Isn't lucerne very expensive and slow to get going at the start?
The humble year of an organic farmer
- Thread starter L P
- Start date
yes it is but once it goes it pays back for 4 years hence cost of seed vs return.. this year it was mega slow to establish in spring
Have tried lucerne on small areas, I can't get it to grow at all well until 2nd year, which is when we are looking to pull it out again. Might revisit it in a few years if we stretch the rotation to 3/4 1/4. Too long a rotation in my mind... for here at least. Ryegrass/clover 2yr ley we used to graze, having gone to clover only we are doing 16 months, topping it 4-6" when any weeds are flowering. Just in from drilling, when I get a minute I will take photos. Really pleased with how its done
Mascani from 2022 harvest, lovely heavy and bright sample compared to anything this year, 100% germ which is a lot better than most merchant seed. dressed with nuello N, supposedly stimulates the plant to capture N. 180kg/ha seed rate. 6m kv ts evo, chose it for ability to min till and drill well into conventional till, output, hp requirement, simplicity and running costs, also not much else which has 5" row spacing. Aim to get total ground coverage as fast as possible once crop is through. Good drill, basic control box irritates me that you can't (I can't) do a calibration nudge, calibration bag is pretty awkward too. The joys of running older tractors, plus side, they are great at changing their own oil if you help them by topping up, bloody power quad bolt sheared.... my fault, I only said a couple of days ago that the 7800 just keeps plodding on and rarely gives trouble. Loyalty helps, called the man that was in his element as workshop manager when they were new, never stopped dealing with him and he's a bloody good depot manager now.... remembered just how to extract the stub deep inside the casting in a flash, cheers Jay, impact driver and a long tek screw with tip modified wound it straight out in the absence of a 5mm left hand cut drill bit, took longer to take prop off than fix it.
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Glad to get chance of a photo of what the prolander can do. @Bokey this was a job on neighbours yesterday, conventional farm, reduced herbicides. Corner of the field rape didn't do well on. Sweep wings are dearer to run on it as no tungsten alternative, but at home we get a tilth on straight 60mm tungsten points and then rip through with sweeps which have total ground coverage. It does immense good at pulling whole docks and thistles, root intact to the surface. Little late in the year now, success for total kill needs a dry warm week ideally.
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Extaise I believe. Blackgrass, oh yes! Folk seem to be controlling it better but it's still present and a burden. We have it on the farm, normally more prevalent in rye, but doest compete, never in spring crops, appears from nowhere in grass/clover leys, but thankfully very easy to control then. Although present it hasn't given any trouble, damned sight better than when we were conventional
Dan Powell
Member
- Location
- Shropshire
Dan Powell
Member
- Location
- Shropshire
@L P have you found the market for spring barley is holding up. Gave it up here as couldn't sell for feed. We grow all winter cereals where we can help it. Seem to compete with weeds better than spring cereals in our experience and yield better too for us. Quite like pea/barley though for the fertility boost.
Trialling a one year legume fallow this time to be funded through SFI, will be interesting to see how the fertility of that compares with a 3 year herbal ley mob grazed with cattle which is what we normally do.
Trialling a one year legume fallow this time to be funded through SFI, will be interesting to see how the fertility of that compares with a 3 year herbal ley mob grazed with cattle which is what we normally do.
Glad I'm not the only one, got to yr2 of mid tier and thought "what the hell have we gone and done?" We do have a small family shoot here, I'll post a photo at some point of our own "bird mixture" which does AHL3 proud, alive with bird species too, invertebrates etc, does not require replanting nor destroying, amazing self regenerative habitat
Feed barley market is depressing.. the whole organic grain market seems suppressed this year IMHO. We aim for malting on spring barley, Westminster seems to be the only wb for malting, not grown it but apparently makes a beautiful looking crop with very little grain in the shed after. Reckon you'll do well on legume fallow on stockless basis, in theory it should put more n into following crop than mob grazing, I'd not wish to put money on real life results!
