Moneys been that cheap since we started aswell it’s going to take some time before it looks expensive.
Milk Price Tracker
- Thread starter rc mx110
- Start date
Farmer Keith
Member
- Location
- North Cumbria
Should you be including money borrowed against land in a debt per cow figure? It’s hardly relevant and a farmer in a tenanted situation wouldn’t be including it in their figures.
Still got be payed back with the cows? Personally I would.
Farmer Keith
Member
- Location
- North Cumbria
If I take £5k a month out of the farms current account and move it into the family’s savings account is that debt per cow? As owning land is not a necessity to dairy farm I’d treat it as a long term investment in the family’s future and separate it from the day to day costs of running a herd of dairy cows, I’d add it in at a rental equivalent for any costings done mind.
It’s not an issue here though, fortunately the farm is bought and paid for and expansion opportunity’s have been few and far between locally over the past 20 years I’ve been farming. That of course means me and @Martyn comparing debt per cow figures is a waste of time.
frederick
Member
- Location
- south west
If it's not the cows debt who's is it.the Tennant will be including a rent. Just the rent on financed land is 800-1000 an acre
frederick
Member
- Location
- south west
No you can still compare you just have to justify why your not absolutely rolling in cash if your not because if you remove his finance costs he would be.
Depends if you are in credit or not if using over draft then it still banks money the only difference in that is you still have it . You could put it back in to the farm account. So in that case probably wouldn't put in to a cost per cow.
But going back to the first question about land . If I brought x amount of land and had to borrow it I would include it in a per cow cost of borrowing cos it borrowed money. It has to be payed back.
Farmer Keith
Member
- Location
- North Cumbria
Not necessarily by a cow though, unless you’re dairy only and have no other income streams?
Just dairy. I am basing this on just farm income only
Farmer Keith
Member
- Location
- North Cumbria
That’s fair enough for you but I’d not include it, it can be paid for how ever you wish plenty of upland farms paid for by subsidy, sporting activity’s etc not the stock they carry. Interesting discussion all the same and explains why some carry debt in excess of £10k per cow and other carry none whatsoever.
More to life
Member
- Location
- Somerset
In a stand alone dairy farm of course borrowing to purchase land is included in cost per cow figure. Your kidding yourself if you don’t. Borrowing per cow is a pointless kpi tho.
Yes very true if 10k a cow but got other income streams then it very different story.
Was told by bank manager once 5/6k a cow is durable but 7k plus gets hard.
- Location
- somerset
oil tankers are already going around the horn of Africa, rather than the Suez canal, as are many other cargo ships. The risks of losing a tanker or container ship, are simply to great. The value of ship and cargo, are enormous. The knock on effect of that, insurance rates rocket, understandably so, if you can actually get it. If a tanker disaster, or any ship, occurs, the costs incurred in clearing up pollution etc, is massive, multiple ones, would cause problems with the investors, at Lloyds of London, you invest your money, draw your interest, till 'something' happens, and you, a) lose your money, and, b) are liable to cover the cost of any shortfall.
the knock-on effect, to the economy is two fold, a lot of rich people, suddenly are very poor, or bankrupt, not that l worry about that, greedy bustards, and secondly, the consumer pays the price, as it always does. Inflation will rise, energy costs will rise, etc etc. Another cost of living crisis, that would really feck things up.
15% of global trade uses the Suez canal, something like 60% of European trade uses it .........
Add in Somali pirates, Iran/straights of Harmuz, (spelling ?) Houti's etc. It is highly probable those shipping lanes will close, plus the cost of keeping a multi national fleet of warships there, to try and keep them open.
All the talk of WW3, isn't all hot air, but politicians, liberal thinkers etc, will ignore it, just like pre ww2. Serious politicians are needed, to avoid that, not to sure there are any.
Farming, extended trade routes, higher energy and insurance costs, will hit the cost of imported food, EU goods, are politically charged, so mired down in red tape, that is what it is. But if we can increase reliance on home production, because transport costs outweigh cheaper origin costs......
Where does that leave guv's greening subsidies ?????? Pretty obvious food production will take preference, the accepted mantra, 'we are only 4 meals away, from societal breakdown', will ensure that.
As long as some idiot doesn't go nuclear, for farmers, should be positive price increases, if food costs are to high, we return to the past, production subsidies, which partially cover the difference between production cost, and affordable selling cost, the consumer can afford to buy.
the previous generation of farmers, always said it needed a war to get farming profitable again.
the wheel always turns full circle.
US & UK support for Israel guarantees trouble, firing missiles at the Houthis is pointless & inflammatory, the Houthis only need to fire one rocket a week to persuade ships to go the other way & all the bloody US & UK missiles in the world won't stop that.
Yet again it's the US & UK that are the stupid sh!t stirrers of the world!
- Location
- somerset
that's fine, saying that, but there is no reliability in the price of milk, 7k might be fine in one year, 5k might be killing you the next.
done our share of borrowing, debt reducing every year. Totally agree with @lazy farmer zero is the target, achievable ? hopefully, nearly, perhaps.
at the Southwest dairy event, a few years ago, talking to a manager on the Lloyds bank stand, we had just converted a barn, to cubicle housing, she asked how much, per cow place, 2 or 3k ?, she couldn't get her head round £75, per cow. Its actually the healthiest cubicle shed we have.
- Location
- somerset
just heard on the TV, the UK hasn't had to defend its self in the last 50+ yrs, all the 'battles' we have had, in that time, we have attacked !
same person said, war is not inevitable, sensible politicians should be able to avoid it.
the words 'sensible politicians', scare me, not sure there are any.
- Location
- North West
Hopefully we are about to go from zero debt to the most in debt dairy farm in the UK
Kiss
Member
- Location
- North west
I’m sure there will be some others right beside you
Milkcow365
Member
- Location
- Sw Scotland
I think there’s fierce competition for that title
Chimera
Member
- Location
- North Wales
