Sustainable farming incentive - handbook for 2023 has been published

Janet Hughes Defra

Janet Hughes Defra

Member
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Afternoon all,

Today we've published a handbook containing all the detailed information about the sustainable farming incentive offer for this year.

The handbook is here:
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/sfi-handbook-for-the-sfi-2023-offer

An overview blogpost is here: https://defrafarming.blog.gov.uk/2023/06/21/sfi-more-ways-to-enhance-your-income-productivity-and-the-environment/

The handbook sets out all the detailed actions, rules and requirements of the scheme, in a single handbook that you can download and print (because this is what many of you have asked us to do, rather than spreading the information across multiple pages on GOV.UK).

We have made some changes to the scheme in response to feedback from you and other farmers and through our pilot and early rollout of the scheme. In particular, we have made a much broader range of options available, made the scheme more flexible so you can pick the individual actions you want to do rather than having to do them in set combinations or percentages of land entered into the scheme.

Finally, I know I have not been present on the forum in the consistent, ongoing way many of you would like. I understand why that has been frustrating and annoying, and I am really sorry about that. I have found that am just not able to personally engage on every thread on an ongoing basis, I'm afraid. However I do really want to find a way of addressing your questions and hearing your feedback all the time, not just when we publish new information, so I am working with @Clive to put in place a better, ongoing, sustainable way of managing this so that you can ask questions of me and my team and give us feedback when they arise. We will let you know where we get to with that as soon as possible.

For this particular thread, I am planning to be online at least daily, for the next week, to answer your questions about the information we've published today. I have posted this as a question with voting, and if you could upvote questions that you particularly want me to address it would be helpful if you could vote for them so that I can prioritise my time and attention, and I will then do my best to work through as many of them as I possibly can. I hope this is helpful and look forward to your questions.

If you have questions about your specific farm situation, the best thing to do is contact the RPA contact centre and they will be able to point you in the right direction.

Thank you.
 
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Honestly this is where you get farmers feedback and where you should have laid out questions before any bps was removed , it seems the cart was sent out before the horse was even born you now have the whole budget and are asking us if we want to participate with tearms that are ludicrous to any business owner for little in return but a few quid and a "your doing your bit for the environment"? the forms are so complex that it might as well be written in binary code.
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Wood field

Wood field

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
South Pennines ol14
@Janet Hughes Defra
You probably didn’t see it on the old sfi/elms thread but I did say you would be more than welcome to visit our little farm up here in the Pennines.
Meadows still not mowed ( late July) oyster catchers , lapwings and curlews , sheep lots of sheep
Yet we feel like the enemy , oh yes trees and I built a pond
You are more than welcome to see a small hill farm and what we do
David & Sarah
 
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Tubbylew

Tubbylew

Member
Location
Herefordshire
gone up the hill said:
Rapidly turning out to be a mistake for people who have applied for CS in the last two years!

The problem with SFI is that there seems to be no capital grants for things like fencing/ concreting etc.
Click to expand...
Little point in capital grants if noone can afford to pay out in the first place, most folk used bps either directly or indirectly and claimed the money back from the rpa, not gonna happen now though. Don't think the banks will be very helpful either, not with the rpa's track record
 
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Henarar

Henarar

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Somerset
gone up the hill said:
So a couple of questions for @Janet Hughes Defra

1 : Is this the last year farmers can apply for CS?

2 : Can you have say 2 CS agreements and a SFI agreement on one holding number ? ( assuming you are not claiming options on the same land parcel in 1 or more schemes )

3 : Will there be capital grants for things like concreting/ fencing etc under SFI from 2024 onwards if there is not a 2024 CS scheme you can apply for?

4 : Can you for example have low input grassland in a SFI and CS agreement as long as they are on seperate land parcels but one holding number for both agreements??

5 : If you apply for herbal leys for example do they have to be planted before you apply or can you drill them after you have applied and know you are in the SFI scheme?

6 : When will the first SFI payments after the application window opens in August for people who apply in the first few weeks be made?

7 : Will there be low input cereal options in the new SFI scheme?
Click to expand...
that's more than a couple
 
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Bowland Bob

Bowland Bob

Member
Livestock Farmer
@Janet Hughes Defra, can I claim sda low input grassland on the same land in up2 in a HLS agreement, if not why not? UP2 seems more onerous than low input grassland and yet the payment is less.


Also, you mentioned that HLS can go into a CS agreement, If I was to do that could I add more land into that agreement, including supplements like sp8 for example?
 
