BPS Deduction Due to Inspection but no Report.

DrWazzock

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Lincolnshire
Who else has had a big deduction, about 20% in our case due to an inspection for which we have no information or idea of the findings?

I emailed the RPA asking for a report of the inspection and the reasons for the deductions and got the standard email back saying they would respond in due course but nothing has been forthcoming for a fortnight now. Telephone enquiries draw a similar blank. They can find nothing to explain why the "inspection" led to a big deduction. What is the point of a multimillion pound IT system that cannot even provide the most basic information or of the thousands of staff employed there. All they seem able to do is thank me for my call, and screw up anything that is initially straightforward.

I vaguely recall an inspector walking some fields last May but he indicated at the time that nothing was amiss but we had nothing in writing. Most of that land has been ploughed now, so providing evidence will be difficult, but it could have been addressed at the time if there were discrepancies.

I am absolutely fed up of this sort of treatment. We seem to be treated with contempt. To be effectively fined several thousand pounds without any reason whatsoever seems completely wrong.

Whether subsidies are right or wrong and whether they will continue after Brexit is a different matter, but while the present system is in place I do wish it would be implemented fairly.

I am getting to the point where I will soon do as I like entirely and tell them to keep their ransom money. No more stupid three crop rule, no more 2m from centre of hedges. I can hardly bring myself to begin this coming years application when I don't even know what was wrong with last year's.

It's the same number of entitlements we have had for years. We have farmed the same area of land for years and we seemed to pass the greening checks at online application.

It's beyond stupidity.
 

DrWazzock

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Lincolnshire
The other thing that annoys me is where we temporarily divide fields, despite the area payment being the same all over the farm and the sum total being the same every year, they will make an issue if the field split is wrong by a few square metres, even though the net difference is zero loss or gain overall.

That's the sort of pedantic jobsworths we are dealing with.

Has any RPA employee ever had a big chunk of their salary deducted with no reason given whatsoever?

I bet they haven't.
 

Flat 10

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Fen Edge
Another well written post Dr. Apparently I have claimed for 30ha's of my neighbours. Funnily enough l haven't. I will not be paid for the 11ha they have mistakenly amalgamated with his and l assume l will be fined the same amount. Still owed money from last year. Not happy.
 

Punch

Member
Location
Warwickshire
We still haven't been paid. Inspected in April/May and no report. Looking online and talking to "helpline" is useless. We also have not recieved any inspection reports:mad:
 
Still waiting for more than a third of my 2015 payment. Despite at least a dozen requests they will not detail why they haven't paid and the reasons they have stolen entitlements from me.
 

Flat 10

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Fen Edge
Still waiting for more than a third of my 2015 payment. Despite at least a dozen requests they will not detail why they haven't paid and the reasons they have stolen entitlements from me.
I know what they did on my 2015 claim. Missed a field off. They then fined me the same amount for overclaiming. Simple. Will they do anything about it? Will they heck. Lazy incompetent so and so's.
 

Vernon

Member
Location
Wiltshire
I know what they did on my 2015 claim. Missed a field off. They then fined me the same amount for overclaiming. Simple. Will they do anything about it? Will they heck. Lazy incompetent so and so's.
We had exactly the same in 2015. Still not resolved. They did however look into it and payed us a further £31. We're still £1500 light for that year.
 

Flat 10

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Fen Edge
We had exactly the same in 2015. Still not resolved. They did however look into it and payed us a further £31. We're still £1500 light for that year.
Mine is a bit more than that. Only had 66% or so of this years. Is yours ok this time? The £31 was maybe that odd top up we all had. I got about that much.
 

Hindsight

Member
Location
Lincolnshire
Mine is a bit more than that. Only had 66% or so of this years. Is yours ok this time? The £31 was maybe that odd top up we all had. I got about that much.


By the 'odd top up' I presume you refer to the reimbursement of 2015 Financial Discipline Mechanism (FMD) money that seems to have been paid in September 2016. Just so everyone is aware of what it was so do check against the remittance received at the time.
 

Flat 10

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Fen Edge
By the 'odd top up' I presume you refer to the reimbursement of 2015 Financial Discipline Mechanism (FMD) money that seems to have been paid in September 2016. Just so everyone is aware of what it was so do check against the remittance received at the time.
Yes. 2 parts of F all, but better than a kick of the arse.
 

Hindsight

Member
Location
Lincolnshire
Yes. 2 parts of F all, but better than a kick of the arse.

Well yes, but it was deducted from the original payment or rather should I say held back as a fund by EU for use if any disasters in EU. But I am involved in several applications where the 2015 payment is incorrect and also some 2016 payments and am in correspondence with RPA and thought it important posters on this thread could identify the background to this particular payment. Best of luck with yours. It is like walking in treacle with our friends at RPA.
 