I agree winter cereals compete more BTW. Financially though, sb year on year comes leagues ahead here, followed by winter milling oats. Wb we grew this last year yielded well for the season we had and came to harvest early enough that any thistle hadn't set. Laureate however, nearly matched its yield and commanded a £50/t premium
Growing organic spring crops is getting harder with the extremes in weather we are seeing these days.. totally agree that winter sowing far less risky as at least the roots have established before flood or freeze or drought or heat which are more common now. The only down side is winter weeds and loss of nitrogen from leaching especially over chalk.. I am also certain that Laureate is genetically very poorly suited to low nitrogen inputs and that oats or triticale work much better as a spring cereal option in organics because if they fail as a cash crop they will crimp as a wholecrop giving you options... never pre sell organic spring crops and wait until they are weighed and dry and in the barn
You seem damning of any approach that's not your approach Huno. What works for one farm may prove unviable for another, I have not criticised your system, it obviously works for you and could be constructive input for many. Keep it constructive...Growing organic spring crops is getting harder with the extremes in weather we are seeing these days.. totally agree that winter sowing far less risky as at least the roots have established before flood or freeze or drought or heat which are more common now. The only down side is winter weeds and loss of nitrogen from leaching especially over chalk.. I am also certain that Laureate is genetically very poorly suited to low nitrogen inputs and that oats or triticale work much better as a spring cereal option in organics because if they fail as a cash crop they will crimp as a wholecrop giving you options... never pre sell organic spring crops and wait until they are weighed and dry and in the barn
Any form of spring wheat, be it ancient or not, grown here would do at best 1.5t, but more likely 1t/acre, add in risk of ergot and hagberg and a 1t feed crop @£270 does not compare to a 2t crop of Laureate @£320... genetically poor, maybe but it's not proving so. Spring oats have hated the long dry April/mays we keep getting. Wholecropping has bob hope of a return in a stockless system
Highland Farmer
Member
If it's any consolation I didn't read any criticism of anyone's system.
I find that with organic there isn't a one size fits all, it's about finding what works best for you and the land.
I only really grow spring oats as a cereal crop and then only for feed after getting burnt by the milling company when they had plenty of organic crop one year. I tried winter Triticale one year but lost the whole crop to fusarium (I think it was contaminated seed as it was on a field that hadn't been cropped since I was a boy (20+ years ago).
I'm interested in trying it again, but over winter grazing it with some sheep ala Newman Turner style to reduce weed burden / disease.
Here's a picture of another experiment, my house lawn! Never been fertilised, during summer it's mowed once a week and all grass cuttings are removed. In conventional terms it should be a barren waste... It's been like this for over 10 years now and look at the fungus this year! Nature drawing elements out of the air and making available locked away nutrients... that is my objective for the whole farm!!
I find that with organic there isn't a one size fits all, it's about finding what works best for you and the land.
I only really grow spring oats as a cereal crop and then only for feed after getting burnt by the milling company when they had plenty of organic crop one year. I tried winter Triticale one year but lost the whole crop to fusarium (I think it was contaminated seed as it was on a field that hadn't been cropped since I was a boy (20+ years ago).
I'm interested in trying it again, but over winter grazing it with some sheep ala Newman Turner style to reduce weed burden / disease.
Here's a picture of another experiment, my house lawn! Never been fertilised, during summer it's mowed once a week and all grass cuttings are removed. In conventional terms it should be a barren waste... It's been like this for over 10 years now and look at the fungus this year! Nature drawing elements out of the air and making available locked away nutrients... that is my objective for the whole farm!!
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Crikey Huno, no need to be like that, your comment over Laureate vs alternative spring crops and wholecropping isn't valid for here. Like I said in reasonable depth.
Your success with lucerne/crimping is admirable and be very interesting to hear your results off the back of it, along with how you get it off to a good start.