River Lugg, Herefordshire

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Steevo

Member
Location
Gloucestershire
1 hr agoBulldozing of Lugg riverbank 'may have stopped flooding'
11540835

By Carmelo GarciaLocal Democracy Reporter
The River Lugg in Kingsland pictured this week by Martin Williams.

The River Lugg in Kingsland pictured this week by Martin Williams

From Hereford Times on line.........

Never hurts to repeat things and keep up the reminders. :D

(also posted in post #1215)
 
Good point that. It would also contain reduced levels of pollutants when done more often.

Many pollutants come from motorway runoff draining into ditches. I bet that water contains plenty of oil and tyre rubber at times.....but once diluted by ditches it rarely shows up at sampling points. Do motorway drains have oil traps fitted?
The A419 through Glos. which was dual carriage wayed 20 plus ? years ago has oil traps all the way along. Whether they are emptied often enough and where that goes is another question.
 

Humble Village Farmer

Member
BASE UK Member
Location
Essex
....and when rivers overflow onto farmland and wash the topsoil away with them?
Flood waters generally slow down when they spread out and that's when you get sediment dropping out of the water.

I think most of our flood problems are caused by speeding the water up. It all arrives at once at the bottom of the slope.
 

Exfarmer

Member
Location
Bury St Edmunds
Flood waters generally slow down when they spread out and that's when you get sediment dropping out of the water.

I think most of our flood problems are caused by speeding the water up. It all arrives at once at the bottom of the slope.
if you dont get the water away , it has two effects, the land does not dry out and so has no sponge effect and secondly the water is still there flood even more when the next rain arrives
 

Ffermer Bach

Member
Livestock Farmer
When the EU waste directive came in the UK interpretation was that river silt became waste once the bucket had deposited it. It also has to be chemically analysed before work starts and if any contaminants exceed levels set in law it becomes hazardous waste.

Overnight this raised the cost of desilting projects around 5 fold in most places. Around here we stopped all rural desilting immediately and even clearing the critical channels in London became too expensive in many cases (all classified as hazardous thus having to be carted 70 miles to a licensed tip at Peterborough so only 1 load per lorry per day)

1 step forward, 3 steps back.
I have heard that before, typical of our civil service, they manage the screw up almost everything they touch, that is why one of the most dangerous sentences in the English language is "we will have to work to rule". If George Eustace's animal transport regs pass the consultation phase, he will do the same to livestock farming as our interpretation of the EU Waste directive has done for river dredging. I think part of the problem, is Civil Servants are almost never practical people, and they never ask advice of people who are before they think up their rules (often looking down on practical people too I think).
 

Ffermer Bach

Member
Livestock Farmer
True but once the top soil has gone it's no crop
I read that Italy was once full of deep soil, however how the Romans farmed caused it to be lost, hence why the Roman Empire kept expanding to gain new farmland to grow their crops. I believe farming started in Mesopetania (present day Irac), but I think the way the land was farmed, caused it to lose it's topsoil and end up as desert. Jared Diamond talks about civilisations failing through loss of topsoil.
1611400878937.png
 

Exfarmer

Member
Location
Bury St Edmunds
I read that Italy was once full of deep soil, however how the Romans farmed caused it to be lost, hence why the Roman Empire kept expanding to gain new farmland to grow their crops. I believe farming started in Mesopetania (present day Irac), but I think the way the land was farmed, caused it to lose it's topsoil and end up as desert. Jared Diamond talks about civilisations failing through loss of topsoil.
View attachment 935934
Not sure where you get your history from but Mesopotamia is still a very fertile region and we have a farmer from there, on this forum. It does indeed require water being very arid but that is lack of rainfall but the ancients put in canals etc which enabled them to grow crops in the region known still as the Fertile Crescent. The main issue may that water usage upstream has cut back the amount which regularly floods and enriches the soil by natural warping
 

