledged that Powys’ position that the spreading of digestate was not material was “arguably” an “error of law”. But, nevertheless, Lewison LJ went on to say that the Council had conducted a full assessment of impact and had relied on Natural Resources Wales’ lack of objection in granting planning permission. In his short ruling he also suggests that the council could “rely on the existence of a regulatory regime, of which NRW was itself the regulator”.


Justin Neal, Fish Legal Solicitor commented, “This is obviously disappointing – not least for the river Wye. The difficulty we have is that although there is more than one way to describe the same assessment provided by the council, we can’t see where the spreading of digestate was considered. And NRW do not – as far as we are aware – regulate the spreading of digestate – nor is it fully regulated as a permitted activity. So, there are massive regulatory gaps where pollution is likely to occur.”


He continued, “For the time being, the Wye has become little more than a receptacle for pollution with no one really stepping in to turn things around. We suggest that NRW now confirms publicly that it does not regulate the spreading of digestate and to say what it intends to do to stop digestate fertiliser from causing pollution.”

The AD plant concerned is very accurate on their soil tests and application rates though. Not like sticking the 16yr old on the spreader and telling him to black the field

 

[Blackleg]

Yes I understand, I'm not pretending to know much but the science bloke at the Wye and Usk foundation says there's already far too much phosphate in the ground and any further application anywhere in the catchment is no good for the river.
A link I posted earlier suggested the same.

 

[Tarw Coch]

Yes I understand, I'm not pretending to know much but the science bloke at the Wye and Usk foundation says there's already far too much phosphate in the ground and any further application anywhere in the catchment is no good for the river.
A link I posted earlier suggested the same.

I was under the impression but certainly don’t know for a fact that phosphate in the soil is fairly well locked up and doesn’t leach out so pretty much the only way phosphate in the soil can get into the watercourses is through erosion rather than leaching.
No doubt someone on here will know wether that is right or not

 

[Pistonbroke]

Yes I understand, I'm not pretending to know much but the science bloke at the Wye and Usk foundation says there's already far too much phosphate in the ground and any further application anywhere in the catchment is no good for the river.
A link I posted earlier suggested the same.

I wouldn't trust anything from the wye and usk. They're the biggest farmer bashers around, usually with nothing to back up their claims. Started out as a bunch of dentists and wealthy types who liked fishing and wangled a fortune in eu funding . Since their intervention our river's trout population has about gone and their isn't a poultry farm along it's whole length,all effluent and dip is kept under control and there is a fraction of the fert spread.

 

[Raider112]

I was under the impression but certainly don’t know for a fact that phosphate in the soil is fairly well locked up and doesn’t leach out so pretty much the only way phosphate in the soil can get into the watercourses is through erosion rather than leaching.
No doubt someone on here will know wether that is right or not

We had a field that had been barley for years, the phosphate level was high and when we put it down to grass it was very poor for a couple of years until the level dropped so I would say the soil holds phosphate very well based on that.

 

[Blackleg]

Avara recognises there's a problem though and is committed to reducing their impact albeit far too slowly.
I was at a meeting with their boss who didn't dispute the findings of Lancaster University's study (60-70% phosphate is from agriculture).

 

[br jones]

Uncle and nephew caught red-handed stealing scrap metal and steel

Uncle and nephew stole scrap metal and steel during ‘unsophisticated’ burglary

www.southwalesargus.co.uk

Couple of hundred offences ,and a suspended sentance

 

[JJT]

Uncle and nephew caught red-handed stealing scrap metal and steel

Uncle and nephew stole scrap metal and steel during ‘unsophisticated’ burglary

www.southwalesargus.co.uk

Couple of hundred offences ,and a suspended sentance

But in his defense... “There were too many drugs being taken at this time which skewed his thinking on the day.” WTAF!

 

[ollie989898]

I was under the impression but certainly don’t know for a fact that phosphate in the soil is fairly well locked up and doesn’t leach out so pretty much the only way phosphate in the soil can get into the watercourses is through erosion rather than leaching.
No doubt someone on here will know wether that is right or not

That is correct.

Phosphate is bound to the soil particles and the only way it is leaving a field is attached to that soil. So if you see soil leaving the field, phosphate is going with it.

This is important for people to understand and why it is very very important to maintain buffer zones and protective margins alongside watercourses.

 

[Tarw Coch]

That is correct.

Phosphate is bound to the soil particles and the only way it is leaving a field is attached to that soil. So if you see soil leaving the field, phosphate is going with it.

This is important for people to understand and why it is very very important to maintain buffer zones and protective margins alongside watercourses.