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D

DrWazzock

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Lincolnshire
@Janet Hughes Defra
A few concerns regarding options for winter bird food.
1. Locally a certain area has been sown with winter bird food seed mix into a very dry seedbed for the third year in a row. This sown seed has attracted a very large number of rooks and pigeons. In order to deter these pests the farmer has had a gas gun or “banger” running on the acre plot for about 7 weeks now for 16 hours a day next to a residential area. As well as causing a considerable noise nuisance to people living adjacent it’s very noticeable that the gas gun has disrupted nesting birds through the spring nesting season, clearing them from that local area.
2. This is the third year of that option on that land and during the winter the birdseed has drawn a large population of rats to the area necessitating much increased use of rodenticide around farmsteads and dwellings which can be a danger to birds of prey and other predators.
3. The area of land concerned has become infested with thistles as limited or no chemical control is permitted or possible for the birdseed mix. The thistle seed blows onto adjacent pasture land requiring increased herbicide usage to keep them under control.
I don’t necessarily blame the landowner for his actions though I regard them as extremely inconsiderate. But I do blame your department for incentivising this inconsiderate and environmentally damaging intervention in rural areas which as far as I can see benefits nobody except the landowner.
Do you honestly think that this is in any way a good use of public money for public goods? Personally I think that as these options become more widespread and the associated nuisances I highlight above become more prevalent, you will face a more considerable backlash from the rural dwelling taxpayer. Many of your environmental options, if I was foolish enough to take them up, would make me embarrassed to be a farmer. Your birdseed options in particular are akin to the way folk in urban areas naively throw bird feed around in town centres exacerbating vermin problems there : no doubt those folk are well intentioned but oblivious to the negative consequences, a bit like DEFRA in fact!
 
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jondear

jondear

Member
Location
Devon
Velcro Gloves said:
Absolutely!!, my parents and I have spent 55 years building up some amazing species rich grassland, I thought when all this environmental talk started we would be laughing.
I think I'm going to contact the sun newspaper and explain the situation.
Click to expand...
It looks like if you have been farming traditionally and nature friendly not ploughing up every acre and storing carbon in fields that haven't been ploughed for decades managing and looking after wild flower meadows you get naff all !
 
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D

delilah

Member
Tubbylew said:
Little point in capital grants if noone can afford to pay out in the first place, most folk used bps either directly or indirectly and claimed the money back from the rpa, not gonna happen now though. Don't think the banks will be very helpful either, not with the rpa's track record
Click to expand...

We are currently waiting on a decision on a CS fencing/hedging application that was submitted 3 months ago. We are also waiting on payment of a farming in protected landscapes claim that went in 4 months ago. We need that money from the latter before we dare instruct a contractor on the former. I don't think @Janet Hughes Defra and colleagues have a scooby about how hand to mouth many businesses are.

If the RPA are currently taking months to process the simplest of applications, how on earth are they going to cope with the complexity of so many of these SFI options ?
 
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J 1177

J 1177

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Durham, UK
delilah said:
We are currently waiting on a decision on a CS fencing/hedging application that was submitted 3 months ago. We are also waiting on payment of a farming in protected landscapes claim that went in 4 months ago. We need that money from the latter before we dare instruct a contractor on the former. I don't think @Janet Hughes Defra and colleagues have a scooby about how hand to mouth many businesses are.

If the RPA are currently taking months to process the simplest of applications, how on earth are they going to cope with the complexity of so many of these SFI options ?
Click to expand...
They dont have a clue how tight it is out there. How on earth can i finance doing these options on an income forgone basis when im 14k down on income, income from grain sales is going to be massively down from last year. Where am i getting the money from to do these options, ring the bank and ask for an od increase? (at a higher rate as the bank of england in its wisdom keeps slapping the rate up). In the hope the rpa pays me in 3 months time and it barely covers the cost of implementing these actions let alone the interest on the money borrowed.
Defra and the Rpa are on a different planet.
 
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D

DrWazzock

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Lincolnshire
delilah said:
We are currently waiting on a decision on a CS fencing/hedging application that was submitted 3 months ago. We are also waiting on payment of a farming in protected landscapes claim that went in 4 months ago. We need that money from the latter before we dare instruct a contractor on the former. I don't think @Janet Hughes Defra and colleagues have a scooby about how hand to mouth many businesses are.

If the RPA are currently taking months to process the simplest of applications, how on earth are they going to cope with the complexity of so many of these SFI options ?
Click to expand...
The RPA simply won’t cope. If the uptake of SFI is significant then it will increase their workload maybe tenfold unless they are going to wave the whole thing through with no checks. I’ve been hung out to dry for several £k before by the RPA. I’ve no intention of repeating the experience.
 