DrWazzock

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Lincolnshire
Received statement and they say our EFA is non compliant on 33 ha. But no clue as to what way it is non compliant. This is surprising, because we only used simple permanant features like hedgerows and water course buffer strips to gain our greening area and we applied online. The online form calculated that we had enough greening features (length of hedge and watercourse buffers) to more than meet our required greening area, exactly the same as it did last year for which we received full payment.

Another email sent to RPA after hearing nothing but an automated acknowledgement from the one sent 5 weeks ago. Email copied to MP to keep him updated of the situation.
 

Fuzzy

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Bedfordshire
Received statement and they say our EFA is non compliant on 33 ha. But no clue as to what way it is non compliant. This is surprising, because we only used simple permanant features like hedgerows and water course buffer strips to gain our greening area and we applied online. The online form calculated that we had enough greening features (length of hedge and watercourse buffers) to more than meet our required greening area, exactly the same as it did last year for which we received full payment.

Another email sent to RPA after hearing nothing but an automated acknowledgement from the one sent 5 weeks ago. Email copied to MP to keep him updated of the situation.
I had an issue like you, my EFA was far greater than required, when i originally filled in the forms everything was OK and then in december some remapping occurred and my application switched to say i did not comply with the EFA requirement (even though i still had nearly twice what was required for greening).....it still says so today, but i have been paid in full !!!!!!
 

DrWazzock

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Lincolnshire
I had an issue like you, my EFA was far greater than required, when i originally filled in the forms everything was OK and then in december some remapping occurred and my application switched to say i did not comply with the EFA requirement (even though i still had nearly twice what was required for greening).....it still says so today, but i have been paid in full !!!!!!

They work in mysterious ways, that's for sure. It strikes me that they are 100% reliant on a dodgy IT system and there is no longer much human involvement or anybody left there who can spot when it's gone wrong or has the power to override the computer and make an executive decision. When you ring up, everybody is absolutely clueless. They can only tell you what their screen shows them which is usually nothing.

It doesn't bode well if more and more of the payments are going to be for environmental goods rather than area based. I think it's just too complicated for them to administer on a cost effective basis.
 

Hindsight

Member
Location
Lincolnshire
I have looked at one claim statement where there has been a deduction for crop diversification non compliant yet the calculator on the submitted form was OK. Checked the Land Use data on the Business Summary and found a land parcel has been remapped by RPA without our knowledge and the crop code changed from AC67 to AC66 thus violating the 75% maximum for a single crop. Emailed RPA and will start phoning shortly.
They work in mysterious ways, that's for sure. It strikes me that they are 100% reliant on a dodgy IT system and there is no longer much human involvement or anybody left there who can spot when it's gone wrong or has the power to override the computer and make an executive decision. When you ring up, everybody is absolutely clueless. They can only tell you what their screen shows them which is usually nothing.

It doesn't bode well if more and more of the payments are going to be for environmental goods rather than area based. I think it's just too complicated for them to administer on a cost effective basis.


Quite a succinct overview of the situation.
 

franklin

New Member
Well played RPA - large deduction for random reasons. Last few days got email saying "why not apply for 2017" - yesterday got breakdown of last years (wrong) payment. Have deducted an entitlement transfer twice; randomly removed one (now landlocked) field; and altered a field boundary as requested but removed 5ha. Despite many of these issues being identified and queried a long while ago, we are now paying an agent to sort it all out in time for this years' claim. We now, finally, have the paperwork from them and almost exactly 10 weeks to sort out problems of their making dating back two claim years.

Having filled in a working-family tax credit form, I am fully aware that they have an interest in designing systems so complicated that folk either give up, or are heavily penalised. I suggest that we are the only EU country to work on the "farmers are surely lying" point-of-view.
 

Timbo

Member
Location
Gods County
Well played RPA - large deduction for random reasons. Last few days got email saying "why not apply for 2017" - yesterday got breakdown of last years (wrong) payment. Have deducted an entitlement transfer twice; randomly removed one (now landlocked) field; and altered a field boundary as requested but removed 5ha. Despite many of these issues being identified and queried a long while ago, we are now paying an agent to sort it all out in time for this years' claim. We now, finally, have the paperwork from them and almost exactly 10 weeks to sort out problems of their making dating back two claim years.

Having filled in a working-family tax credit form, I am fully aware that they have an interest in designing systems so complicated that folk either give up, or are heavily penalised. I suggest that we are the only EU country to work on the "farmers are surely lying" point-of-view.


Am in almost exactly the same boat!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

DrWazzock

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Lincolnshire
Still no reply from RPA two months after first asking for clarification of what they found in the inspection, despite a phone call and two emails.

The only clue as to what they think I did wrong is "EFA non compliant on 33 ha" printed on the statement. 33 ha doesn't correspond to any particular field size we have or sum of field sizes so it's a complete mystery.

I can't find anything that's non compliant and it all self checked on the online application.

Come on RPA. Give us a another clue.
 

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