But if that is correct, fields with high phosphate levels aren’t adversely affecting river levels unless there is some form of soil erosion

 

[Blackleg]

But if that is correct, fields with high phosphate levels aren’t adversely affecting river levels unless there is some form of soil erosion

Yes!!!

"Phosphate can also be found bound up in soil particles. Agricultural practice has a profound effect on these pollution sources. As the industry has moved away from orchards and pasture, run-off has been an increasing problem throughout the county."

Phosphate pollution - CPRE Herefordshire

Phosphate pollution can cause excessive growth of algae, which can decrease the level of oxygen dissolved in Herefordshire's river water.

www.cpreherefordshire.org.uk

 

[ollie989898]

But if that is correct, fields with high phosphate levels aren’t adversely affecting river levels unless there is some form of soil erosion

That is correct.

But I suspect there has been a shift in the farming practices of that area of the UK over the last 40 years. Anything involving maize or roots invariably involves a lot more bare dirt on offer so more chances for soil to leave the fields.

Mind you, an increase in housing in any area means more sewerage going in, more volume from properties and more phosphates from detergents going into the sewer system so it's not all black and white on farming.

 

[Blackleg]

so it's not all black and white on farming.

Agreed but there's a lot of data coming in now from the citizen science initiative which should help.

Project Summary – Resilience Phosphorus UK

wp.lancs.ac.uk

 

[ollie989898]

Agreed but there's a lot of data coming in now from the citizen science initiative which should help.

Project Summary – Resilience Phosphorus UK

wp.lancs.ac.uk

There ain't gonna be no peak phosphate for over a hundred years. Mankind has far bigger problems on it's plate than running out of phosphate.

If there is an issue with phosphate in particular parts of the UK it should be down to farmers to think up methods to avoid the loss of phosphate. Wide buffer zones, margins, careful drainage planning and the like may be useful.

 

[Werzle]

I wouldn't trust anything from the wye and usk. They're the biggest farmer bashers around, usually with nothing to back up their claims. Started out as a bunch of dentists and wealthy types who liked fishing and wangled a fortune in eu funding . Since their intervention our river's trout population has about gone and their isn't a poultry farm along it's whole length,all effluent and dip is kept under control and there is a fraction of the fert spread.

All these not for profit groups have to create a cause so donations are made to pay there wages. Its just a legal scam imo.

 

[Blackleg]

If there is an issue with phosphate in particular parts of the UK it should be down to farmers to think up methods to avoid the loss of phosphate. Wide buffer zones, margins, careful drainage planning and the like may be useful.

Or send it out of the Wye catchment, don't put it on the land.


"Each year 3,000 tonnes more phosphate is spread on Herefordshire fields than the plants can take up. Effectively, there is enough phosphate already on the fields to cover the next 5-8 years!


The authors point out that P is an essential but finite resource. It’s now rising in cost due to the war situation in Ukraine so we should be careful not to waste it. Some agricultural land, mostly in the east of Britain, is actually low in P levels and needs the input for good production. However, “leakage of food system P into water is causing widespread damage to the quality and biodiversity of inland and coastal waters in the UK and globally”.


So spreading it in the Wye catchment on land that is already choked with it just makes the situation worse."

Phosphate pollution - CPRE Herefordshire

Phosphate pollution can cause excessive growth of algae, which can decrease the level of oxygen dissolved in Herefordshire's river water.

www.cpreherefordshire.org.uk

 

[ollie989898]

Or send it out of the Wye catchment, don't put it on the land.


"Each year 3,000 tonnes more phosphate is spread on Herefordshire fields than the plants can take up. Effectively, there is enough phosphate already on the fields to cover the next 5-8 years!


The authors point out that P is an essential but finite resource. It’s now rising in cost due to the war situation in Ukraine so we should be careful not to waste it. Some agricultural land, mostly in the east of Britain, is actually low in P levels and needs the input for good production. However, “leakage of food system P into water is causing widespread damage to the quality and biodiversity of inland and coastal waters in the UK and globally”.


So spreading it in the Wye catchment on land that is already choked with it just makes the situation worse."

Phosphate pollution - CPRE Herefordshire

Phosphate pollution can cause excessive growth of algae, which can decrease the level of oxygen dissolved in Herefordshire's river water.

www.cpreherefordshire.org.uk

If people are wasting P by putting it on their fields they are nuts. They would be better off paying someone to take it. You can sour land by putting too much P and K on and make it unpalatable to stock not to mention seriously fudging your soil chemistry.