Old Tup

Member
I read that Italy was once full of deep soil, however how the Romans farmed caused it to be lost, hence why the Roman Empire kept expanding to gain new farmland to grow their crops. I believe farming started in Mesopetania (present day Irac), but I think the way the land was farmed, caused it to lose it's topsoil and end up as desert. Jared Diamond talks about civilisations failing through loss of topsoil.
View attachment 935934
Must of been a heck of a depth before the Romans ruined it....remember watching a Fiat Crawler with a single furrow plough in Tuscany, ploughing one way down hill at around 18 inches to 2 foot deep.....all super soil coming up
 
I have heard that before, typical of our civil service, they manage the screw up almost everything they touch, that is why one of the most dangerous sentences in the English language is "we will have to work to rule". If George Eustace's animal transport regs pass the consultation phase, he will do the same to livestock farming as our interpretation of the EU Waste directive has done for river dredging. I think part of the problem, is Civil Servants are almost never practical people, and they never ask advice of people who are before they think up their rules (often looking down on practical people too I think).

we used to have mps and peers that made the laws who had knoledge and experience in every issue

but now we have career politicions and the like who have no previous usefull experience

the problem is that on every issue now all the views are made available with equal weighting so no concensus can be found other change nothing untill there is a disaster then it take years for the inquiry and the facts get lost in time

when the options are 50/ 50 or 30 30 30 which one is best in advance you have pick one and go with it
descision makers have to make the call and stick with it
prevent flooding or reduce environmentle damage
 

quattro

Member
Location
scotland
Heard the government praising the ea when will they realise there incompetent
as regard cleaning ditches I always remember they tipped it on the field same width as bucket
crops were probably better there than anywhere, these practices were done for decades why did they change something that worked
 

will l

Member
Arable Farmer
Heard the government praising the ea when will they realise there incompetent
as regard cleaning ditches I always remember they tipped it on the field same width as bucket
crops were probably better there than anywhere, these practices were done for decades why did they change something that worked
To make people who are incompetent in the real world with there pointless irrelevant degrees etc employable
 

Exfarmer

Member
Location
Bury St Edmunds
One problem today is that MPs give so much weight to experts who must have the relevant degree. A lifetimes experience counts for nothing. Anyone who has direct contact of high goevernment knows there is a complete trust in these experts and absolutely no weight given to anything else, unless there may be political gain.
sadly too the average Joe Public has little or no knowledge of the situation in the country side and believes that Packham , Monbiot et al are good minded people preaching from the side of the unprotected environment. Hence they get a huge amount of sympathy, and the farmers and villagers are treated as a bunch of yokels who really should move on and join in the latest craze of rewilding or some such.
 

quattro

Member
Location
scotland
One problem today is that MPs give so much weight to experts who must have the relevant degree. A lifetimes experience counts for nothing. Anyone who has direct contact of high goevernment knows there is a complete trust in these experts and absolutely no weight given to anything else, unless there may be political gain.
sadly too the average Joe Public has little or no knowledge of the situation in the country side and believes that Packham , Monbiot et al are good minded people preaching from the side of the unprotected environment. Hence they get a huge amount of sympathy, and the farmers and villagers are treated as a bunch of yokels who really should move on and join in the latest craze of rewilding or some such.
It needs someone to keep taking pics of the work done on the river lugg over a year or more, and keep posting it to show how everything comes back to how it was before
 

Bongodog

Member
The EA needs to be scaled back and its responsibility for river maintenance removed and placed with the County Councils. Then the victims of flooding can take their revenge at the ballot box. If County Cllrs were seeing their electorates homes flooding they would force their staff to dredge for fear of losing out at the next election.
 

TheTallGuy

Member
Location
Cambridgeshire
The EA needs to be scaled back and its responsibility for river maintenance removed and placed with the County Councils. Then the victims of flooding can take their revenge at the ballot box. If County Cllrs were seeing their electorates homes flooding they would force their staff to dredge for fear of losing out at the next election.
The problem with that is that the elected will only pander to the majority/biggest noises so will either result in totally inappropriate/excessive work, or the rewilding/pseudo greenie work - there will be no well considered middle ground.
 
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