Backwards calves…the bull?

serf · Apr 26, 2024

Henarar said:
we have never had to put a cheese wire near any of our British blue calves, cross or pure
what was the cow crossed with ?

Hols/ Friesian

Henarar · Apr 26, 2024

serf said:
Hols/ Friesian

Oh I see, must be that

muleman · Apr 26, 2024

I

livestock 1 said:
Yes there’s that and the unborn calf feels the cold so feeds more to keep warm.

I'd have thought the cows temperature would remain the same whatever the weather

serf · Apr 26, 2024

Henarar said:
we have never had to put a cheese wire near any of our British blue calves, cross or pure
what was the cow crossed with ?

It doesn't personally bother me what Bulls ppl want to use , but when you see that once from certain breeds life's to short ...

There enough hassle what ever breed you choose but certain sights helps draw the short list down ...

Aspiring Peasants · Apr 26, 2024

muleman said:
It's just one of those things, his luck will change and never see another backwards.
His vet has told him it's not the bulls fault, be a real shame to kill a good bull.
To get small easy delivered calves you need the cows as fit and shiny as possible, the lean pulled down cows seem to produce big calves, put everything into the calf, better the cow looking after itself a bit and not put it into the calf

Just to add to that, I think the cow needs to be in good condition right through, if it’s allowed to lose weight it eats more prior to calving and it goes on to the calf, same with sheep.

muleman · Apr 26, 2024

muleman said:
I

I'd have thought the cows temperature would remain the same whatever the weather

But I see what you mean, maybe has to eat more to keep temp up

Henarar · Apr 26, 2024

serf said:
It doesn't personally bother me what Bulls ppl want to use , but when you see that once from certain breeds life's to short ...

There enough hassle what ever breed you choose but certain sights helps draw the short list down ...

I have seen it once, limmy, dead cow and calf, big vet bill, not mine thank goodness.
Did not put me off limmy's
Good and bad in all breeds

Optimus · Apr 26, 2024

muleman said:
It's just one of those things, his luck will change and never see another backwards.
His vet has told him it's not the bulls fault, be a real shame to kill a good bull.
To get small easy delivered calves you need the cows as fit and shiny as possible, the lean pulled down cows seem to produce big calves, put everything into the calf, better the cow looking after itself a bit and not put it into the calf

There's probably something in that.my calves are bigger this time but cow not as fit

serf · Apr 26, 2024

Henarar said:
I have seen it once, limmy, dead cow and calf, big vet bill, not mine thank goodness.
Did not put me off limmy's
Good and bad in all breeds

There was a catalogue of events goings off with said herdnotjust the one , bit I only witnessed the one event ,

They jacked the sucklers in afterwards anyhow so won't have the problem again ...

crofteress · Apr 26, 2024

Aspiring Peasants said:
to add to that, I think the cow needs to be in good condition right through, if it’s allowed to lose weight it eats more prior to calving and it goes on to the calf, same with sheep.

This 100%. My friend calves over 100 of the very best blue/lim no dairy blood and keeping them on a level plain of nutrition is how he calves them with succes. I do the same with mine and cows always look the same never lose any condition over the year

Aspiring Peasants · Apr 26, 2024

crofteress said:
This 100%. My friend calves over 100 of the very best blue/lim no dairy blood and keeping them on a level plain of nutrition is how he calves them with succes. I do the same with mine and cows always look the same never lose any condition over the year

Opposite of what the advisers tell us though

crofteress · Apr 26, 2024

Aspiring Peasants said:
Opposite of what the advisers tell us though

I know. I went to one of these farm advisory days and some of the cows in Nov were in very poor condition. I asked how would they manage to put on any condition now with them going into spring calving without it going into the calve. When I get called to assist calving locally its always hard dry cows with huge calves, same story

puppet · Apr 26, 2024

livestock 1 said:
Yes there’s that and the unborn calf feels the cold so feeds more to keep warm.

Did your vet agree with that theory?
The temperature inside a cow will not vary as it is a 700kg well insulated water bath. If the core temp drops then the cow will soon be dead.
The calf cannot decide how much it feeds. That is down to how well the placenta is working and supplying nutrients.
I can't find any research on cows but in women around 30% are breech at 7 months but only 3% at term. If cows were similar then your big calf is less likely to have room to turn and the bull will be a factor in that as well as over-feeding.
However if 1000 people toss a coin 100 times the first 5 could all be heads for someone.

Sharpy · Apr 26, 2024

serf said:
What I would think too , seen vet with cheese wire cutting blue calf out of blue x cow once on a neighbours place and put me off any blue influence for lifetime ,
They had trouble with varying ° s
of " influence" in cows

I was told years ago that the Belgian blue was fine on a finer boned cow like an Angus but a disaster on bigger boned stuff like simmental. He had both.

livestock 1 · Apr 26, 2024

puppet said:
Did your vet agree with that theory?
The temperature inside a cow will not vary as it is a 700kg well insulated water bath. If the core temp drops then the cow will soon be dead.
The calf cannot decide how much it feeds. That is down to how well the placenta is working and supplying nutrients.
I can't find any research on cows but in women around 30% are breech at 7 months but only 3% at term. If cows were similar then your big calf is less likely to have room to turn and the bull will be a factor in that as well as over-feeding.
However if 1000 people toss a coin 100 times the first 5 could all be heads for someone.

Yes the vet told me it was very common in cold climates. We had some regular severe frosts before hand in the second half of pregnancy. The bulls are the same bulls as we’ve used before and after successfully.
Read everything you’ve said it’s all wrong

livestock 1 · Apr 26, 2024

muleman said:
I

I'd have thought the cows temperature would remain the same whatever the weather

Those big sheds aren’t very warm places in hard frosts. It’s not a long distance from an unborn calf to -10 or whatever it was that year. I think they will feel the cold.

livestock 1 · Apr 26, 2024

livestock 1 · Apr 26, 2024

Someone else has experienced it
Those calves I had were big too big to come out the normal way

livestock 1 · Apr 26, 2024

puppet said:
Did your vet agree with that theory?
The temperature inside a cow will not vary as it is a 700kg well insulated water bath. If the core temp drops then the cow will soon be dead.
The calf cannot decide how much it feeds. That is down to how well the placenta is working and supplying nutrients.
I can't find any research on cows but in women around 30% are breech at 7 months but only 3% at term. If cows were similar then your big calf is less likely to have room to turn and the bull will be a factor in that as well as over-feeding.
However if 1000 people toss a coin 100 times the first 5 could all be heads for someone.

My theory is the calf is cold draws more off the cow to maintain body heat and ends up too big

Stewartry hill · Apr 26, 2024

livestock 1 said:
My theory is the calf is cold draws more off the cow to maintain body heat and ends up too big

If the cow is cold it will eat more therefore feed the unborn calf better

Backwards calves…the bull?

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

0 %

Up to 25%

25-50%

50-75%

75-100%

100% I’ve had enough of farming!

Share this page