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L

livestock 1

Member
DrWazzock said:
The RPA simply won’t cope. If the uptake of SFI is significant then it will increase their workload maybe tenfold unless they are going to wave the whole thing through with no checks. I’ve been hung out to dry for several £k before by the RPA. I’ve no intention of repeating the experience.
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This was something we discussed at the last meeting I had with the agents. The money pot is supposed to be the same but it’s possibly lost in administration of the scheme due to it being over complicated so the actual amount of money that reaches us farmers is significantly reduced and spent on staff
 
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N

Northern territory

Member
Livestock Farmer
livestock 1 said:
This was something we discussed at the last meeting I had with the agents. The money pot is supposed to be the same but it’s possibly lost in administration of the scheme due to it being over complicated so the actual amount of money that reaches us farmers is significantly reduced and spent on staff
Click to expand...
I think it is a very valid point and area for concern
 
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4

4course

Member
Location
north yorks
Other than the non insecticide route for the cereals acerage I cannot get any of the payments to add up to a worthwhile return of more than cost of doing them, even non insecticide is a gamble.We are a rented mixed, cereals, temp grass, pp .break crop either pulses or osr, with a few farm livestock type farm and have other streams of diversified enterprises which rely on the farm to function . Still cant see us taking sfi up even though over the years we have improved our soils planted trees maintained hedges and produced so called public goods ( non food)for FREE for the nation as well as producing food which is now it seems not deemed to be a public good .I now think food production will become a lesser priority in our business.
 
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Jackov Altraids

Jackov Altraids

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Devon
Exmoor Farm said:
All DEFRA have achieved, (taking years to do it), is to copy the most common stewardship options into SFI meaning there is almost nothing new.

The options are pretty much identical and therefore we can't stack SFI and stewardship because (in their words) 'we'd be paid twice for the same action'.

We used to have BPS with stewardship, now we have SFI or stewardship.

Why can't Defra design a scheme where you can actually stack SFI (base payments) with CSS (advanced payments) - it has always been the obvious solution.

Anything else will be a futile attempt to re-invent the wheel and the resultant schemes will fail due to Defra's own double funding rules.
Click to expand...

If, as everyone seems to agree, CS is working. Why not leave it alone and just review and increase payments with inflation.
SFI should have been something completely different. Paying a premium for farming sustainably.
 
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H

Hindsight

Member
Location
Lincolnshire
Jackov Altraids said:
If, as everyone seems to agree, CS is working. Why not leave it alone and just review and increase payments with inflation.
SFI should have been something completely different. Paying a premium for farming sustainably.
Click to expand...

Is not a problem with CS that tenants on FBTs cannot get the 5 year period to fit within the usual 3 year FBT plus it requires landlords consent and we find many landlords are unhelpful in that as agents hate locking in for five years. SFI being 3 years ties in with average FBT period and there is more flexibility for tenant to leave and adjust. Of course this is a result of the Tories farm tenancy changes from the 90s leading to insecurity of tenure for an industry that is based on long term actions. Hey ho.
 
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D

delilah

Member
The National Audit Office could see where this was headed two years ago. The admin costings are based on blind faith.

Ensuring cost-effective delivery
19 Defra has set a target to reduce administrative costs compared with existing agri-environment schemes but has not yet developed its approach to achieving these. Defra has set a cap for administrative costs at 10% of scheme payments, compared with up to 18% under current agri-environment schemes. It based this target on a desired level of savings on current scheme costs, rather than a detailed understanding of the cost drivers in existing and future schemes. Defra expects to achieve its target through a combination of simpler scheme rules, faster and more automated processing of applications, and remote and automated compliance and enforcement. Defra is currently testing the achievability of its 10% cap as part of a review of cost baselines and cost drivers, which it had planned to complete in July 2021. While some elements have been finished, the review is not yet complete owing to lack of resources and the complexity of establishing baselines. Defra is aware that reducing administrative costs may have an impact on other parts of the scheme such as potentially higher levels of fraud and error but has not yet developed an approach to determining where the balance should be (paragraphs 3.2 to 3.4).
 

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Jackov Altraids

Jackov Altraids

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
Devon
Hindsight said:
Is not a problem with CS that tenants on FBTs cannot get the 5 year period to fit within the usual 3 year FBT plus it requires landlords consent and we find many landlords are unhelpful in that as agents hate locking in for five years. SFI being 3 years ties in with average FBT period and there is more flexibility for tenant to leave and adjust. Of course this is a result of the Tories farm tenancy changes from the 90s leading to insecurity of tenure for an industry that is based on long term actions. Hey ho.
Click to expand...

