Sustainable Farming Incentive is open for applications June 2022

National Audit Office report.

https://www.nao.org.uk/report/the-environmental-land-management-scheme/

delilah said:

Attached the Public Accounts Committee report on ELMS. They pretty well nail the failings and set out what Defra needs to do to remedy things. Appendix includes submissions from TFF members.

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DEFRA view seems to be that they know better than the PAC... and EFRA Committees??

delilah said:

Attached the Public Accounts Committee report on ELMS. They pretty well nail the failings and set out what Defra needs to do to remedy things. Appendix includes submissions from TFF members.

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Farmers seem to be agreeing with the public accounts committe. Defra seems to carry on regardless.

Defra have listened, the scrapping of LR is testament to that. It is just a damned shame that, for whatever reason, @Janet Hughes Defra hasn't had the courage to pause on the introduction of the SFI until they had made the amendments that they know full well need to be made.

The only hope now is that they leave the payment rates for the current standards where they are, to ensure take up is low, and introduce new standards based on PP that offer an attractive rate. Time will tell.

Seemingly totally unaccountable to anyone, either that or just pig ignorant. This whole thread is a pc exercise akin to rearranging deckchairs on the Titanic.

delilah said:

Attached the Public Accounts Committee report on ELMS. They pretty well nail the failings and set out what Defra needs to do to remedy things. Appendix includes submissions from TFF members.

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Thanks Delilah... time for us all to feed this info in again with lessons learnt since the last time? Finally Farmers Weekly have stopped being just a DEFRA mouthpiece this week!!

Humble Village Farmer said:

I'll tell you what's flawed, the UK farming industry business model.

If we can't run a business without subsidies, why should the tax payer fork out to keep us in range rovers and shiny tractors we can't afford?

The government may be partly to blame by allowing the various corporations to treat farmers like they do, but ultimately it's our businesses, our farms and our responsibility.

Blaming a new environmental scheme for all our problems is no solution. Neither is bemoaning our exit from the cap. All that did was allow the big corporations to extract a higher spend from farmers and buy cheaper commodities.

If anything we should blame ourselves for including the bps in the farm account and kidding ourselves that we have a business.

Maybe we could do with a bit of a leg up from government, but it would be better in the form of fairer trading conditions, the ending of restrictive practice from the likes of the dead tractor and a fairer share of the retail value.

Edit: by the way, I agree the payments aren't high enough to attract farmers, but it's quite simple really, if you don't like it don't join the scheme.

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Problem as I see it is that sfi options are not applicable or suitable for all. I have read previous posts on how simple it is to apply but on a main grassland based unit with some css it really is unworkable. How is that fair? If the underlying aim is to remove subsidies then defra should have the balls to just do it. But if they want a viable rural economy capable of feeding at least a proportion of the population then they will have to offer some kind of protection from food produced in a manner that would be illegal here.

Huno said:

Hurray!! Please can someone resend the link for EFRA inquirys .. Farmers weekly page 6 today... Neil Hudson MP for Penrith wants evidence on ELM which includes SFI... all of us now have a chance to give our views on this Nonsense called SFI and explain that they listen but they do not react with common sense solutions!!!

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Czn you take a picture and post it please.
I dont get FW

ajcc said:

Seemingly totally unaccountable to anyone, either that or just pig ignorant. This whole thread is a pc exercise akin to rearranging deckchairs on the Titanic.

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Glad i am a Navigator by trade then.. starboard 35 !!full astern!! Iceberg dead ahead!!

Vader said:

Czn you take a picture and post it please.
I dont get FW

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Still combining!! Saw it at lunchtime Any livestock boys can you send Vader a photo please?

Did anyone else notice how short and defensive Janet was in her few replys this week..? The train crash is still avoidable

delilah said:

Attached the Public Accounts Committee report on ELMS. They pretty well nail the failings and set out what Defra needs to do to remedy things. Appendix includes submissions from TFF members.

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Well done sir.

Looking for help now to develop sfi for next year roll out...

Huno said:

Still combining!! Saw it at lunchtime Any livestock boys can you send Vader a photo please?

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Here you go.

delilah said:

Defra have listened, the scrapping of LR is testament to that. It is just a damned shame that, for whatever reason, @Janet Hughes Defra hasn't had the courage to pause on the introduction of the SFI until they had made the amendments that they know full well need to be made.

