Straw for muck or chopping

[Knockie]

At present we are doing quite a large acreage of straw for muck, I'm starting to question if it worth it given the extra wheelings etc involved with baling straw and spreading muck. Not a problem when dry but when it's wet it's a big problem. We are working harvest CTF and the combine and chaser hardly mark the ground, it's the straw removal and muck spreading that do the damage. Just wondering if I might be better just chopping the lot and using compost as and when conditions allow. Another option would be gear up straw removal machines with LGP tyres etc.
Another thing I'm starting to find is that with the CULTAN system, quantity of straw/ac are lower resulting in less acres/year getting muck or more acres of straw required for the same acres of muck, leading to long term depletion of OM as muck would only be applied 1 year in 6, chopping would mean something going back every year.
Cheers.
SD.

 

[SilliamWhale]

I can understand your thinking.

I can sell straw for reasonable money and also pick up muck for free and whilst I'm happy with it I can't see how giving away straw would benefit me because the cost of spreading adds up esp with roading. Spreading muck and baling straw isn't for free (try totting the cost of that up and divide it by the grain price because you may find it doesn't yield as much as you think) and whilst you may benefit from the muck it may not be enough in terms of yield of grain.


That said I don't often find the straw or muck does that much damage either. In a very wet year (which maybe you are having now?) the straw is more of a pain though.

 

[Colin]

How are the yields with the Cultan? Less straw but more grain, or more grain for less N?
I also think that with muck you are getting more than om etc, there must be trace elements there that we don't routinely apply. I have been using chicken litter for a while and there is more to it than just NPK. Unfortunately they are now sending it all for incineration!

 

[jack6480]

Get some of that man sh*t and chop the straw

 

[SF1]

I have had the problems with straw for muck,this year i have spread all my muck onto wosr stubbles. This co insides with a one in four year cultivation (hitting the reset button).Got the contractor well educated in useing the trams and traffic lanes for spreading and has worked well.Different story with the straw removal just wish we had a contractor around here with a bale chaser,but tend to remove straw on land destined for spring cropping which will be loosened and a cover crop planted.
This year is proberly the last year we will have chicken litter due to the rise in the AD plants in the area.
So im just left with the FYM to deal with,but its getting to the stage were i'm loathing to remove the straw.

 

[Goldilocks]

At present we are doing quite a large acreage of straw for muck, I'm starting to question if it worth it given the extra wheelings etc involved with baling straw and spreading muck. Not a problem when dry but when it's wet it's a big problem. We are working harvest CTF and the combine and chaser hardly mark the ground, it's the straw removal and muck spreading that do the damage. Just wondering if I might be better just chopping the lot and using compost as and when conditions allow. Another option would be gear up straw removal machines with LGP tyres etc.
Another thing I'm starting to find is that with the CULTAN system, quantity of straw/ac are lower resulting in less acres/year getting muck or more acres of straw required for the same acres of muck, leading to long term depletion of OM as muck would only be applied 1 year in 6, chopping would mean something going back every year.
Cheers.
SD.

Hi Stuart, I think you might be better off chopping unless you can get a CTF system going on your bale carting. As has been discussed before on this forum, CTF cultivations and drilling can be considered optional but I think that Harvest and straw carting CTF are absolutely essential. We have been running our cheap bale carting CTF system for two seasons now and i would never consider allowing a loader and grab on my stubbles ever again . ( see You Tube, CTF Baling )
We only bale winter barley straw and chop everything else. We have not got access to FYM so I buy compost to salve my conscience from selling straw. We spread this at 10 m centres on our CTF lanes fairly easily, I would have thought that FYM spreading would work just as well on 10m centres?

 

[SilliamWhale]

Hi Stuart, I think you might be better off chopping unless you can get a CTF system going on your bale carting. As has been discussed before on this forum, CTF cultivations and drilling can be considered optional but I think that Harvest and straw carting CTF are absolutely essential. We have been running our cheap bale carting CTF system for two seasons now and i would never consider allowing a loader and grab on my stubbles ever again . ( see You Tube, CTF Baling )
We only bale winter barley straw and chop everything else. We have not got access to FYM so I buy compost to salve my conscience from selling straw. We spread this at 10 m centres on our CTF lanes fairly easily, I would have thought that FYM spreading would work just as well on 10m centres?

Now I have completely the opposite experience (boring if we thought the same though )

With a few years no till I'm quite happy to let a loader and baler in my field and I get muck spreaders to try and go round and round to save tracking too much on the same ground but occasional random tracking doesn't seem to be an issue at all.

BUT I do think the moment you cultivate you lose some of the integrity from the soils ability to withstand the traffic with less issues. Apart from certain exceptions the more I leave things alone the better it tends to get.

 

[Hilly]

Chop it, anystock farmer embarking on straw for muck is foolish either buy the straw and get the goodness on your own farm or don't bother.

 

[Chae1]

I think Knockie keeps suckler cows also.

 

[Knockie]

How are the yields with the Cultan? Less straw but more grain, or more grain for less N?
I also think that with muck you are getting more than om etc, there must be trace elements there that we don't routinely apply. I have been using chicken litter for a while and there is more to it than just NPK. Unfortunately they are now sending it all for incineration!

Agree Colin, there's more to muck than meets the eye.
I'm very encouraged with the CULTAN system this year, still got 200ac of wheat and 500ac of spring barley to cut but here's a wee eg. of yields......170 acre block of Cassia WB averaged 3.75 tonnes/ac dried and a 200 acre block of Grafton WW averaged 3.88 tonnes/ac dried, both only got 140 Kg/ha of N

 

[Knockie]

Hi Stuart, I think you might be better off chopping unless you can get a CTF system going on your bale carting. As has been discussed before on this forum, CTF cultivations and drilling can be considered optional but I think that Harvest and straw carting CTF are absolutely essential. We have been running our cheap bale carting CTF system for two seasons now and i would never consider allowing a loader and grab on my stubbles ever again . ( see You Tube, CTF Baling )
We only bale winter barley straw and chop everything else. We have not got access to FYM so I buy compost to salve my conscience from selling straw. We spread this at 10 m centres on our CTF lanes fairly easily, I would have thought that FYM spreading would work just as well on 10m centres?

Yes Julian, I think I need to get something sorted out for CTF straw removal, as you say the Harvest CTF is the most important, what doesn't help is the fact that it's not ourselves who are shifting the straw.

 

[Knockie]

I think Knockie keeps suckler cows also.

Aye, we used to, they went a year past, we rent all the buildings and grass out now

 

[Chae1]

Aye, we used to, they went a year past, we rent all the buildings and grass out now

Bet you miss them!

 

[Knockie]

Aye, like a hole in the heed

 

[DrWazzock]

When I look at my DD stubble turnips, the ones in the chopped barley straw are stunted and struggling with the toxins and residue whereas the ones on the baled land are doing very well. From this angle I would bale every time. But some folk seem to manage well drilling into chopped straw. can't be zero till surely though. Probably more like a subsoiler soil mixed.

 

[H.Jackson]

lads here well chuffed out picking plastic and rocks( paving slabs) after compost