I think your trying to be obtuse now it’s visibly very obvious! My time drills moves more than an avatar, a strip till moves more than a a normal tine.
are you trying to claim the ploughing causes the same amount of soil disturbance as a disc drill?
Will we be ploughing for re seeding in the future?
- Thread starter hoff135
- Start date
are you trying to claim the ploughing causes the same amount of soil disturbance as a disc drill?
Hilly
Member
- Location
- Scottish Borders.
I’m not because I’m siting on the fence waiting to see what happens .
No I am not but soil movement is soil movement and releases carbon,I am not a big fan of ploughing because min till works well on my farm but I wouldn’t want to penalize someone for doing it.How many nastiest are released from cover crop rotting down? and how much moisture does it remove that the growing crop needs now?
- Location
- South Molton
£90/ha as a one off payment.
No of course it doesn't.
but the narrower the spacing the more disturbance , albeit shallow and that narrow spacing won't deal with a trash problem very well .
For a grass reseed I would want all ground covered not drills.
Don't forget the localised acidity affecting seed germination/ v. early seedlings as well with that trash as it breaks down especially if its heavier/ wetter ground in a wet time, the old simple problems just because they are old and simple just don't go away., dealing with them sort of issues does make more complicated discisions and narrow up windows of opportunity dont they.
All fair points. Here the moisture thing with cover crops is beneficial in autumn. My short term catch crops wicked out a lot of summer early autumn water. I don’t think covers take any out of spring as they are basically dead/dormant when drilling in the spring. Drilling green in the spring here is pretty disastrous though.
On soil movement, I think it’s fairly obvious that an avatar causes much less soil movement than a solo or topdown!
Cover crops breaking down you could well be right I don’t know.
Anyway I’m doing this no till to make more money to spend on myself, nothing to do with some meagre subsidy or saving the world!
Homesy
Member
- Location
- North West Devon
Kiwis have been doing it for decades. Never seem to have a problem. What's yours ? are you an agronomist or something ?
Good for you, I think we are all trying to make more money,as they say there is always more ways of skinning a cat. I think what I was trying to say was that if someone plough out some grassland and reseed it and leaves it down for 10 years why should they be penalized for moving soil for 1 year out the 10 when dd crops move the soil every year!
Hilly
Member
- Location
- Scottish Borders.
It’s hard to believe ploughing a field realises carbon it really is.
Sure, I knew you would have seen it, I was wondering how you are interpreting it. What do they mean by 'reduced tillage' ? Reduced from what you as an individual farmer currently do ? Because, as you say, that would include min-till if you currently plough.
- Location
- Berkshire
Is it really that difficult to understand that oxidising organic matter releases CO2 ??
Farming News - 20 per cent of world’s CO2 from ploughing – soil scientist
Farming online news 20 per cent of world’s CO2 from ploughing – soil scientist
farming.co.uk
less movement = less CO2 simples
Dave6170
Member
- Location
- Watten, caithness
What if the following crop was established as quickly as possible after ploughing? Does that reduce the amount of carbon released?
I think they are struggling with definitions. Defra are coming here next month so I can define it!
- Location
- Essex
Is it because no-one will do anything for the environment but everyone will do anything for money?
Whilst you're at it, can you ask for clarity on the below. Or could you give your view on it now ?
So a maximum payment of £70/ acre ?
They'll have to do better than that. Much better.
Not read all the thread but to answer the title, I won't be ploughing much to reseed, the only time I do is if the land needs leveling which is only relevant to a few bits of a few fields, if we are no longer able to plough I will have to think of another way to level it or just leave it.
Why not just grow grass that doesn't need reseeding seems much easier to me ?
never used roundup or anything like it on the fields here, if we do need to reseed for the above reason I just plough it up work it down sow the seed and roll it in, seems to work.
more than half the land here hasn't been ploughed or reseeded for at least 50 years, seems like a racket to keep machinery makers and diesel suppliers in a job
Why not just grow grass that doesn't need reseeding seems much easier to me ?
never used roundup or anything like it on the fields here, if we do need to reseed for the above reason I just plough it up work it down sow the seed and roll it in, seems to work.
more than half the land here hasn't been ploughed or reseeded for at least 50 years, seems like a racket to keep machinery makers and diesel suppliers in a job
- Location
- Lorette Manitoba
I’m into min til because is the only way to produce a decent crop here while covering all the acres in a timely manner,neighbour has tried direct drilling for two years which were dry years and should have conserved moisture better than mine. The heavy black soil here doesn’t warm if not blackened to some degree. I had finished drilling by the time they were able to start simply because of being wet under the trash. He is a dairy farmer milking 600 cows and need a good supply for forage. Some of his fields were a total disappointment and reseeded just to try and get something. How much carbon did I loose moving soil but how much is returned by a better crop. I can remember reading that the amazon is the oxygen tank of the world but recently a picture of the US Midwest’s maize crop was kicking out more oxygen per acre than the amazon forest. Further west direct drill works great but their soils and climate are different. Ploughing still has its place and has been the mainstay for crop production fir generations. Did any of the dd fans try it in the 80s when it was fashionable then return back to the ploughing once the black grass over ran your farms ? What is going to happen when roundup is taken away.
Maybe, but lets say it is £70/acre. That's a £70/acre subsidy for the farmer who does this compared to the farmer who doesn't do this, for no discernible 'public good'.
On ELMS alone I have made two submissions to the co-design process, and been a case study for a test and trial. I regard that as being positive.