The only hope now is that they leave the payment rates for the current standards where they are, to ensure take up is low, and introduce new standards based on PP that offer an attractive rate. Time will tell.

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I think that question needs to be addressed to David Kennedy and/or the Politicians.

I wonder when the first independent assessment of the SFI takeup will be made. And even more... what is the outcome going to be?

G

DaveGrohl said:

Here you go.

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Good. EFRA taking another long, hard look at ELMS et al.

The thing I find quite insulting is they will spaff thousands on consultant and land agents and vets and anyone else who appear to have qualifications as it’s a public good however the farmer who does it all is worth about £3.20 an hour.
Now I have more qualifications on paper than most, I have just enrolled in Basis for this winter for the best part of another 3k yet when I use all of these in a farm context Defra view them as totally worthless, put them in my day job context and they are worth £xx0 an hour.
I bet getting someone to mow the law round the defra offices gets more than they want to pay us to do SFI.

Wombat said:

The thing I find quite insulting is they will spaff thousands on consultant and land agents and vets and anyone else who appear to have qualifications as it’s a public good however the farmer who does it all is worth about £3.20 an hour.
Now I have more qualifications on paper than most, I have just enrolled in Basis for this winter for the best part of another 3k yet when I use all of these in a farm context Defra view them as totally worthless, put them in my day job context and they are worth £xx0 an hour.
I bet getting someone to mow the law round the defra offices gets more than they want to pay us to do SFI.

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I think we all feel insulted. There is some anger brewing in uk ag. Not 20 month ago we were one of the key workers keeping the nation going. Now well we aint worth a shite. The working man or woman in this country is not valued!!!!

Humble Village Farmer said:

I'll tell you what's flawed, the UK farming industry business model.

If we can't run a business without subsidies, why should the tax payer fork out to keep us in range rovers and shiny tractors we can't afford?

The government may be partly to blame by allowing the various corporations to treat farmers like they do, but ultimately it's our businesses, our farms and our responsibility.

Blaming a new environmental scheme for all our problems is no solution. Neither is bemoaning our exit from the cap. All that did was allow the big corporations to extract a higher spend from farmers and buy cheaper commodities.

If anything we should blame ourselves for including the bps in the farm account and kidding ourselves that we have a business.

Maybe we could do with a bit of a leg up from government, but it would be better in the form of fairer trading conditions, the ending of restrictive practice from the likes of the dead tractor and a fairer share of the retail value.

Edit: by the way, I agree the payments aren't high enough to attract farmers, but it's quite simple really, if you don't like it don't join the scheme.

Click to expand...

While I agree any business model based on government funding is shaky, it’s happening all over, banks, steel works railways, the entire civil servants setup, buses,, then there are millions sat at home, getting money to support them, from rent, free NHS, free dentist, free food, etc etc. sure some of those are not subsidy but any system where the government pay the money makes it government controlled. And bailouts to companies take place all the time in times of stress.

The world has a system to create cheap food part of that system is government support in one form or another. The reality is we work in a broken system, where we race to the bottom, where systems are put in place to under pay workers and gain control of farming via the likes of BPS.
The worry is the goal posts can move without warning and the farming system is a fragile thing it will not stand to many shake ups and with the new systems only offering 3 year deals, and unknown restructures to come things may well break down.
The problem is not farming it’s farmings world wide relationship to our markets.
We let others control it that’s our problem.

I understand it’s not a simple thing world trade is very complex, but letting retail buy cheap imports, while often products of higher standards produced in the uk are having their prices set by these imports is wrong.
They argue it’s consumer choice they buy on price, while I am sure that’s true, at what cost to our industry

My wife works for Royal Mail, the new pay deal basically makes her a number, they want maximum flexabilty to maximise RM profits at the expense of working conditions, it’s only one step up from a zero hour contract type deal.
It’s a race to the bottom, one of the conditions was to take away advantages older staff members have because it’s unfair to newer ones, so instead of undoing what they did to create that system they want to take it from all members .they did this by creating new contracts, new workers have to sign on stating to work for RM. That removes old work agreement older Royal Mail staff enjoyed some of them earned from long service with the company.

this seems to be the way of things, it’s not right, unions and solidarity are the only ways to fight it.