What to do 🤦‍♂️ So tight they squeak

steveR · Jul 12, 2021

PSQ said:
The irony is that all of the necessary and required expenditure is tax deductible, and if he is making as much profit as you think then (depending on business structure / partners) he could be paying half of the profit in tax.
Or to look at it another way for every £100 ***invested*** in maintaining his own business it’s only really costing him £50.

Talk to him, and if he won’t see sense then tell him you’re needing time off for interviews, and he’ll be responsible for his own stock in 2 months time.

That is an excellent summary I would say, and good advice.

Only thing I thought might be a useful first option, would be for the OP to put in writing, a brief summary of where he can see problems, and a number of suggestion on what needs to be done, possibly a fag packet calculation or two in there.

Reading back, it appears as if there needs to be money spent on buildings, machinery and stock management. The OP appears to like his employer, but it is just that there is a disconnection between the man and his farm!

If he is a businessman, a properly worded statement might help focus his mind, and is something he could discuss with other parties, accountants, family etc. If the response is still negative, then it's time for the OP to hand in Notice.

farmerm · Jul 12, 2021

If you are the manager and don't have the autonomy to buy a set of tyres to keep a quad safe and legal then are you a manager, a foreman or a farm worker?

betweenthelines · Jul 12, 2021

betweenthelines said:
I very much doubt you see the figures his Accountant submits for tax purposes.

Why?
[/QUOTE]

Because if he's as tight as you say, he'd never let anyone else see them.

betweenthelines · Jul 12, 2021

PSQ said:
The irony is that all of the necessary and required expenditure is tax deductible, and if he is making as much profit as you think then (depending on business structure / partners) he could be paying half of the profit in tax.
Or to look at it another way for every £100 ***invested*** in maintaining his own business it’s only really costing him £50.

Another reason why I'm sceptical about the "profit" figures stated by the OP

PSQ · Jul 12, 2021

steveR said:
Only thing I thought might be a useful first option, would be for the OP to put in writing, a brief summary of where he can see problems, and a number of suggestion on what needs to be done, possibly a fag packet calculation or two in there.

Reading back, it appears as if there needs to be money spent on buildings, machinery and stock management. The OP appears to like his employer, but it is just that there is a disconnection between the man and his farm!

Agreed, present him with a list of items that are not up to a ‘tolerable standard’: H&S, tyres, roofs, shortage of basic tools etc etc, and the way his parsimony is making life needlessly harder and arduous for his staff.
It’s 2021, he shouldn’t be asking his staff to work in conditions more akin to farming in 1971.

Kidds · Jul 12, 2021

Scrapyard Challenge farming is one of the most miserable things out there.
I understand not being too lavish on things but making your workers use broken (which nearly always means dangerous) stuff is pants and really shows how much regard the "boss" his for his staff and his farm. I hate it and won't have it.
You will always get it on farms as it seems to be the mentality of farmers, as shown by all the folk saying they straighten staples. For £30 you can buy a lot more staples than you can straighten in a day. A day where you pay the staple straightener probably 3 times that. It's the same as the silly buggers spending the first hours of every day trying to start the tractors that have knackered batteries. Three days of that and you would pay for a new battery for less money.
I vote leave because you won't change them. Or stay and refuse to use or allow the use of any dangerous kit.

tr250 · Jul 12, 2021

Cowmansam said:
Can’t be that much need for other staff then really other than lambing/ calving times

As you say depends on system but there’s plenty of things go about saying one man can do such and such but when you look into it they don’t really farm as such they are glorified shepard’s doing the whole is a different matter on the op scale there’s enough work for a man to never touch an animal I would have thought

Shoudawouldacoulda · Jul 12, 2021

farmerm said:
If you are the manager and don't have the autonomy to buy a set of tyres to keep a quad safe and legal then are you a manager, a foreman or a farm worker?

I can buy tyres if I want to I just don’t want the pushback all the time.
just to put the manager thing to bed.
My role is to to manage staff including hire and fire, do all paperwork including bps claim, all stock paperwork, decide on strategy and implement that strategy with the cropping and stock. Order everything the farm needs to function and submit the invoices to farm office for payment by owners wife.
I am given total autonomy to dowith the farm as I wish BUT owner comes out and tries to get involved where he can(his right as the owner) owner must sign off new expenditure and will always have his say on any moneygoing out the door. I have a very close relationship with owner andhe is an incredibly generous man outside the farm. He simply can not get his head around spending. When I propose things that will save time and labour costs his response is always the same. “But that will just make things easier “ I try to explain that by being more efficient with staff time it frees up man hours to tackle fences and fix the broken things but he has always just made do. Once the seat broke on a tractorso he used a breeze block to sit on instead for the entire summer!

Cowmansam · Jul 12, 2021

tr250 said:
As you say depends on system but there’s plenty of things go about saying one man can do such and such but when you look into it they don’t really farm as such they are glorified shepard’s doing the whole is a different matter on the op scale there’s enough work for a man to never touch an animal I would have thought

Certainly depends upon what other duties they have there’s a difference between a full on farm manager doing all the paperwork accounts and a herd/ flock manager who just does the paper work involved with just the herd set up right one man should be able to deal with 300 suckers and followers do all the paper work involved with them fairly easily I know a good few doing that with milkers and milking themselves at least once a day

Shoudawouldacoulda · Jul 12, 2021

betweenthelines said:
Why?

