Death of Diesel Cars

cosmiccrofter · Dec 6, 2016

Now that the health lobby has declared war on diesel cars/vans, is it now time to return to petrol cars? Some of the diesel advantages, such as extra mpg/longer service intervals, have been eroded to some extent by increasingly good petrol consumption figures. Higher VED on diesels seem to be inevitable, along with perhaps more excise duty at the pumps, so would this perhaps steer buyers down the petrol route? I'm in the market for a small van, so I am seriously considering petrol for the first time in decades.

Headless chicken · Dec 6, 2016

But surely diesel can be made from plants etc and run off fats where as petrol is only refined oil? So a finite resource

bovrill · Dec 6, 2016

If they can just stick with banning us from London, and let us get on with life where the particulates don't accumulate, I could live with that.

In fact, I would probably be happy banned from any large built up area!

Yale · Dec 6, 2016

What you have to appreciate is when crude oil is processed through a fractionating column there are set proportions of petrol,diesel,kerosene etc.

If we use more petrol I believe the diesel portion would increase proportionally and be burnt anyway in another application,probably to produce 'clean' electricity.

Pasty · Dec 6, 2016

To be honest, we've gone back to petrol for the family car. Diesels these days are just too complicated and expensive to fix. Blew the turbo in our Sharan which damaged the engine, write off. Bill would have been north of 4 grand to fix. Drove through a puddle in a Seat and killed it dead as the air intake is about 4 inches off the ground in the front wheel arch to get around noise regs. In the old days, a diesel was what you wanted in a flood. Not so any more. Modern diesels hoover up water. A neighbour had killed his brand new Audi estate in the same puddle the day before. Same thing. Write off.

So we've picked up a nice Mazda with 28k on the clock and it drives like new. Plenty of power and more fun than a diesel. Doesn't seem too bad at the pumps either. I think the only way I would have a diesel now (aside from my 93 Hilux) is to lease one so it's someone else's problem if it goes bang. I would not spend big money on an out of warranty diesel vehicle I don't think.

fudge · Dec 6, 2016

Bit like Brexit this one, best to wait and see what government actually does. Ten years hence a developed country like the UK will only be allowing electric vehicles into urban areas IMO.

Pasty · Dec 6, 2016

Of course, the actual answer is electric cars and they are coming on stream now.

JWL · Dec 6, 2016

As a bit of an aside, weren't we allways taught that electricity and water doesn't mix? I'm going to be wearing my wellingtons at the next puddle if I see an electric car coming

Wastexprt · Dec 6, 2016

Pasty said:
Of course, the actual answer is electric cars and they are coming on stream now.

Which has interesting implications for the grid and our ability to produce enough power to power electric vehicles. :scratchhead:

SilliamWhale · Dec 6, 2016

The advantages of diesel aren't what they were. I think yes it is the beginning of the end for diesel cars

Campbell · Dec 6, 2016

Thought that fitting DPFs would restrain the nasty stuff [for now anyway]

Ley253 · Dec 6, 2016

Just wait a while. its already been publicised that electric cars produce more harmful pollution than petrol or Diesel! It doesnt come from the exhaust pipe though, so I suppose its all right! It comes from more general wear and tear due the the increased weight, much more rubber and brake dust plus road surface wear for a start,.and what do you do with the worn out batteries? They are not solely recharged from the local puff power(wind )farm either.

RobFZS · Dec 6, 2016

Hopefully they'll make a system cheap enough to catch all these cow farts, then i can run a car on that! Be one less thing for countryfile to moan about

beefandsleep · Dec 6, 2016

Pasty said:
Of course, the actual answer is electric cars and they are coming on stream now.

When there is a decent electric pick up I will get one.

capfits · Dec 6, 2016

Headless chicken said:
But surely diesel can be made from plants etc and run off fats where as petrol is only refined oil? So a finite resource

You can make synthetic petrol, Expensive for sure but has been done for years Germany and South Africa used it for various reasons. Petrol engines can run on ethanol without to many mods or even lpg.

Campbell said:
Thought that fitting DPFs would restrain the nasty stuff [for now anyway]

Particulates are only one issue, but a serious one all the same NOx, that stuff we use add blu for is also a serious issue.
IIRC I read somewhere that as petrol engines have increased in thermal efficiency by use of direct injection etc these engines also produce a degree of particulates and an increased amount of NOx.

It will be horses for courses.

Drillman · Dec 6, 2016

Ley253 said:
Just wait a while. its already been publicised that electric cars produce more harmful pollution than petrol or Diesel! It doesnt come from the exhaust pipe though, so I suppose its all right! It comes from more general wear and tear due the the increased weight, much more rubber and brake dust plus road surface wear for a start,.and what do you do with the worn out batteries? They are not solely recharged from the local puff power(wind )farm either.

Electric car refuelling is easy sorted. Just fasten one of those windmills on the roof. the faster you go the more electric it makes.

Don't know why it hasn't been thought of before................

Pasty · Dec 6, 2016

beefandsleep said:
When there is a decent electric pick up I will get one.

You would have thought it's the obvious vehicle to do with the load bed etc. Better get on to Mr Musk.

Pasty · Dec 6, 2016

RobFZS said:
Hopefully they'll make a system cheap enough to catch all these cow farts, then i can run a car on that! Be one less thing for countryfile to moan about

Here's what Tesla does with it's batteries.

https://www.tesla.com/en_GB/blog/teslas-closed-loop-battery-recycling-program

EV's are possibly a little heavier but the heaviest Tesla Model S is 2108kg to 1900kg for an Audi A6. Not sure how those compare or what is a better equivalent. Problem is that most 'studies' are heavily biased one way or another from the start so it's hard to get the truth.

JP1 · Dec 6, 2016

cosmiccrofter said:
Now that the health lobby has declared war on diesel cars/vans, is it now time to return to petrol cars? Some of the diesel advantages, such as extra mpg/longer service intervals, have been eroded to some extent by increasingly good petrol consumption figures. Higher VED on diesels seem to be inevitable, along with perhaps more excise duty at the pumps, so would this perhaps steer buyers down the petrol route? I'm in the market for a small van, so I am seriously considering petrol for the first time in decades.

What may concentrate the mind more is the stated ambition that cars with only diesel or only petrol engines will not be able to be sold in The Netherlands from (I think I remember 2025)

I see our own lot NIHCE have called for lowering of speed limits in urban areas to stop pollution. Easy, hey.

Seeing as the morons who approve road "improvements" have worked to short term Treasury payback "investment" rules and just caused chaos and that more traffic is stuck in (often un-necessary) congestion, they'd be better off calling for the immediate cessation of new road building and the retrospective improvement in junction design and other measures to prevent traffic jams. Examples include continuous exit and entry lanes at major junctions, drop lanes, "through only" lanes on key motorway interchanges

fudge · Dec 6, 2016

Ley253 said:
Just wait a while. its already been publicised that electric cars produce more harmful pollution than petrol or Diesel! It doesnt come from the exhaust pipe though, so I suppose its all right! It comes from more general wear and tear due the the increased weight, much more rubber and brake dust plus road surface wear for a start,.and what do you do with the worn out batteries? They are not solely recharged from the local puff power(wind )farm either.

In urban areas air quality is a big health concern. But out in the sticks diesels still take a lot of beating even from an environmental standpoint. Personally I think the government should go for differential congestion charges to promote electric vehicles rather than punitive Rises in fuel duty which punish rural users.

Death of Diesel Cars

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100% I’ve had enough of farming!

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