What happens to manufacturers test and demo tractors

[nick...]

We had lots off very reasonably price tractors machines from massey (you new what you were getting thats why they were better priced) when they were at coventry and stoneliegh sensors stuck every where with short wires on wrong pannels etc
My favourite was a 590 with a 236 turbo engine in probly a test 698t or 3070
Pulled the rear off our 699s on the choppers but not the 1155 v8 there were four of those in less than twenty miles from here
Even tried the 300 series with the engine in backwards
And lots off diggers two
The good old days when we made tractors and wernt just a assembly nation
No dis to jcb etc

Seen a few pics of tractors with engines fitted backwards,anyone know why this was done.maybe one for @Cowabunga
Nick...

 

[Cowabunga]

Seen a few pics of tractors with engines fitted backwards,anyone know why this was done.maybe one for @Cowabunga
Nick...

No idea, but there is really no such thing as backwards and forwards as long as the engine turns the correct way. By that I mean crank rotation.

For instance, Honda engines turn anticlockwise looking from the flywheel end, which meant that in a model which had Honda gearboxes, the engine and gearbox had to be fitted across the front with the gearbox at a different end or a different gearbox fitted [VW] on some models of Austin Rover cars years ago.

Also it might amuse you to observe the current and now well established CNH NEF engine family of 4.5 litre and 6.7 litre engines which have their timing gears at the flywheel end rather than at the fanbelt end. Nothing stopping Iveco putting the flywheel on the other end for some applications but not seen one like that in any application. They are able to take power off both ends of the crank of course and a common tractor application of this is for the front PTO.

 

[Robt]

Buying prototypes at a nightmare , you are happy to buy it cheap at pint of sale yet then they moan when parts support is rubbish! Prototype should never be sold
We once had an ex training school case 4240. That thing was an animal and had been tuned ! It would keep with a MX135 on a grain trailer! Blackjack smoke and plenty of poke.

 

[nick...]

Sorry allways understood prototype machines were crushed or dismantled.i know they are in other industries
Nick...

 

[Sheep]

Oh yes they do.

Unless they're very well tucked away or at another location, the last one went a few years ago. 7710 ford iirc.

 

[Elpresidente]

I know that all the pre production kubota m7 tractors were sent back to factory striped down and used as training modules for the dealers around the world.

The Kubota M7 I had a brief test drive back in the summer wanted sending back and starting from scratch

 

[Finn farmer]

Buying prototypes at a nightmare , you are happy to buy it cheap at pint of sale yet then they moan when parts support is rubbish! Prototype should never be sold
We once had an ex training school case 4240. That thing was an animal and had been tuned ! It would keep with a MX135 on a grain trailer! Blackjack smoke and plenty of poke.

Friend has a pre-production Joskin slurry tanker. Has done 7 years (and 15000m³ of slurry per year) with very little trouble. Other farmer bought a prototype tanker from a small local company that went bankrupt. Got a pretty expensive pile of metal crap.

 

[bravheart]

There was a prototype combine around here for a while, think it was partly a lexion dressed as a dominator. Bit of a nightmare for the owner and the dealer, no matching part numbers or books to refer to, dealer eventually bought it back and shipped it abroad out the way.

 

[Henrythefarmer]

I believe some prototype tractors end up in college workshops for training

 

[Clive]

We had a 7t JCB tracked 360 for years that was an ex test mule / development machine - had an odd engine in it and 13t hydraulic system


It was a nightmare to get parts for!

 

[Two Tone]

Some prototypes do end up being sold. My Dual Stream Header was one of the 3 that NH made. The other 2 were scrapped. They did briefly go into production before they scrapped the whole idea (because NH would rather sell you a bigger, more expensive Combine) and I now also have 2 complete 35” versions that were never sold.

A friend of mine was on the design team for Range Rover. He would test and bring home various new models. I well remember him bringing home a 3.5 litre V8 version of the Jaguar Lion 2.7 litre V6 engine, which replaced (eventually) the BMW Diesel engine.
I asked him what would happen to that vehicle and he said they all go “into the wall”. That is crash tested into a wall, with dummies or actual cadavers in them.
I asked if I could have the camera off that one and he said no. The must have absolutely everything on them as would be the case as they left the production line.

I remember saying to him that it was clever that they had turned the 2.7 V6 engine into a 3.5 V8 engine.
He said no. They designed and built the Lion V8 engine first, but BMW wouldn’t let them use it. So they turned it into the V6 to use on the Jaguar S type and Discovery 3 and Range Rover Sport (which you could also have the V8 in up to 2009).

 

[nick...]

A lot of the stuff jcb sell in their annual action is probably prototype or test machinery and anyone can buy it if wanted.also know that lotus cars,local to me used to and maybe still destroy their cars after the testing has finished,especially cars from other manufacturers.im sure there could be liability issues for non genuine vehicles if accidents occur
Nick...