So a review should conclude a 3 year option for CS is made available for tenanted farmers.
I don't see a reason for SFI to copy the CS.

SFI is designed to achieve the 25YEP environmental goals;

Our environmental goals​

  • Goal 1: Thriving plants and wildlife
  • Goal 2: Clean air
  • Goal 3: Clean and plentiful water
  • Goal 4: Managing exposure to chemicals and pesticides
  • Goal 5: Maximise our resources, minimise our waste
  • Goal 6: Using resources from nature sustainably
  • Goal 7: Mitigating and adapting to climate change
  • Goal 8: Reduced risk of harm from environmental hazards
  • Goal 9: Enhancing biosecurity
  • Goal 10: Enhanced beauty, heritage, and engagement with the natural environment
It is not designed to make farming more sustainable.
Unfortunately that means it will fail on both counts.
It may have been different if they had taken into account those environmental goals beyond our shores.
 
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CiderJan

CiderJan

Member
Location
Sunny Cornwall
Question for @Janet Hughes Defra

SFI SAM3 Herbal Ley and CS GS4 rotations on same farm

I'm trying to get my head around the differences and how it will work with different schemes in place on the farm at the same time. It's the sort of information I need to know now so I can complete my midtier application in August.

The SAM3 has a better spec and is not as strict as the GS4. Herbal leys established under GS4 need to contain a certain % of herbs/legumes but SAM3 only says a mix. As the GS4 herbal leys age and lose species, can I rotate those parcels to being SAM3 where they still 100% qualify?

How does a midtier to SFI rotation work in practice? Will the computer cope or throw an issue about double payments when I want to switch from GS4 to SAM3 or vice versa? With midtier having a strict 1st January start but SFI starting midyear, how will this work for when I want to rotate between schemes?


Alternatively, will it be possible to move GS4 out from current midtier agreements and into SFI as SAM3?
 
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E

Exmoor Farm

Member
Livestock Farmer
Jackov Altraids said:
If, as everyone seems to agree, CS is working. Why not leave it alone and just review and increase payments with inflation.
SFI should have been something completely different. Paying a premium for farming sustainably.
Click to expand...
Exactly, SFI could have been a base payment per ha for complying with cross compliance and some more items Defra want like:

- Soil testing & soil management plans
- Nutrient Plans
- IPM plans
- Animal Health and Welfare Plans
- EID tags and Bvd testing (controversial I know)

Easily achievable for all, would support food production and would not overly disadvantage English farmers compared to our neighbours.

The rate would not be as high as BPS - maybe 50% with the remaining 50% topping up stewardship rates and the various grants.

Current SFI actions like No Use of Insecticide and Minimum Tillage could then be shifted into Countryside Stewardship - keeping people like Clive happy.

It would be simple, deliverable and achieve everything their current schemes are trying to.

No more re-inventing the wheel, no more double funding conflicts, no more policy confusion, no more of the budget wasted on DEFRA admin.
 
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D

delilah

Member
CiderJan said:
Question for @Janet Hughes Defra

SFI SAM3 Herbal Ley and CS GS4 rotations on same farm

I'm trying to get my head around the differences and how it will work with different schemes in place on the farm at the same time. It's the sort of information I need to know now so I can complete my midtier application in August.

The SAM3 has a better spec and is not as strict as the GS4. Herbal leys established under GS4 need to contain a certain % of herbs/legumes but SAM3 only says a mix. As the GS4 herbal leys age and lose species, can I rotate those parcels to being SAM3 where they still 100% qualify?

How does a midtier to SFI rotation work in practice? Will the computer cope or throw an issue about double payments when I want to switch from GS4 to SAM3 or vice versa? With midtier having a strict 1st January start but SFI starting midyear, how will this work for when I want to rotate between schemes?


Alternatively, will it be possible to move GS4 out from current midtier agreements and into SFI as SAM3?
Click to expand...

You have just demonstrated why the whole thing is going to descend into utter chaos.
 
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SFI - What % were you taking out of production?

  • 0 %

    Votes: 112 38.2%

  • Up to 25%

    Votes: 112 38.2%

  • 25-50%

    Votes: 42 14.3%

  • 50-75%

    Votes: 6 2.0%

  • 75-100%

    Votes: 4 1.4%

  • 100% I’ve had enough of farming!

    Votes: 17 5.8%
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