Because if he's as tight as you say, he'd never let anyone else see them.
[/QUOTE]
He’s not right he’s just right about reinvestment

Cowmansam · Jul 12, 2021

As above then he’s doing the full works makes it a different job

betweenthelines · Jul 12, 2021

OP says his employer pays well, doesn't mind paying taxes and that he (the OP) "does everything except the Bank transfers" but complains that "the chequebook" is kept by the boss?

Surely the farm has credit accounts with local businesses, if the quad needs new tyres why not get it done and argue the toss when the bills come in? Or does the OP not have the authority to do so?
Similarly with medicines, I presume the boss doesn't stand over you while you do every injection?

To me, some things aren't adding up.

Cowmansam · Jul 12, 2021

Certainly can’t understand anyone not keeping a stock of meds if you have to call a vet out because you haven’t got it in stock or even worse don’t get something treated will soon cost a lot more never mind the obvious welfare issues

tr250 · Jul 12, 2021

Cowmansam said:
Certainly depends upon what other duties they have there’s a difference between a full on farm manager doing all the paperwork accounts and a herd/ flock manager who just does the paper work involved with just the herd set up right one man should be able to deal with 300 suckers and followers do all the paper work involved with them fairly easily I know a good few doing that with milkers and milking themselves at least once a day

Yes definitely and then there’s hedge/ditch/yard maintenance. Straw/silage/muck. There is a huge amount to do on a farm! Does your one man band ever have a holiday or a day off? I know of plenty that say they do but conveniently forget about mum or Dad that milk every weekend check cows at calving keep things running for holidays ect all easily forgotten

Shoudawouldacoulda · Jul 12, 2021

betweenthelines said:
OP says his employer pays well, doesn't mind paying taxes and that he (the OP) "does everything except the Bank transfers" but complains that "the chequebook" is kept by the boss?

Surely the farm has credit accounts with local businesses, if the quad needs new tyres why not get it done and argue the toss when the bills come in? Or does the OP not have the authority to do so?
Similarly with medicines, I presume the boss doesn't stand over you while you do every injection?

To me, some things aren't adding up.

It’s about arguing the toss why should I have to on everything and yes I can use accounts.
I gave injections as an example to paint a picture. Not sure why you are taking the angle of making me out to be lying when I’m simply looking for advice on something that is causing me a lot of stress and family stress. It’s a big decision to leave and I have been completely honest in my description of things.
Sorry if it has bothered you

digger64 · Jul 12, 2021

Shoudawouldacoulda said:
I can buy tyres if I want to I just don’t want the pushback all the time.
just to put the manager thing to bed.
My role is to to manage staff including hire and fire, do all paperwork including bps claim, all stock paperwork, decide on strategy and implement that strategy with the cropping and stock. Order everything the farm needs to function and submit the invoices to farm office for payment by owners wife.
I am given total autonomy to dowith the farm as I wish BUT owner comes out and tries to get involved where he can(his right as the owner) owner must sign off new expenditure and will always have his say on any moneygoing out the door. I have a very close relationship with owner andhe is an incredibly generous man outside the farm. He simply can not get his head around spending. When I propose things that will save time and labour costs his response is always the same. “But that will just make things easier “ I try to explain that by being more efficient with staff time it frees up man hours to tackle fences and fix the broken things but he has always just made do. Once the seat broke on a tractorso he used a breeze block to sit on instead for the entire summer!

some do this and plead poverty as a habit - makes them look stupid but its how they were brought up wether it originates with parents from the 1930s ?
In short they dont value labour or time and consider borrowing money as reckless .
Its also an old fashioned way of reinforcing authority /status , could you get him to think what you need was his idea by leaving a trail of blindingly obvious clues ?

Cowmansam · Jul 12, 2021

tr250 said:
Yes definitely and then there’s hedge/ditch/yard maintenance. Straw/silage/muck. There is a huge amount to do on a farm! Does your one man band ever have a holiday or a day off? I know of plenty that say they do but conveniently forget about mum or Dad that milk every weekend check cows at calving keep things running for holidays ect all easily forgotten

To be fair I only know one man who is full on one man band 550 spring Calvers has mate off mine in for the heifer training first 10 days then goes all year by himself mans a bloody machine takes a month off when there all dry and my mate goes and moves the fences no idea how he does it or what he would do if taken sick or something

Cowmansam · Jul 12, 2021

Cowmansam said:
To be fair I only know one man who is full on one man band 550 spring Calvers has mate off mine in for the heifer training first 10 days then goes all year by himself mans a bloody machine takes a month off when there all dry and my mate goes and moves the fences no idea how he does it or what he would do if taken sick or something

He’s on a profit share so a big incentive for him to do it got no Mrs or kids

Tubbylew · Jul 12, 2021

He sounds like my old man, I wish it was as simple as changing jobs.

steveR · Jul 12, 2021

Cowmansam said:
To be fair I only know one man who is full on one man band 550 spring Calvers has mate off mine in for the heifer training first 10 days then goes all year by himself mans a bloody machine takes a month off when there all dry and my mate goes and moves the fences no idea how he does it or what he would do if taken sick or something

Early grave waiting... and/or divorce.

What to do 🤦‍♂️ So tight they squeak

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Up to 25%

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100% I’ve had enough of farming!

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