 

[Two Tone]

A lot of the stuff jcb sell in their annual action is probably prototype or test machinery and anyone can buy it if wanted.also know that lotus cars,local to me used to and maybe still destroy their cars after the testing has finished,especially cars from other manufacturers.im sure there could be liability issues for non genuine vehicles if accidents occur
Nick...

I have huge respect for Lotus cars.
But the old adage "Loads Of Trouble Usually Serious" might put purchasers of any prototypes off a bit.

It amazes me that so many car and tractor manufacturers often test each other's makes, but they do.
My Landrover RangeRover design friend permanently "Reshaped" a Lotus Esprit on test once on the A12 near Woodbridge.

 

[CowBale]

Unless they're very well tucked away or at another location, the last one went a few years ago. 7710 ford iirc.

There’s still a 7910 Q cab, a 6610 SQ, and there’s also a TW20. And yes, they are tucked away. There’s also another location at Thurrock where there’s still one or two.

 

[Bald Rick]

A lot of the stuff jcb sell in their annual action is probably prototype or test machinery and anyone can buy it if wanted.also know that lotus cars,local to me used to and maybe still destroy their cars after the testing has finished,especially cars from other manufacturers.im sure there could be liability issues for non genuine vehicles if accidents occur
Nick...

AMS sell off ex demo and prototype twice a year but there NO warranty
(Note - JCB will not sell their own ex demo stuff to dealers or us. All through AMS)

Proceeds go into Lord B’s brother pocket as a means of funding him if you are to believe my local JCB dealer

 

[Red Fred]

Anyone remember the Masseys that were sent to Seale Hayne back around 1980. I believe a deal; was done and they were soon traded in for another make, which didn't please the high ups at Coventry. I can't remember the full story, must be me age

 

[Cowabunga]

Some prototypes do end up being sold. My Dual Stream Header was one of the 3 that NH made. The other 2 were scrapped. They did briefly go into production before they scrapped the whole idea (because NH would rather sell you a bigger, more expensive Combine) and I now also have 2 complete 35” versions that were never sold.

A friend of mine was on the design team for Range Rover. He would test and bring home various new models. I well remember him bringing home a 3.5 litre V8 version of the Jaguar Lion 2.7 litre V6 engine, which replaced (eventually) the BMW Diesel engine.
I asked him what would happen to that vehicle and he said they all go “into the wall”. That is crash tested into a wall, with dummies or actual cadavers in them.
I asked if I could have the camera off that one and he said no. The must have absolutely everything on them as would be the case as they left the production line.

I remember saying to him that it was clever that they had turned the 2.7 V6 engine into a 3.5 V8 engine.
He said no. They designed and built the Lion V8 engine first, but BMW wouldn’t let them use it. So they turned it into the V6 to use on the Jaguar S type and Discovery 3 and Range Rover Sport (which you could also have the V8 in up to 2009).

Both the 2.7 V6 and the 3.6 V8 are known as the Lion engines. Designed jointly and built by Ford for use in JLR and PSA vehicles. Not sure whether PSA used many of them.
They are known by Ford and Jaguar as the AJD-V6 or V8 and by Peugeot/Citroen as the DT17 and by LR as the 2.7TD V6 and 3.6TD V8

 

[Robt]

Some prototypes do end up being sold. My Dual Stream Header was one of the 3 that NH made. The other 2 were scrapped. They did briefly go into production before they scrapped the whole idea (because NH would rather sell you a bigger, more expensive Combine) and I now also have 2 complete 35” versions that were never sold.

A friend of mine was on the design team for Range Rover. He would test and bring home various new models. I well remember him bringing home a 3.5 litre V8 version of the Jaguar Lion 2.7 litre V6 engine, which replaced (eventually) the BMW Diesel engine.
I asked him what would happen to that vehicle and he said they all go “into the wall”. That is crash tested into a wall, with dummies or actual cadavers in them.
I asked if I could have the camera off that one and he said no. The must have absolutely everything on them as would be the case as they left the production line.

I remember saying to him that it was clever that they had turned the 2.7 V6 engine into a 3.5 V8 engine.
He said no. They designed and built the Lion V8 engine first, but BMW wouldn’t let them use it. So they turned it into the V6 to use on the Jaguar S type and Discovery 3 and Range Rover Sport (which you could also have the V8 in up to 2009).

Are you seriously saying JLR use dead bodies to crash test their vehicles?

 

[Two Tone]

Are you seriously saying JLR use dead bodies to crash test their vehicles?

Yes. All manufacturers have to include the use of cadavers as part of their NCAP testing.
One would hope that crash test dummies have got so good now, that the use of cadavers is minimal.

 

[Bongodog]

Yes. All manufacturers have to include the use of cadavers as part of their NCAP testing.
One would hope that crash test dummies have got so good now, that the use of cadavers is minimal.

It may happen elsewhere in the World, but is illegal in the UK and to the best of my knowledge has been for a very long time. We have had a succession of anantomy acts in the UK that very tightly control how bodies are donated for medical research and only medical research that date back to the consequences of Burke & Hare